Bandit update makes no sense

[Sleya]

I played a few hours the bandit update and im totally confused what CA did here. First... they ripped out every piece of industrial and "smart" buildings and left over 3-4 Buildings i can build the other are useless. Why?

All the buildings increasing the industry by some amount of % is nice... but 0 multiplied with 150% is still ZERO. I can build them because they look nice... wow... CA good job.

Even in the new "super" tech tree i found a tech who just gives me industry... AGAIN WHICH INDUSTRY? I DONT HAVE ONE! But whats about the mines? Well... you cant properly use them because... you cant upgrade those. You need to convert them to bandit buildings... And they generate income through robbery... What the hell... The general income is decreased to make it more bandit like... Or more like a chaos light faction with settlements. Its absolutely no fun to play and its stupid... Zheng Jiang was my favorite faction... Well... seems like i have to play 1.4.1 to have a better game. Thanks CA

Other things... You cant recruit normal units because of... we are bandits and cant buy proper equipment and can train soldiers like any other factions? Gosh...

You lose replenishment with high public order... You know how hard it is to get low public order without buildings to drop public order? Yeah... you dont have buildings to kill your public order. No more recruitment center or tax collections... you are a bandit... you dont take taxes.

FFS... Why killing this faction? I want to play as a non fancy faction with no titles and no names to be a warlord like the other... not some monkeys without anything. I liked how Zheng Jiang was intotruced... but i hate what it became...

[RCMidas]

The industry boost building is only meant to be built in places where mines are present. They are industry. The core settlement still provides that income, and you get a SECOND building there to use.

[Kraivathin]

At least the only thing I wouldn't trade off with this new bandit system is the loot though. My main is Zheng Jiang too. So many times at the start of 194 campaign that I sit there and watching as Liu Bei struggle to take Dong (Zang Ba's city) just because of running out of military supplies, while a bandit like me can walk from far east China to the west edge without having to worry about supplies at all lol.

For buildings, that's why at least for me, I only take minor settlements for myself, and gift all the Cities to my contractor as a mercenary. Since now Zheng Jiang is not fit with city building anymore.

[Drama Llama]

Originally posted by RCMidas:

The industry boost building is only meant to be built in places where mines are present. They are industry. The core settlement still provides that income, and you get a SECOND building there to use.

I've found even with the mining settlements they still don't produce industry for some reason? are they giving industry income for you?

[Sleya]

Originally posted by Drama Llama:

Originally posted by RCMidas:

The industry boost building is only meant to be built in places where mines are present. They are industry. The core settlement still provides that income, and you get a SECOND building there to use.

I've found even with the mining settlements they still don't produce industry for some reason? are they giving industry income for you?

They dont! Thats the problem... You have to convert them to your own faction buildings to benefit from them... All the industry buildings like military smith (playing not the english version sorry) or the private workshops are pretty useless because they boost nothing.

@CA this is not just bad game design... this is the worst game design i ever saw in any strategy games ever!

[Darklordnj]

Originally posted by Sleya:

Originally posted by Drama Llama:

I've found even with the mining settlements they still don't produce industry for some reason? are they giving industry income for you?

They dont! Thats the problem... You have to convert them to your own faction buildings to benefit from them... All the industry buildings like military smith (playing not the english version sorry) or the private workshops are pretty useless because they boost nothing.

@CA this is not just bad game design... this is the worst game design i ever saw in any strategy games ever!

Actually you don't have to convert them if they're Han. Bandit buildings are a bit weird and unintuitive in that, while Banditry is your primary source of income, and it's good to convert to the bandit buildings that you can work up, late game, once you start capturing tier 4 and 5 Han buildings, you don't have to convert the as they still produce income for you (this is generally where stuff like industry income multipliers start really taking effect)

(it just kinda leaves a weird u can convert this mark, which can bother some people)

[JuX]

Bandits are incredibly strong faction now. Doesn't take too long until they march with incredibly speed steamrolling everything on sight with their broad and strong unit selection.

Not to mention the espionage which is absolutely overpowered. They are effectively winning entire wars for you.

While the industry buffs and such are little strange, but when you reach mid-game. Then you probably don't want to convert enemy buildings as much. Doesn't matter if you can't upgrade them if the bonuses are high enough.


Only issue iv had with bandits is the fact when your army becomes strong, then you are unlikely consume enough loot then you're passively getting, so can drag down your movement speed bonuses.

[Sleya]

Yeah you can keep the Han building but why the hell cant i use the mines like... mines? I have to wait for some non monkey faction to make the buildings i want. This is such a stupid design and reduce your round income to a minimum.

[Darklordnj]

Originally posted by JuX:

Bandits are incredibly strong faction now. Doesn't take too long until they march with incredibly speed steamrolling everything on sight with their broad and strong unit selection.

Oh yeah, definitely, their economy is a bit weird, but once you figure a few things out it can get crazy good, like turns out the distribute the loot multipliers stack (my Yan Baihu campaign, I was temporarily able to get a province to generate almost 100 food from like 3 armies distributing the loot)

[Drama Llama]

Originally posted by Sleya:

Originally posted by Drama Llama:

I've found even with the mining settlements they still don't produce industry for some reason? are they giving industry income for you?

They dont! Thats the problem... You have to convert them to your own faction buildings to benefit from them... All the industry buildings like military smith (playing not the english version sorry) or the private workshops are pretty useless because they boost nothing.

@CA this is not just bad game design... this is the worst game design i ever saw in any strategy games ever!

ahh i see that makes sense!

[Sleya]

Originally posted by Darklordnj:

Originally posted by JuX:

Bandits are incredibly strong faction now. Doesn't take too long until they march with incredibly speed steamrolling everything on sight with their broad and strong unit selection.

Oh yeah, definitely, their economy is a bit weird, but once you figure a few things out it can get crazy good, like turns out the distribute the loot multipliers stack (my Yan Baihu campaign, I was temporarily able to get a province to generate almost 100 food from like 3 armies distributing the loot)

Yeah you can boost through share the spoils... but the downside (as far as i could test it) You can do it 2 maybe 3 rounds before the troops deserting your army because of lacking supplies and the regenerate rate in own territory is very low. Also... the high economy buildings are not in the front line more 2-4 cities behind it. So it still not that usefull sadly.

One or 2 things are great yeah... but... the other side of the coin is really really bad... Its not a good new system. Its like someone had an idea but 19 other people also had an idea and no one looked what the other guy already did.

[Darklordnj]

Originally posted by Sleya:

Originally posted by Darklordnj:

Oh yeah, definitely, their economy is a bit weird, but once you figure a few things out it can get crazy good, like turns out the distribute the loot multipliers stack (my Yan Baihu campaign, I was temporarily able to get a province to generate almost 100 food from like 3 armies distributing the loot)

Yeah you can boost through share the spoils... but the downside (as far as i could test it) You can do it 2 maybe 3 rounds before the troops deserting your army because of lacking supplies and the regenerate rate in own territory is very low. Also... the high economy buildings are not in the front line more 2-4 cities behind it. So it still not that usefull sadly.

One or 2 things are great yeah... but... the other side of the coin is really really bad... Its not a good new system. Its like someone had an idea but 19 other people also had an idea and no one looked what the other guy already did.

Ooh, no wonder you seem to be having trouble. So, here’s the thing, with bandits in the early game, you’re earning money in bursts through combat, mercenary contracts you’ve chosen (as in you’re already at or planning to got to war with x guy, so you made a deal with someone for it) and sharing the loot. The other two are straight forward (and where you earn like 60-75% of your income) sharing the loot is where it starts to get complicated. It’s a limited stance as you’ve mentioned, good for one or two turns, but it’s an awesome one all the same. As a breakdown, the stance gives a large replenishment, a bit of satisfaction, and 300% to banditry stuff (basically your faction Econ, they don’t have super high base, but you can pull some really good multipliers with them that actually make them a lot better than initial Han stuff). So a few trick to maximize the use of this stance is to: immediately (as in turn of) after taking a settlement for yourself, pop out of the settlement and switch to this stance for e-z replenishment and maximizes income generated; cycle your armies when at “peace” have one or two distributing loot in your province at the border of a planned or current enemy and another in raid stance in said enemy to replenish lost loot and then switch places as they armies gain and lose loot so you never actually start taking attrition and keep things constant (you can split up an army for this, should still act the same as 3 full armies doing it).

So I mentioned early game your economy happens in bursts, right? This means you don’t actually try to have positive income, you’re just trying stay neutral, maybe gaining100 or losing 150 a turn, doesn’t really matter which, as you should maintain a decent stockpile of cash reserves (like 3-5000, maybe more depending on circumstances). For the most part, you’re switching between two economies, 1st is acting as a merc, where your armies are fighting enemy armies and taking, sacking (for a cash lump sum) or gifting (for cash lump sum plus contract points) settlements, dumping loot mostly happens only after combat for replenishment. 2nd is “peace” time, where your armies aren’t as engaged, you’ll be cycling your armies in the method described above. Bandit building are very good defense-wise, so you only need to upgrade periodically when your flush with cash.

[JuX]

Originally posted by Sleya:

Yeah you can boost through share the spoils... but the downside (as far as i could test it) You can do it 2 maybe 3 rounds before the troops deserting your army because of lacking supplies and the regenerate rate in own territory is very low. Also... the high economy buildings are not in the front line more 2-4 cities behind it. So it still not that usefull sadly.

One or 2 things are great yeah... but... the other side of the coin is really really bad... Its not a good new system. Its like someone had an idea but 19 other people also had an idea and no one looked what the other guy already did.

As i mentioned earlier you can share the spoils forever until you die. It has a base value and as result you can surpass it by increasing your passive loot gain to a point you are gaining more loot then your throwing away. Doing this has only downside which is the maxed out loot penalty and in return you gain ton of replenishment and income.

Bandits can make ton of everything the more resource settlements you own. To balance that out the bandits can't capitalize the major settlements on their own. If they could then they would virtually have no weaknesses whatsoever.

It's bad enough their espionage is broken beyond belief. You can pretty much turn every regular court member in to a turncoat as you spam discontent among their ranks.

[Too Much Salt]

TLDR but if you have problems with bandit's economy, you probably need to replay a few times and do a bit of research.

Bandit faction is one of the easiest faction to play and their economy is quite crazy if you get it right.