Total War: THREE KINGDOMS

Total War: THREE KINGDOMS

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Shampoo Oct 4, 2018 @ 4:24pm
Liu Bei's origins... was he really related to the Imperial Family, or was he just a opportunistic warlord?
Is it even possible for a peasant to be related to the imperial family?

I find it hard to believe a distant relative of the Han will somehow find themselves poor enough to be a common peasant especially since the supreme ancestor, Liu Bang, pretty much appointed all of his sons and relatives to be kings during his reign... How would a descendant of one of these kings be a poor peasant?

Was Liu Bei really related to the Han? Or was it all a lie?
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Too Much Salt Oct 4, 2018 @ 5:42pm 
Liu Bei is indeed related to the imperial family. The imperial family have a genealogy record so Emperor Xian awarded him the title "Imperial Uncle".

Think about it, when the direct descendent of an emperor leaves for his fief (presumably awarded a title prince). These princes would have offsprings but only one may inherit the princedom and the rest would have to make it on their own based on their merit, achievements or self-preserverence. There will be times where some descendents are not interested in politics and prefer to lead a quiet life which I believe Liu bei's father before him were holding low official ranks.
Last edited by Too Much Salt; Oct 4, 2018 @ 11:05pm
svencao17 Oct 5, 2018 @ 4:02am 
Liu Bei claimed that he was the descendant of Liu Sheng, who is known to have over 100 sons (mind you, only sons, not daughters). So it is possible that his claim is true, we don't know for sure.
We do know that Liu Bei kept saying he is a royalty descendant, and Emperor Xian was in difficult time (controlled by Cao Cao) so he would awarded anyone who seemed to be able to help him (as his father, Emperor Ling was famous for selling government offices and noble titles for a price).
AlwaystheMage Oct 5, 2018 @ 5:00am 
Originally posted by Too Much Salt:
Liu Bei is indeed related to the imperial family. The imperial family have a genealogy record so Emperor Xian awarded him the title "Imperial Uncle".

Novel

Wei and Wu never disputed Liu Bei's lineage, neither did historians so I don't see any particular reason to doubt it. Liu Bei's sgz is clear on the exact lineage which suggests Chen Shou and others were quite confident in that.

Liu Bei was a relative by umpteenth degrees, even long before Liu Bei the wealth of his strand had run out to the point the family had been stripped off their marquis title becuase they were too poor. Over time, distant strands wealth will dissipate as they are outside the court, wealth gets split.

Emperor Ling himself was living in such bad conditions before he was selected to rule, it clearly had an impact on his rule so this Liu poverty did happen to others.
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Date Posted: Oct 4, 2018 @ 4:24pm
Posts: 3