Questions about funshots

[MNEP]

Do they do something to the elemental damage portion of the weapon ?

I know that, for exemple, a decal that give 40% to slash and blunt will only give 20% if you have a slashing weapon that is 50% slash and 50% fire (DBSS in mind) does the funshot do the same thing, or does it boost elemental damage too ?

[MeYou]

only raw dmg , no elemantal

[MNEP]

Too bad there are no funshot for elemental damage, thanks for the confirmation

[Adult Human Chicken]

Originally posted by MNEP:

Too bad there are no funshot for elemental damage, thanks for the confirmation

I knew the answer my sis gave wasn't right but I'd never actually bothered to prove this before so I recorded this and ran the numbers real quick.

https://youtu.be/MBakDcmLFfs?si=w02zWxQSV6kUwxtR

Numbers below are first 11 hits (I wasn't doing this with any set number in mind when recording so I did a different amount for all 3 weps) excluding any back hits as they get a x1.2 damage bonus and would mess with the results if included.
Machete (4189 ATK) average damage
2206 + 2253 + 2179 + 2163 + 2263 + 2245 + 2233 + 2251 + 2234 + 2265 + 2180 = 24472 /11 = 2224.72

Beam Katana (5446 ATK) average damage
2936 + 2910 + 2824 + 2822 + 2844 + 2901 + 2842 + 2929 + 2811 + 2815 + 2832 = 31466 /11 = 2860.54

Fenrir (5845 ATK) average damage
3155 + 3045 + 3120 + 3124 + 3101 + 3047 + 3085 + 3045 + 3065 + 3148 + 3095 = 34030 /11 = 3093.63

So now we can compare the attack values and see if the differences in average damage make sense.
Machete: 4189 (100%) | 2224.72 (100%)
Beam Katana: 5446 (130%) | 2860.54 (128.5%)
Fenrir: 5845 (139.5%) | 3093.63 (139%)

The slight differences between Attack % and average % can easily be explained by damage variance skewing results (which was inevitable to some degree without a far more thorough test) and also the Machete's burn ticks degrading the target's armor causing its defense to be lower than it was for Beam Katana or Fenrir.

Now lets factor for what we should have seen if funshots worked the way decals do and only applied their bonus to the portion of the weapon that matched the damage type. We do this by dividing the funshot bonus from their averages if they worked that way.

32.7% /2 = 16.35%
Machete: 2224.72 /1.1635 = 1912.09 (100%)
Beam Katana: 2860.54 /1.1635 = 2458.56 (128.5%)
Fenrir: 3093.63 /1.327 = 2331.29 (121.9%)

Now with the numbers before us we can see that this doesn't match the attack difference of Fenrir or its average results at all.
Funshots apply their full bonus to weapons regardless of elemental percentage... Which leaves me wondering why the hell don't the decals work the same way?

[MNEP]

For the armor thing, with forcemen armor it would have been easier to test since they lose so little of actual armor value (but yeah the armor you have have the same % everywhere so hard to now)

I don't know if your math is correct, because if you have 100 base damage and you multiply it by 30% you have 130 but it you divide 130 by 30% you get 91, I know that in reverse you can't use the same percentage, did not go further I am not a math guy, since they shoved letters in I got out of it (I know it's dumb but whatever)

and I think your number show that funshot don't add to elemental, you lose way much more on fenrir than the other if you withdraw funshot, which should be a point for it ?

Or I did not understand anything because why not, or you are saying in the hypothetical, percentages don't match ? But they do aside from fenrir, because if it does have more value added from funshot because it's 0% elemental, obviously it will have the hugest drawback without no ?

[MeYou]

damn guess i was wrong again , figured it must work like the decals do , thanks for correcting and nice video showcasing it

[MNEP]

Since we can't turn them on and off, can we really understand how they work ? (in a precise way I mean, because if we can't isolate this variable, how can we be sure ?)

Because doing a new account with 0 funshot do some test with salvaged weapon, and then trying to have 10% and redo it while changing nothing, I don't know how we could do a better test, but that should be hellish to setup (maybe I am wrong, but I love on/off testing) aside from knowing all the damage formula obviously then you don't need that, or I must miss a ton of information ?
But I always did on/off testing on every game, are there weapons who don't benefit from funshot ?

[Adult Human Chicken]

Originally posted by MeYou:

damn guess i was wrong again , figured it must work like the decals do , thanks for correcting and nice video showcasing it

no worries sis. this game's mechanics make no ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ sense it's not your fault

[Adult Human Chicken]

Originally posted by MNEP:

Since we can't turn them on and off, can we really understand how they work ? (in a precise way I mean, because if we can't isolate this variable, how can we be sure ?)

Because doing a new account with 0 funshot do some test with salvaged weapon, and then trying to have 10% and redo it while changing nothing, I don't know how we could do a better test, but that should be hellish to setup (maybe I am wrong, but I love on/off testing) aside from knowing all the damage formula obviously then you don't need that, or I must miss a ton of information ?
But I always did on/off testing on every game, are there weapons who don't benefit from funshot ?

I did so much math right there proving they do

[MNEP]

I do not think they do, or I did not understood them, I just viewed hypothetical percentages of how it should work without but since we cannot toggle on and off, how could we be sure ?

I think you based everything on the percentages differences of everyone(those put in parentheses), but by applying different percentages, obviously it would not match, meaning fenrir don't have the (139% taking machete average as base) it would if you took 1.1635 which would have not make sense, but even in the fact that it did drop to 121.9 % is not a proof in itself of what you claim, because if you get much more bonus obviously you will lose as much if you lost them, so for me it kinda prove it ? But it's just hypothetical for me because we can play with percentages how we want and extrapolate things, but if we cannot isolate this factor, how can we be sure ?

Anyway I'll do an account with 0% funshot one day, I think it could be fun, but I obviously need to wait for winter, because those shroom will come in handy to repair broken armor and weapons, the real problem will be finding matching armor and weapon on both, obviously hoping they won't break on the defender for testing because if the bar is white, it means you did not unlocked it and it can break on defenses, just hope it does not for your own base test, I just don't know on which fighter * I should test it, if it's percent based I think everything can go, but I wonder

Maybe a 1/2/3* Attacker on a 5*/6* Defender could make sense (naked if possible so don't need to take armor into account) with obviously exact same stats on each fighters/defender

I am skeptical because I see developers as lazy, why should they change the decal formula and no just copy/paste the funshot formula or the other way around ?


Edit : The only thing that could be a proof is the first thing you did not the second, comparing the percentages from raw base VS average and they do match, meaning that it does apply the same bonus, at least if it does make sense, try with a warrior monk decal or the other one with 40% and see if there is a difference of percentages on those.

Because since we cannot toggle this bonus off, we can only base everything on raw damage on sheet from the weapon( because it's part of the formula) and real damage on target and look if the percentages are near or same, and this does mean it boost everything with the same percentage not taking into account the split, this make more sense to me, but I wonder if fenrir should have been used as base ? I guess it does change nothing.

Even using fenrir as base don't change nothing too much and the raw vs average do match too, this is proof right there, I got lost on your second extrapolation thing that did make no sense to me, I love being in tunnel vision and skip the point, lmao.

This mean funshot are more powerful than decals, and yes why is the formula on decals not the same ?