I've spent 12 hours trying to beat the first level EDIT: I did it! :D

[Kirth Gersen]

This game feels more like a puzzle. There must be a very narrow set of choices that will let you reach the last room with enough stamina and good cards to beat the level. Coins and loot are completely out of the question.

The only reason I keep going is because it feels like a puzzle and I believe other players when they tell me it can be done.

But it is hard. WAY harder (and more frustrating) than any souls game.

I've read serveral gudes (including one in this forum) that helped me reach the last room before exhausting, but I still need at least 3-5 more cards to be able to do enough damage.
Avoiding burning cards in a general way is not enough, it seems you gotta squize every last drop of oporrtunity or you're done. It's treacherously forgiving the first rounds with cards but if you don't play exactly right you're done way before reaching the last room.

Hopefully it will be just as rewarding given I don't give up skeleton.

*keeps trying*

[Artan]

I do not know what to say other than your just very wrong in your deductions! There are 6 starter classes and the game can be played with 2, 3 and 4 mercs. As such from those 6 there are a lot of different group compositions available and on top of that the enemies card draw order is random and will be different every time you leave and reload a mission.

With the number of different group compositions and varying enemy card draw order, you will find different group and different attempts all play out differently and so this eliminates the possibility of there being only a narrow set of possible 'plays' to beat a 'puzzle'.

I can only think that you have tried with 1 group set up and that you have hit 're-try' from the in game pause mission several times, as doing this will just re-load the same instance with the same enemy cards being drawn and this could have given you the impressions that the enemy turns are fixed and never change. If instead of re-trying you were to leave the mission and then from the non-mission map screen if you were chose the same mission and load back in again, you will find the enemies now have a different draw order on their ability cards and the instance plays out differently. You could also choose to add or remove a merc from your group changing it from 2, 3 or 4 mercs and this different group size will change the number of enemies and their layout in the scenario. You could also swap 1 merc for a different class and change the tools you gave available. All of these things will make the instance play differently make it clear that this is not a puzzle with a set solution.

Maybe it woud be useful to watch the video I posted a link to in a different but similar thread so you can see someone who knows the game well playing the first mission and by doing so you can maybe get a sense of how to play the game and manage your stamina and to land attacks and avoid receiving therm.

Good luck and have fun!

---EDIT---

https://steamcommunity.com/app/780290/discussions/0/4842023128330514593/#c4842023333102331301

Escrito originalmente por Artan:

Added a video from Mandatory Quest. he has a lot of GH videos on YT and he has a lot of high level gameplay videos. As such I would not suggest getting into his content until you know the game a bit better as he often plays on the hardest settings.

That said - he has this video from a few years back on the first mission on the Campaign - Black Barrow. it might be worth a watch to get some tips etc!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tK3k3kn1s1g

I would start with Campaign though and not Guildmaster which he talks about a bit at the start of the video.

I happen to have not played base GH in quite a while as the last time I played the game solo I played JoTL with the JoTL classes only and I also currently have a game in progress with an IRL friend and that is also JoTL! As such I recently started a run (yesterday) of base GH with 3 mercs - I have played GH with 2 and 4 but never with 3 and so this seemed like an good idea. I also typically start with a Brute and Scoundrel and pick extras afterwards and so this time I rolled my 3x mercs as Cragheart, Mindthief and Tinkerer. I played 3 scenarios so far (Black Barrow, Barrow Lair and Crypt of the Damned) and all 3 went fine! The fact I had a party sized I haven't played before and a merc selection I had not played before made the run very different to other I have done on other play through.

[Kirth Gersen]

Hi, thanks for the input. I am currently using a party of two. I've tried Thinkerer+Cragheart, Mindthief+Cragheart and Brute+Cragheart all with similar results (brute+craigheart being the least successful), I am clearly mismanaging the stamina, but it's not easy/intuitive to manage it properly, beyond managing stamina and avoiding damage you need to play the exact right combination of cards to win because otherwise it is not enough, the combinations that lead to defeat are way WAY greater than those that lead to success, at least it looks like that to me as a beginner.

I am going to devour that video that you shared. But it will be another hour and a half on top of 12, to beat the first level. XD

[Artan]

It sounds like you have not got card management and stamina worked out yet and that as such you are likely burning cards too early and as such having stamina issues later on and running out of cards. You are not alone though and this is something not well explained in GH! When a scenario starts, you have no idea how long it will go on for! Sometimes you might be able to get a sense by the floor outline of the not yet opened rooms. Burning cards means you can never get them back and this massively reduces the possible number of hands you can play. As such you need to think about how long you might need to go on and to be conservative with burns cards until you have an idea that you have enough stamina to get to the end. From there you can then burn cards safely in the knowledge that you have the Stamina to get to the end!

I am at work right now and so I cannot really type up a full explanation of cards, stamina burn cards and re-usable cards! As such I will have to link another video from Mandatory Quest! I have not watched this yet and will now as I work, but I trust him to explain well and he is a GH master!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hlS8NVWIY0&

Hopefully MQ can explain it all in this vid! Good luck :)

[Ked]

Play with brute and scoundrel, dont bother with other classes until the game start clicking.
Avoid damage as much as possible, and understand how iniative works and how you can get advantage of it.

[mcslave198]

Kirth, you're absolutely right that there's a lot of ways to mess up and lose in this game. I remember the first time playing GH in person with friends (who are all experienced strategy gamers) and only barely beating the first scenario by the skin of our teeth. That said, the game is absolutely beatable pretty reliably, even on higher difficulties.

We don't know exactly how you're playing, so it's hard to say exactly what you're doing wrong. All we can offer is general advice. Here's some of mine:

- Try to avoid attacks from monsters. After cards are selected, count how many tiles the monsters will move and determine if you can position yourself so that you get hit by fewer monsters (while still hopefully dealing damage yourself)

- Have your characters focus their attacks on one monster at a time, and prioritize finishing any low hp monsters off. A monster at 1hp still deals full damage, after all. An exception is wounded monsters at 1hp, who will die before taking their action (unless they get healed by something else).

- It's usually not a bad idea to focus on playing cards that disable monsters somehow. For instance, the Brute has a card that disarms (Provoking Roar), the Tinkerer has a stun (Stun Shot), and the Cragheart has Earthen Clod which can immobilize.

- If you want to get fancy, try having a character go invisible (Mindthief using Into the Night or anyone using Cloak of Invis item) and stand in a doorway/chokepoint, or have the Cragheart drop some obstacles (Avalanche) to limit potential avenues of attack. These tricks can effectively disable monsters for a turn or two.

- Along those lines, there are very powerful items that can disable enemies for you. The Warhammer in particular is available from the very start of the game and is super good with Cragheart's Unstable Upheaval (and Brute's area attack cards). The stamina potion can let you recover one of your disabling cards from discard, letting you shut down a monster for another turn.

- You usually don't want to play healing cards while there are enemies still around. Healing instead of attacking during fights just stalls needlessly - you *need* to damage enemies to actually finish fights quickly. Heal when you're just moving towards a door, or while you're picking up loot. A heal action on the bottom of a card lets you heal *and* attack during the same turn, which is pretty efficient, so keep an eye out for opportunities to do so.

- You usually want to go before enemies in the turn order, since that lets you move around (or run away if need be) to avoid enemy attacks, and kill monsters before they get a turn. Remember that you only need to play one early initiative card to go early in a turn. I often pair an early initiative card with a late initiative card (making sure I'm using the earlier initiative) so that I have more early initiative cards available for future turns. Of course there are situations where you actually want to go late, but that's a bit more advanced.

- Don't burn cards to avoid damage unless you are about to die (or just took a big crit for 10 damage or something). If you find yourself burning a lot of cards due to imminent death, you probably made a mistake.

[Kirth Gersen]

I did it guys. I finally managed to enter the right mindset.

How I did it:

1. Identify all actions that would burn the card and DON'T use them. Pick only the default actions in those cards (attack2/move2 small buttons on the sides) or the other non burnable top/down action when available.
1.5 Prioritize having a lower initiative. Quadruple check you selected the lower initiative correctly.
2. As much as possible use only non burnable actions.
3. On small rooms use hit and run strategy
3.5 Use obstacle creation ability to defend other characters more than yourself
4. On large rooms use decoy/invisibility and long walk/attack
5. Before opening the door use remaining cards to walk over traps, heal or activate multiple turns abilities.
6. Before opening doors perform Long Rest (and always use Long rest if possible)
7. Last room go nuts using all the burnable abilities

I managed to complete the 1st room without burning any cards. Second room I burned 1 at the beginning an 2 at the end to grant me multiple round abilities. 3rd round seemed A LOT easier now. Could only loot 1 coin by accident.

Thank you for the input.

https://pasteboard.co/m2ymgsR5ebA1.png

Characters used: Tinkerer + Cragheart
https://pasteboard.co/miDQ6EQa2Xlc.png

PS: Went back to Gloomhaven, helped someone and got bad rep. fakk lol
PS2: I see you can build your deck clicking the "two cards" round button over the character on the party info on the left. For Tinkerer changing Stun Shot for Reviving Shock seems like a good deal!

[mcslave198]

Nicely done Kirth! It sounds like you're picking up on some of the general strategy. Buckle up for scenario 2 - it's one of the hardest in the game. After that things get easier as you start gaining levels and money. And yea definitely take a look at your characters' cards since some of the default cards kinda suck. Good luck!

[Artan]

Congratulations! I am so glad as GH is really a great game one it all makes sense and you start to feel in control of the game! Good luck with the rest of your adventures!

[warrickbartley]

Also a newbie and was struggling to understand the games mechanics, i think the best way to approach it is to treat it more as a game of chess where you need to evaluate every move how many squares can you move, what can you attack is it safe are you shielded in some way, is the trade off worth it .
Its not like a traditional RPG its certainly a different kettle of fish than any other ive played and harder to learn

[dreamstation]

Escrito originalmente por Kirth Gersen:

I did it guys. I finally managed to enter the right mindset.

Thanks for the tips. I've tried several times to beat that first mission and it just didn't seem possible. I have read that it gets easier but that it is still possible but I just couldn't see it. Hopefully with your tips I manage to do it because I want to play the game (bought it at release) but just haven't been able to succeed.

[Kirth Gersen]

Escrito originalmente por dreamstation:

Escrito originalmente por Kirth Gersen:

I did it guys. I finally managed to enter the right mindset.

Thanks for the tips. I've tried several times to beat that first mission and it just didn't seem possible. I have read that it gets easier but that it is still possible but I just couldn't see it. Hopefully with your tips I manage to do it because I want to play the game (bought it at release) but just haven't been able to succeed.

Good luck. Keep us posted.

[UdderJuice]

I played this back when it was first released and found it to be very unforgiving in that if you made one wrong move you were totally screwed and would fail the scenario. Been meaning to come back and see if the toned down the difficulty but it sounds like they have not.

[Artan]

Escrito originalmente por UdderJuice:

I played this back when it was first released and found it to be very unforgiving in that if you made one wrong move you were totally screwed and would fail the scenario. Been meaning to come back and see if the toned down the difficulty but it sounds like they have not.

This is a computer game version of a board-game and it adheres to the board-game and it's rules. The digital version already includes an easy difficulty mode that has everything turned down to super easy and this mode is easier than the easiest difficulty option in the board-game! Any changes made to the games difficulty beyond this would make GH Digital fail to be true to the board-game and defeat it's purpose for existing!

Have you tried playing on the easiest settings the game offers or are you playing on a higher difficulty, finding that too hard but being to proud to lower the setting?

Good luck and have fun!

[Kirth Gersen]

I found "easy" mode to be just as hard as "normal". The AI plays just as relentlessly.

[mcslave198]

The funny thing is the monster actions aren't controlled by any kind of AI. There's no decision making behind them. Actions are picked randomly by drawing a "monster ability card," and all monsters simply act according to some predefined rules (like, move towards the closest hero, initiative breaks ties, that sort of thing). And yet, despite that, oftentimes monsters will do the ONE thing that screws you over, like going really early, or healing each other's wounds, or drawing their best attack over and over. Even though "act randomly" sounds like a bad strategy, the unpredictability can really cause problems for the player.