Any Ghoul strats?

[SaiColors]

I found this minion really hard to use, I can't find a position in team for it.

The damage is not that good unless you stuck more buff/debuff on enemies, and she'll be in front of the team means she may take some hit, can only rely the dodge you need to maximum it by other minions increasing dodge chance or lower enemies accuracy. Or just simply use minions can guard her, but she'll moving around kinda annoying. For a over buff/debuff damage dealer Blood Phantom can do better job than her.

She can take off all blocks thats not bad, but vampire can do better this way.

Lot's minions can kill enemies under low % health/stress it's not a rare ability, and 25% is just too low. The ultimate can't deal damage itself it's actually hard to use.

Any suggestion for this minion?

[snuggleform]

She can recover a lot of wrath if you talent her ability that attacks your ally. It's not hard to get enough armor so that the attack actually does no damage to your ally. I sometimes use it to help spam heroic abilities like the headsman's instant kill, for example. Note that if you talent the ability this way, it gives up the health recovery bonus.

[White Shadow]

Oh yeah, she can be an excellent killing machine. I use her all the time and she was in my A-team for beating GAW difficulty (pre-DLC). Here are my suggestions:

1) For attributes, increase her attack and accuracy a lot. She gains those in big increments.

2) For the first skill - upgrade it to remove all blocks

3) For the second skill - either upgrade is ok, but I prefer to go for the crit damage increase. If you buff up her luck enough, she'll crit a lot. You can also ensure a crit with 'Fated' spell.

4) For biting an ally skill, I usually go for an upgrade to HP recovery. 50% HP recovery makes her very self-sustaining in difficult battles. Though as the poster above mentioned, for some strategies the wrath generation could be better and also that the damage to ally is very minimal if the ally has a lot of armour.

5) For her ultimate special, I prefer to go for being able to insta-kill enemies from 35% or lower health. This is an excellent finisher, because it doesn't care how much armour the enemy has or if they have blocks. This is so useful on all those high HP, high armour, and damage resist enemies that take forever to go down (looking at you, Floor 4 Wardens). Plus it also buffs her up in the process, making her stronger as the battle goes on.

6) I'd recommend to give her class specific item to her - the human leg which gives her one stack of Lunch Break from the start of battle. This is basically a stat buff and a free full heal you have in your disposal from the start of every battle.

7) For positioning, I start her in position 1 or 2. Since she has a high initiative, she would often go first or among the first, so you can use the de-block ability to take off a block from any chosen enemy. On the next turn, I adapt to what is happening, but oftentimes I bring her back to the front with her second melee ability.

8) She pairs up very nicely with a Vampire, as they can simply dance around each other. Can go nicely with a Skeleton too, as Skeleton can also use offensive abilities from any position. Plus the Skeleton can shield her. I often have her standing behind a Bone Golem. He can put blocks and wards on her if necessary, and if he is moved back, he can be brought forward either with his self-heal ability or with the Onslaught upgrade to his first melee attack.

9) If at any point in battle she goes low on health, you can use her digestion ability to quickly heal her entire HP, and this is a FREE action, so you can still perform an attack after it. Or if you don't have any stacks of Lunch Break left (rarely happens), then bite an ally with a high armour value and heal a tonne of health (50% with an upgrade).

[SaiColors]

Originally posted by White Shadow:

thx for long reply.

I just tried it with Ghoul, Vampire, Skeleton, Lost Soul, in more pain difficulty only

But I still feel lack on dps, need about 3~4 round to eat somebody (hit the 35% hp line)

and it's only in more pain difficulty.

maybe I'm doing wrong somewhere?

[White Shadow]

Usually it would take at least a couple of full turns to bring someone down to a low enough HP to eat somebody, especially early on when the eat threshold is 25% HP (it needs one of the upgrades to do it at 35% HP threshold).

Do you get lack on DPS for the whole team? What levels are your minions currently? And which floor are you on?

[SaiColors]

Originally posted by White Shadow:

Usually it would take at least a couple of full turns to bring someone down to a low enough HP to eat somebody, especially early on when the eat threshold is 25% HP (it needs one of the upgrades to do it at 35% HP threshold).

Do you get lack on DPS for the whole team? What levels are your minions currently? And which floor are you on?

I'm at third floor, my minions are around lv20

Enemy got bard at this level so I usually focus on bard first.

And yeah I feel my whole team lack on DPS now. Vampire and Ghoul are DPS dealer in this team, they hit like 30~40 damage (none crit) only.

[Wormgobbler]

I've always felt that the Ghoul is one of the most powerful minion in the game. She can pull out some insane DPS if you understand how to use her properly. Definitely one of my favourite minion.

There are three things you need to understand when using a ghoul:
1) she will move around a lot, so place her in a team that does not mind moving with her
2) always prioritise damage and crits over any other stats
3) pair her with a tanky minion that can regenerate - if the ghoul is low on health, just take a bite out of the tank to get full health again

My most powerful ghoul team is: Shade - Bone Golem - Ghoul - Ghoul

This dishes out some insane damage when paired with the Shade's ult. The Golem is just here to take hits, give shields to the gouls AND serve as a snack for them. Once the golem gets enough armor, the ghouls won't hurt him at all. The two ghouls themselves are just here to decimate the enemy - you may even kill a foe on turn one if both ghouls target him.

I beat GAW and higher difficulties with this setup.

[SaiColors]

Originally posted by Fossoway:

I've always felt that the Ghoul is one of the most powerful minion in the game. She can pull out some insane DPS if you understand how to use her properly. Definitely one of my favourite minion.

There are three things you need to understand when using a ghoul:
1) she will move around a lot, so place her in a team that does not mind moving with her
2) always prioritise damage and crits over any other stats
3) pair her with a tanky minion that can regenerate - if the ghoul is low on health, just take a bite out of the tank to get full health again

My most powerful ghoul team is: Shade - Bone Golem - Ghoul - Ghoul

This dishes out some insane damage when paired with the Shade's ult. The Golem is just here to take hits, give shields to the gouls AND serve as a snack for them. Once the golem gets enough armor, the ghouls won't hurt him at all. The two ghouls themselves are just here to decimate the enemy - you may even kill a foe on turn one if both ghouls target him.

I beat GAW and higher difficulties with this setup.

I haven't unlock bone golem yet, I do feel a self regen tank is a key here.

Right now I have to put Lost Soul to heal my tank.

btw I invest some point in evasion too, isn't it important?

And you said you put two Ghoul in your team, did you use her support ability buffing each other? or ignore that skill?

[White Shadow]

Originally posted by sidecolors:

I'm at third floor, my minions are around lv20

Enemy got bard at this level so I usually focus on bard first.

And yeah I feel my whole team lack on DPS now. Vampire and Ghoul are DPS dealer in this team, they hit like 30~40 damage (none crit) only.

Ah ok, so all skill upgrades should be possible by now.

30-40 damage seems ok for this stage. Definitely keep upgrading the damage attribute for both Ghoul and Vampire (Vampire's one goes up in even bigger increments). For the Vampire I'd suggest to make Returning Strike do the 90% of the damage upgrade rather than splitting it over 2 enemies. For the Ghoul, as soon as you get her class-specific item (the human leg), I'd equip it to her. That would buff up her stats from the start of every battle.

You can further improve damage-dealing with spells: 1) Infectious Lunacy is very good and can increase DPS of every minion by a good 20% at this stage already (and with Reaper in the party, you can increase Iratus' spellpower and get an even better bonus). 2) Fated is a great spell for when you want to guarantee a crit (good for Ghoul's offensive strikes and for Vampire's first attack which you can upgrade to either do a higher crit damage or stun the enemy upon a crit). 3) Destruction magic spells can also help to lower enemy health just enough to allow Ghoul to finish them off.

Also as Fossoway suggested above, Shade is a good teammate for Ghoul, because Shade's ultimate attack rips off 30% HP of any enemy (40% with an upgrade), regardless of enemy's max health, armour, or damage resistance, so you can bring enemies down to a low health quicker so Ghoul can finish them off. Just make sure to de-ward them first. You can also achieve the %HP damage with one of Vampire's attacks that rips off 30% of enemy HP.

[Wormgobbler]

Originally posted by sidecolors:

Originally posted by Fossoway:

I've always felt that the Ghoul is one of the most powerful minion in the game. She can pull out some insane DPS if you understand how to use her properly. Definitely one of my favourite minion.

There are three things you need to understand when using a ghoul:
1) she will move around a lot, so place her in a team that does not mind moving with her
2) always prioritise damage and crits over any other stats
3) pair her with a tanky minion that can regenerate - if the ghoul is low on health, just take a bite out of the tank to get full health again

My most powerful ghoul team is: Shade - Bone Golem - Ghoul - Ghoul

This dishes out some insane damage when paired with the Shade's ult. The Golem is just here to take hits, give shields to the gouls AND serve as a snack for them. Once the golem gets enough armor, the ghouls won't hurt him at all. The two ghouls themselves are just here to decimate the enemy - you may even kill a foe on turn one if both ghouls target him.

I beat GAW and higher difficulties with this setup.

I haven't unlock bone golem yet, I do feel a self regen tank is a key here.

Right now I have to put Lost Soul to heal my tank.

btw I invest some point in evasion too, isn't it important?

And you said you put two Ghoul in your team, did you use her support ability buffing each other? or ignore that skill?

Evasion is good too, but personally I think that early on it's not the priority. You must go all out with her. She's the personification of the saying "the best defence is a good offence". Why play safe when you can literally one-shot an enemy every turn?

Personally, I max out physical damage and crit, and only then I go for evasion. Also, get her personal item from the cultists, it's really good. It grants one stack of her meal which gives her a lot of stat bonuses (including some evasion).

Lost Soul has terrible synergy with the Ghoul. I wouldn't use them both on the same team.

As for the Ghoul's support ability, it depends on the situation. Some times you want to stall, or power up for the killing blow. But 90% of the time I do not use it.

[SaiColors]

Thx for all these reply.

I'm using Ghoul - Vampire - Golem now. Last position depend on situation using Lost Soul or Shade.

Shade is for fast % damage and Lost Soul for better sustain and Buff control.

Rites of Carnage + Lost Soul ult is a pretty strong combo.

With this spell Ghoul and Vampire easy over 50% crit I can finally feel the DPS.

Still theres some weakness, only Golem can break the stance, and has to be at first place. Enemy got guard with 40% damage reduction is kinda annoying.

[Sinister]

Pretty much Luck based items and abilties modifers. I use 2 on eternal harvest.

[White Shadow]

Originally posted by sidecolors:

With this spell Ghoul and Vampire easy over 50% crit I can finally feel the DPS.

Still theres some weakness, only Golem can break the stance, and has to be at first place. Enemy got guard with 40% damage reduction is kinda annoying.

That's great to hear!

Is that the Warden enemy on 4th floor that you're talking about? If so, then yes, they are VERY annoying, because they take a century and a half to go down. They have a lot of HP and armour and are resistant to all debuffs (including ignition). So against them, I find Shade's ultimate + a few more attacks + Ghoul's ultimate is the best strategy.

[SaiColors]

Originally posted by White Shadow:

That's great to hear!
Is that the Warden enemy on 4th floor that you're talking about? If so, then yes, they are VERY annoying, because they take a century and a half to go down. They have a lot of HP and armour and are resistant to all debuffs (including ignition). So against them, I find Shade's ultimate + a few more attacks + Ghoul's ultimate is the best strategy.

Yes they got really high armor, I have to stack luc and crit through it.

Crit really is the key for Ghoul team, they hit so hard now I don't even have the chance to eat.

[White Shadow]

Oh yeah. Ghoul crits are beautiful. Over 100 dmg, and at times even over 200 dmg if buffed up with appropriate spells.

[EatExcreteRepeat]

I don't bring a Ghoul without a Gruesome Snack.Just wait until you find cultists, make a ghoul, put the ghoul in the team to go to the cultist, collect your Gruesome Snack, and slap a brain on her to catch her up to level.

Without a Gruesome Snack, I find ghouls extremely mediocre. They run the risk of being killed in one round, and besides, you need to stress about keeping enemies alive for her to eat. With the snack, I find ghouls to be superior frontliners who can also strip blocks relatively painlessly and then deal heavy damage combined with some good debuff-applying backliners.