Can't get over historical inaccuracy of Kassandra

[[RUS] Election Hacker]

I don't think this is a sexist thing at all, this is simly reality. I started the game initially as Alexios, but seeing how everyone is saying that Kassandra's voice acting is much better I decided to start a new game as Kassandra instead. However, after just an hour or so I can't get over how unnatural she fits in the game's world and time period, so even though the voice acting was a bit better I had to switch back again. For instance, that scene at the beginning when Kassandra was being trained by her father to fight just struck me as a complete historical impossibility. And yes, I do understand this game is not meant to be completely historically accurate, there are even mythical creatures, but it's supposed to be an imagination of the world according to the Hellenistic mindset, and this is definitely not something accepted in their culture, probably even today, let alone more than 2000 years ago.

[Demonsamura]

Originally posted by travleer33:

I would like to see the stats on how many chose to play SJW hero. They literally spent millions of dollars to include SJW PC.

Why is she a SJW hero? Because shes a woman? You saying women care maore about people than men do? THAT'S SEXIST!

[Spritetoggle]

Originally posted by travleer33:

I would like to see the stats on how many chose to play SJW hero. They literally spent millions of dollars to include SJW PC.

I'm sure you're trying to be insulting, but sir, you're an inspiration!

Kassandra is the beautiful, buff SJW hero this world needs.

I for one welcome our new lady-beefcake overlord.

[meep_meep]

If they wanted an SJW hero they should have let me play as Janelle Monae

[Spritetoggle]

Originally posted by Unquestionable Presence:

If they wanted an SJW hero they should have let me play as Janelle Monae

Only if she got to wear a suave, if totally anachronistic suit.

[Calamity Jess]

Originally posted by Dellicious:

Well Spartan women were supposed to be tough and had more rights than any other culture, (I think). We know that Spartan boys were trained from childhood, but in this instance you can use your head-canon and just assume Kassandra got this training because she has an important bloodline and her parents insisted she went through the Spartan training. Is this not viable?

+1

You don't even need to head canon it, since the game shows her getting unofficial training. So yeah, as a woman she couldn't go to the agoge where the boys are sent for official spartan military training. BUT she was raised by their best general, the wolf of sparta, and trained privately by him alone.

Sparta never trained women, historically correct.

Spartan father training his daughter at home? Noone is going to question him in Sparta or anywhere else, so again, keeping with the culture of the time.

Thus, historical acuracy is maintained as much as one can with wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff going on all over the place.

[Mujokan]

For one thing women trained naked in Sparta, that was one scandalous thing about their culture for other Greeks. You aren't going to see that in a game. But within Sparta you could not step out of line on anything, they didn't even have a normal family structure, it was a deeply bizarre society that's very hard for us to understand now. If you want to count the "historical inaccuracies" in this game it would be much easier to count the things that are actually accurate. Things like painting statues and seeing how the temples would have looked. It's about 1% of the game. That's without getting into all the magic.

[Escapist]

Originally posted by Spookytoggle:

Originally posted by Unquestionable Presence:

If they wanted an SJW hero they should have let me play as Janelle Monae

Only if she got to wear a suave, if totally anachronistic suit.

Spoilers: She does. Seriously.

[Spritetoggle]

Originally posted by Escapist83:

Originally posted by Spookytoggle:

Only if she got to wear a suave, if totally anachronistic suit.

Spoilers: She does. Seriously.

[Escapist]

Originally posted by Demonsamura:

Originally posted by holychair:

I totally agree. I am very sensitive to crude mistakes that show that devs don't even care the slightest bit, but this game does a really good job to balance history with fiction.

For all I know there were no female mercenaries in ancient Greece, just Herodotos reporting them elsewhere (in Scythia etc). But the fact that statues of Athena - one of the most famous, Athena Promachos by Phidias included - often depicted her in full battle gear shows that the concept of women as warriors was at least not unknown to the Greek and that's enough for me to accept it as a narrative device in the game.

Actually the only thing striking me as weird and immersion-breaking in Odyssey (as far as I got along in the game until now) is how Socrates is portrayed in the game. Perikles and Kleon are second on my "weirdo list" - they are both reported to have had extraordinary (albeit very different) oratory skills, but the game almost portrays them as fumbling and inept.

Kleon is a parody of trump. xD

I'm pretty sure he says that he's going to make Athens great again.

[herr_dechse]

Originally posted by travleer33:

Originally posted by Dellicious:

Well Spartan women were supposed to be tough and had more rights than any other culture, (I think). We know that Spartan boys were trained from childhood, but in this instance you can use your head-canon and just assume Kassandra got this training because she has an important bloodline and her parents insisted she went through the Spartan training. Is this not viable?

You really know nothing of Spartan culture.

The men were not allowed to marry until 25 and required to marry by 35. They were required to live in the barracks until that time. Their only option was to be a soldier. All other tasks were done by slaves. This is the primary reason their society collapsed. They ended up being outnumbered by slaves all the time.

Any girl receiving serious soldier training would have been viewed as a violation of some serious social mores. Women's roles were to be mothers and that was viewed extremely seriously.

Bull

[Mujokan]

This is what I am reading from Bertrand Russell talking about Plutarch, and he would know being a Cambridge professor.

Up till 20, boys are trained to be soldiers. You start military service at 20. After 20 you are allowed to be married. But you cannot live together till you are 30.

Until 30 you live in a men's barracks. You only become a citizen at 30. If you refuse to marry you are punished by the state. If you have many children you are rewarded.

Women are given the same physical training as men and they do it together, naked. This is so they will bear healthy children.

The constitution was really complicated. It was like a communist state supported by slavery and serfdom and so became very corrupt.

Aristotle said the women lived "in every sort of intemperance and luxury", and dominated their men. So much for all the alt-right incels who love the idea of Sparta...

[Silver Blur]

Originally posted by Mujokan:

This is what I am reading from Bertrand Russell talking about Plutarch, and he would know being a Cambridge professor.

Up till 20, boys are trained to be soldiers. You start military service at 20. After 20 you are allowed to be married. But you cannot live together till you are 30.

Until 30 you live in a men's barracks. You only become a citizen at 30. If you refuse to marry you are punished by the state. If you have many children you are rewarded.

Women are given the same physical training as men and they do it together, naked. This is so they will bear healthy children.

The constitution was really complicated. It was like a communist state supported by slavery and serfdom and so became very corrupt.

Aristotle said the women lived "in every sort of intemperance and luxury", and dominated their men. So much for all the alt-right incels who love the idea of Sparta...

How dare you use proper sources to invalidate this thread!

[Silver Blur]

Originally posted by holychair:

Originally posted by cjwasright:

I was actually quite impressed how there are no absurdities such as Plato or Alexander the Great appearing at the same time as Heracles and Achilles just to fit a general 'Greeky' theme. This wasn't the case in Titan Quest.

I do believe a certain element of historical accuracy is important because a huge reason why some people play these game series to feel immersed in ancient cultures and grandiose time period set pieces. As an avid afficionado of Hellenic culture, I have to say I was very much impressed with how this game stuck to historical plausibility at the very least. Most costumes and combat gear were period accurate (for example there was no lorica segmentatas or medieval style plate armor) although there were no doubt some mild, tasteful stylistic exaggerations.

Ancient Greek society, like most traditional societies, was patriarchal. In general, this game doesn't shy away from portraying it as such. However this patriarchy was not as absolute as a trivial reading would have you believe. In many cases written documents don't quite accord with archeological or philological conclusions. History was written by men and in general the importance and role played by women was downplayed. However we do have certain hints aiming at the broader picture of women playing a more active and avid role in society than extant sources let on, which in general follows suit with its portrayal in this game.

In ancient Sparta, as someone already mentioned,it was not unheard of young women engaging in physical exercise, sometimes in the nude with other men. I'm not sure if this extends to combat training, but I wouldn't entirely rule it outside the bounds of historical permissibility. In general Sparta was pretty lax with regards to sexual mores, however gender roles were delineated in large degrees by the institutionalization of violence and domination. Cassandra is a very masculine and assertive lady, to the point where she could easily pass for a boy. The story of a father teaching his daughter the ways of warfare is a very, very old literary device.

I totally agree. I am very sensitive to crude mistakes that show that devs don't even care the slightest bit, but this game does a really good job to balance history with fiction.

For all I know there were no female mercenaries in ancient Greece, just Herodotos reporting them elsewhere (in Scythia etc). But the fact that statues of Athena - one of the most famous, Athena Promachos by Phidias included - often depicted her in full battle gear shows that the concept of women as warriors was at least not unknown to the Greek and that's enough for me to accept it as a narrative device in the game.

Actually the only thing striking me as weird and immersion-breaking in Odyssey (as far as I got along in the game until now) is how Socrates is portrayed in the game. Perikles and Kleon are second on my "weirdo list" - they are both reported to have had extraordinary (albeit very different) oratory skills, but the game almost portrays them as fumbling and inept.

I think I remember something about Sokrates being so annoying with his never ending questions that literally no one liked him XD

On that regard, I think the game gets that spot on.

[Mujokan]

Originally posted by Silver Blur:

Originally posted by Mujokan:

This is what I am reading from Bertrand Russell talking about Plutarch, and he would know being a Cambridge professor.

Up till 20, boys are trained to be soldiers. You start military service at 20. After 20 you are allowed to be married. But you cannot live together till you are 30.

Until 30 you live in a men's barracks. You only become a citizen at 30. If you refuse to marry you are punished by the state. If you have many children you are rewarded.

Women are given the same physical training as men and they do it together, naked. This is so they will bear healthy children.

The constitution was really complicated. It was like a communist state supported by slavery and serfdom and so became very corrupt.

Aristotle said the women lived "in every sort of intemperance and luxury", and dominated their men. So much for all the alt-right incels who love the idea of Sparta...

How dare you use proper sources to invalidate this thread!

This is a book called History of Western Philosophy, I recommend it to everyone especially alt-right bros who think they own "Western Civilization".

[Demonsamura]

Originally posted by | Teclis |:

Originally posted by Ogami:

Well good for you, everyone should play the game like they want, thats the point of having a choice.
I personally prefer Kassandra by a lot but thats just that, my PERSONAL preference.
I dont quiet get this whole discussion, you cant "get over" Kassandra in the story, so just dont play her?
Problem solved.
UBISOFT already said that from now on any future AC game will have the male/female main character choice. Choice is never a bad thing, nobody forces you to play as a certain character if you dont want to.
I really dont see the problem here. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

i wanted the choice to use a shield... can i get that choice?.... no right... so ♥♥♥♥ chocies ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ is like.. ♥♥♥♥ you guys you play the game however we WANT you to play it..

this is Y rockstar makes Billions when they sell a game, cus they put IN what the community WANTS and likes... they don't "Remove" ♥♥♥♥ because it fits their own gameplaystyle.. no they improve upon the feature, that's why Ubisoft is complete garbage.. they don't care about their community and what they wanna see in these games... they only give a fk if you buy that season pass and spend money on the Helix shop, plain and simple..

YEA UBISOFT! YOU HEAR THAT?! ROCKSTAR PUTS SHIELD IN ALL THEIR GAMES!

#MYSHIELDMYCHOICE