Ladder Level...

[elcman]

I am not one prone to profanity... but F*CK YOUR LADDER LEVEL.

After the sixth time falling due to glitching wall paddles or, after losing them on a ledge, glitching handgrabs that would throw me backwards, for whatever reason. I'm taking a break. ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

While I didn't want to play that whole level again, I guess I'm going to have to after rage quitting. :(

[AK0]

put on Snake Eater

[Jimmy]

Originally posted by Cfish:

put on Snake Eater

Is that a confirmation you guys had that in mind when you came up with it?

I really love the ending myself, I'm a little surprised so many people seem to dislike it. I actually thought it was done to better effect here than in MGS3 and that's one of my all time favourite games.

[AK0]

Originally posted by Jimmy:

Originally posted by Cfish:

put on Snake Eater

Is that a confirmation you guys had that in mind when you came up with it?

I really love the ending myself, I'm a little surprised so many people seem to dislike it. I actually thought it was done to better effect here than in MGS3 and that's one of my all time favourite games.

It is the reference I was making when I designed that level yes. Also my overall design for the flow of all levels was to make the game feel like a rollercoaster and that ladder is the moment you pull into the station and have to get out of your seat.

[†๖ۣۜKrampus†]

Originally posted by elcman:

I am not one prone to profanity... but F*CK YOUR LADDER LEVEL.

After the sixth time falling due to glitching wall paddles or, after losing them on a ledge, glitching handgrabs that would throw me backwards, for whatever reason. I'm taking a break. ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

While I didn't want to play that whole level again, I guess I'm going to have to after rage quitting. :(

just use the gravity gun and aladdin your way up there.

[erby]

I fell like 3 times and the whole time I just figured that that was the point.
I also walked all the way there and had no idea about the segways the first time around.
I knew that this was probably the end and it was supposed to be struggle like finally reaching the tip of mt everest or something lol.

[Jimmy]

Originally posted by Cfish:

Also my overall design for the flow of all levels was to make the game feel like a rollercoaster and that ladder is the moment you pull into the station and have to get out of your seat.

I think that description doesn't give the scene quite enough credit. My experience was more nuanced than that. Although perhaps that's due more to my inexperience with rollercoasters :P

My experience was super reflective and felt quite heavy to me. I feel like the time climbing up was long explicitly to give the play nothing do to but contemplate the situation, reflect on what brought them here and to an extent what's pushing them forward.

I'd be curious how much thought was put into the length of the ladder. Was it mostly just an arbitrarily long ladder or in it intentionally in a sweet spot between so long people wouldn't every try and so short there wasn't enough time to really think.

[AK0]

Originally posted by Jimmy:

Originally posted by Cfish:

Also my overall design for the flow of all levels was to make the game feel like a rollercoaster and that ladder is the moment you pull into the station and have to get out of your seat.

I think that description doesn't give the scene quite enough credit. My experience was more nuanced than that. Although perhaps that's due more to my inexperience with rollercoasters :P

My experience was super reflective and felt quite heavy to me. I feel like the time climbing up was long explicitly to give the play nothing do to but contemplate the situation, reflect on what brought them here and to an extent what's pushing them forward.

I'd be curious how much thought was put into the length of the ladder. Was it mostly just an arbitrarily long ladder or in it intentionally in a sweet spot between so long people wouldn't every try and so short there wasn't enough time to really think.

I kept climbing it over and over until it felt 'right'

[atarumoroboshi18]

I had an awesome moment. I fell a couple of times on that, but the first time I climbed up I found the 2 wall magnets and had NO CLUE what they were. After falling for a couple of time I took them out and a bolt of lightning hit me on what they were and I used them to climb up everything I could see. Was awesome.

[bubbly = NAE]

it being a reference to snake eater throws out like, all the design theory that went into the original snake eater scene. I mean firstly climbing the ladder in MGS was easy and relaxing, it was a calm before the storm. Here it's insanely frustrating, it feels more like a kick in the ass out the door instead of a climax of the game. Secondly, you couldn't fall off the ladder in MGS unless you deliberately forced yourself off of it, meaning it was essentially a long relaxing corridor. I like the reference but I think it was intensely poorly thought through, in execution, maybe putting the climbing paddles at the bottom of the ladder or in an easier to access area? the climbing paddles are still difficult to use (in terms of physical exertion) but are a lot more reliable so it's intense instead of frustrating. I rly like the game, and the mechanics are obviously ground-breaking, but game design/level design was definitely the dump stat of the game

[Jimmy]

Originally posted by Cfish:

I kept climbing it over and over until it felt 'right'

Ha! that's definitely one way to do it. I've only done that climb maybe half a dozen times now and I certainly doesn't feel as high as it originally did. I bet it was tricky trying to keep seeing it with fresh eyes doing it repeatedly. As always, thanks for your insights, I (and I hope others) really appreciate the peek behind the curtain.

[AK0]

Originally posted by bubbly = NAE:

it being a reference to snake eater throws out like, all the design theory that went into the original snake eater scene. I mean firstly climbing the ladder in MGS was easy and relaxing, it was a calm before the storm. Here it's insanely frustrating, it feels more like a kick in the ass out the door instead of a climax of the game. Secondly, you couldn't fall off the ladder in MGS unless you deliberately forced yourself off of it, meaning it was essentially a long relaxing corridor. I like the reference but I think it was intensely poorly thought through, in execution, maybe putting the climbing paddles at the bottom of the ladder or in an easier to access area? the climbing paddles are still difficult to use (in terms of physical exertion) but are a lot more reliable so it's intense instead of frustrating. I rly like the game, and the mechanics are obviously ground-breaking, but game design/level design was definitely the dump stat of the game

I'm sorry. If it makes you feel any better I've decided to quit game development to start a pizza place.

[bubbly = NAE]

Originally posted by Cfish:

Originally posted by bubbly = NAE:

it being a reference to snake eater throws out like, all the design theory that went into the original snake eater scene. I mean firstly climbing the ladder in MGS was easy and relaxing, it was a calm before the storm. Here it's insanely frustrating, it feels more like a kick in the ass out the door instead of a climax of the game. Secondly, you couldn't fall off the ladder in MGS unless you deliberately forced yourself off of it, meaning it was essentially a long relaxing corridor. I like the reference but I think it was intensely poorly thought through, in execution, maybe putting the climbing paddles at the bottom of the ladder or in an easier to access area? the climbing paddles are still difficult to use (in terms of physical exertion) but are a lot more reliable so it's intense instead of frustrating. I rly like the game, and the mechanics are obviously ground-breaking, but game design/level design was definitely the dump stat of the game

I'm sorry. If it makes you feel any better I've decided to quit game development to start a pizza place.

Apologies if you're insulted I am tryin'a be constructive, dev time just went into other areas and it suited those other areas. I'm sure when it came to level design there was more focus on environmental consistency (an office looks like an office with every object it needs) and puzzles than combat situations/getting from point a to point b. Plus it was the last level of the game it'd make sense QA would be kinda rushed

[Turbo Man]

Dang, am I the only one that managed to climb it all in one go? I feel like a pro now

[Kyle]

Originally posted by atarumoroboshi18:

I had an awesome moment. I fell a couple of times on that, but the first time I climbed up I found the 2 wall magnets and had NO CLUE what they were. After falling for a couple of time I took them out and a bolt of lightning hit me on what they were and I used them to climb up everything I could see. Was awesome.

I found those magnets first time climbing, I knew what they were right away but I wanted to go to the wooden platform to climb, so I would fall there if I failed, but ironically I failed my jump and started falling between the platforms.

However, I managed to stick one of the magnets to the wall and save myself the trouble of climbing back again, felt really epic.

My hands were aching after climbing though because I use vive wands.

And btw, if you climb the last rombo-shaped building at the top, there's a little easter egg in the roof :)

[Takashi]

Originally posted by Turbo Man:

Dang, am I the only one that managed to climb it all in one go? I feel like a pro now :tdealwithit:

I also climbed it in one go.

Originally posted by atarumoroboshi18:

I had an awesome moment. I fell a couple of times on that, but the first time I climbed up I found the 2 wall magnets and had NO CLUE what they were. After falling for a couple of time I took them out and a bolt of lightning hit me on what they were and I used them to climb up everything I could see. Was awesome.

wait there are wall magnets in that level? where? I never found them.