Call me stupid but i can't work out how to play Lu Bu or Sun Ce in the new DLC.

[Valkurm Emperor]

Sun Ce i have tried a few times.

Stick with Yuan Shu and enemys to the south are too strong, not enough money for a bigger army. Or try and complete my starting commanderie, 1 or 2 turns later Yuan Shu forces peace not letting me take the 2 villages i need.

Go against Yuan Shu and im at war with some one way too big at the start.

As for Lu Bu i just tried him and i don't know what to do. Head south and run into all Cao Cao's armys.

Go north and try and take some territory and still have Cao Cao up my butt ready to show me whats what. Either way no money for more troops.

[darrennija3535]

For Lu Bu, maybe one way u can try is to ask someone to be ur lord. that way they can protect you while u try to find ur feet (Sacrificing gold but gaining a foothold). In my last campaign before the crashes kept on happening, I was Liu Bei and I befriended Cao Cao from the get go, it took alot of coins, ancillaries, and concessions, but i managed to get Cao Cao on my friendly side. Went up North to the Yellow River, then came back down to finish off Yuan Shu. I think generally, it would be easier for you to befriend a rival by forming alliances with other factions that surrounds the rival faction. For example, I befriended Li Jue so Cao Cao couldn't really make a move on me. I stimulated this theory on two similar scenarios, same era, etc so It works I guess.

[Puvanat]

I tried Sun Ce few times and got lucky one time, don't give the artifact - they declare war - get my friend back as mission abort - recruit army till full - take nearby city (I think they're Yuan Shu vassals) and somehow when Yuan Shu arrive, he's not at full strength and I can win the fight. From then on, it quite easy.

As for Lu Bu, best to go with Liu Bei and create your power before (if needed) betray him.

[Tipsy]

It is advisable to rebel against Yuan Shu on his second attempt to swindle you off of your resource (Lu Kang's lands) I personally marry Lady Wu with Yan Baihu's brother Yan Yu using the Seal as payment to get that broken combat skill Mend which lets you turn the game into an RPG-RTS instead of relying on multiple units in your retinue to carry the fight. Once you do rebel against Yuan Shu it's easier to let him fight you on while on the defensive as the town you've confiscated from Lu Kang has multiple chokepoint-killzones to trap and flank with.

Also with getting Yan Yu through marriage; Yuan Shu skips harassing you for the seal on the first time because it's no longer with you. The first turn of any new campaign is always crucial because it lets you find out which ancillaries you can trade with and which ones will be the greatest benefit for your early game.

[Psycho Drive]

@Valkurm Emperor For Lu Bu, his entire mechanics is focus on defeating enemies while rewarding player with troops replenishment and map movement. If player is not aggressive to fill his resources bar, the negative penalty will kill his economy and officer satisfaction.

Here's some recommended steps (tried on Very Hard):

The plan is to conserve as much troops as possible then turn back to remove Cao Cao's threat from Chen City. Wiping out Cao Cao early helps remove one powerhouse from the map, and central plain cities are all rich in food supply, which can be sale for cash per turn. You will also complete many of Lu Bu's kill list milestone, which will give permanent bonus.

TURN 1 = Do admin and divorce your useless wife and make a trade package with Liu Chong to marry your ex-wife with Luo Jun. Throw in some useless items to sweeten deal (squeeze for cash payment or per turn if possible), main point is Luo Jun will give you better bonus as heir. Dismiss the other generic green general on your list to save some cash, then send the red general to scout and recall as spy, you want to discover as many faction as you can.

Do not Auto-resolve first two Xiahou brothers battle, all you need is use Lu Bu duel and you will win 100% (minimize own troops casualty to almost ZERO). Always fight NIGHT BATTLE to reduce AI morale at start. Move Chen Gong nearby fights as his AOE helps to debuff AI Generals during duels. The enemy troops can easily be routed with cavalry charges or bow men. Always choose to execute Xiahou brothers because we do not want Cao Cao to redeploy them later. After you destroyed Xiahou Yuan, choose maintain momentum and move back Chen City. Try to land on a spot near edge of your territory but keeping exactly 20 supplies enough to set ambush.

TURN 2 = When Cao Cao siege Chen, you will lose no matter what, so just use auto resolve to easily burn his 400+ troops. After 1 turn, we will reclaim Chen so its a small price to pay. Because you set ambush, Cao will think that your last camp is empty and will march north. Set your stance to normal and engage night battle to Cao. This 1/2 of the main battle you need to win to execute the whole plan.

In the battle, because of guerrilla deploy, you can easily set Lu Bu at front and your Cavalry nearby in ambush. Use Lu Bu to bait and draw AI Leopard Cavalry near to your ambush spot, in the process continue to hit and run with Lu Bu alone to cut his numbers. Lu Bu has a insane AOE attack but is only effective when clustered and not moving, so hit & run is still your main source of damage. Once the AI Cavalry is done for in your ambush, try to hit & run again with Lu Bu on Cao Cao, he will drop dead in 6-7 hits. DO NOT duel Cao Cao because he has some insane bonus that buff his damage to about 3k per hits, we still need Lu Bu to tank much of the battle ahead. Once Cao Cao is done, the rest of AI can be slowly pick off with your main troops. From now on, if you capture Cao's officer, tried recruit unless they refuse then you may release to improve the relationship. The second time capture will likely be successful to recruit. After your win, choose maintain momentum to recover 7% troops and siege Chen city.

TURN 3 = This is last of 2/2 of the main battle you need to win, keep siege to Chen and draw Dian Wei out in open battlefield which they will. At battle set your main troops and deploy Lu Bu front near the reinforcement supported by Cavalry in hiding. If used correctly, Lu Bu alone can easily route the AI reinforcement such as bowmen and catapults using his insance AOE smash. Again do not duel the AI as Lu Bu can easily hit & run snipe generals without losing much health. The only issue in this battle is not AI numbers, but the medium spear infantry which will shred any general so do not ramp Lu Bu into them. Instead use your bowmen and spear units to combat and smash cavalry from the rear to route. After this battle, everything will be very much easier and really up your own liking to expand, you can finish off Cao Cao's remnant and rescue the emperor later if you desire.

Start to get use to micro-ing Lu Bu which will easily net you 500+ kills per battle, because he is truly a One Man Army and become very insane in late game with all the kill list bonus. He Yi (Regen), Zheng Jiang (Posion overtime), Zhang Fei (Morale Roar) and Zhao Yun (Evasion) provide some of the best bonus you should prioritize. In first 10+ turns, i mainly roll with 1x Lu Bu + 2x green spears, 1x Zhang Liao, 1x Chen Gong + 6x blue bows using above tactics and still manage to beat Liu Bei, Guan Yu and Zhang Fei's full army.

Remember this is a game, if you failed, there's always a restart button. But if you succeed, i guaranteed you the satisfaction much better than just traditional store power and steamroll.

[Kwiserach]

You could do above, but an easier option is to head north take out the brothers and by turn 3 Liu Bei gives you an option for peace by becoming his vassal thus making peace with Cao Cao and swapping your farm with a farm next to Lui Bei and giving you 50% less army tax for10 turns this will allow for some breathing space to make your next move, following the story is also fun it also brings you right next to Zhang Jiang killing her for the Axes and gives you a Venom skill which is insanly good

[Fang]

Originally posted by Kwisatz Haderach:

You could do above, but an easier option is to head north take out the brothers and by turn 3 Liu Bei gives you an option for peace by becoming his vassal thus making peace with Cao Cao and swapping your farm with a farm next to Lui Bei and giving you 50% less army tax for10 turns this will allow for some breathing space to make your next move, following the story is also fun :duranceleft::duranceright: it also brings you right next to Zhang Jiang killing her for the Axes and gives you a Venom skill which is insanly good

This. Liu Bei scripted event. Just sit in your only remaining farmland for a bit.

This is what Lu Bu more or less did in actual history. He was on the run before Liu Bei foolishly gave him land and let him "babysit" his Xiapi castle. It's like he doesn't read the newspapers!

[Facemeister]

I followed the story. Firstly I gave away the seal, then the town I captured. I marched south and fought Liu Yao. I think in first 10-15 turns I secured Poyang. Then Yuan Shu declared himself emperor so I abandoned him. I also unlocked reforms that reduce character salaries. I attacked Yan Baihu as he was busy south and secured Xindu. When Yuan Shu emerged on my side of the river I won a decisive victory against his forces. I released him for good money and he accepted peace. I think he payed me 10k in tribute and another 1500 for next 10 turns so from that point money wasnt a problem. I finished Wu legacies for Old Guard and next generation so my luck loss wasn't that big at this point. Later I moved to Jangyie and when I clear it from everyone I attacked Wang Lang in Kuaji. From there its pretty easy campaign later on because you don't need to worry about Sun Ce time running out.

The biggest problem at the start was getting enough money to sustain army and big ammount of characters that join you. Few things that helped me before I establish my economy:

1. If you want to give away seal and later town that you conquer at the beginning you should loot it. There is no point in repairing buildings, but you also need to move fast so sacking is not an option here.

2. Unlocking reform that reduce salary is pretty big. Salary is one of the biggest expenses at the start of the game and you have no economy to sustain it.

3. Securing Xindu fishery before Yuan Shu vassal makes his moves.

4. Often you will get ancillaries, items, followers, etc. I was always checking who is the richest lord around and could buy something from me. It might be small item for 1,5k or some better equipment for 3-4k, but those money could be just enough to keep you afloat before you establish a power base south of Yangtze.

5. Leaving Yuan Shu when he declares himself Emperor. You get some nice bonuses for doing so and the most important thing: there is no more Yuan Shu leaching from you income so its easier to maintain army. At that point of the game Yuan Shu is probably at war north and his other vassal north from you is also at war with him. There is little chance that he will be able to react against you quickly.

[yeknod]

Sun Ce. Go off script early. Before attacking Bodang go directly south and establish a full commanderie from Han - this will be your capital. Make alliance with Yan Bailu - and trade with factions on the South China Sea. This will secure the East. Avoid direct conflict with Liu Biu. Work your way up and around the Yangtse. Keep heroism max by canabalizing the Han as long as possible. Your heros will grade up and your armies. First steps to conquering Yan Bailu is to eliminate his vassals. After all this it will still be a tough nut to crack. After Liu Biu is marginalized - you don't have to eliminate him, just remove him as a serious rival - the lands to the South, especially Wu are poorly defended. That should get you to Duke at a pace that makes you a third kingdom contender.

[GuanYu_Linux]

Sun Ce is actually really easy once you figure out the start. I found a way to have Yuan Shu release you on turn 3.

Add one more general to your army with a few units and on turn 3 attack the Han provence directly south of your starting city.

For some reason when you request permission to go to war like that, Yuan Shu will release all of his vassels...

Next, take out Liu Yao and move east. It is really easy to take the south east lands which will stop most of your lost luck points.