Tool Durability

[-₪EPIC₪- Fail]

I like where you are going with tool durability. That said...

1) the repair kit might not be researched before you wear down all your tools. I hope you can find repair kits out there in the wild.

2) I feel like the grinder wears down way too fast. Perhaps about 2x as fast as I would like.

3) Why... does the welder have a durability? Is it made of plastic? Are we going with the idea that its not the welders durability that goes down but its supply of gas/weld-rods?

[Evil_Doc]

Sorry, I don't agree. This is game breaking / immersion breaking.

You REALLY expect me to believe that a multi billion dollar high tech corporation that managed to settle MARS, couldn't invest in some higher end tools? They went with the lowest possible grade of Black & Decker toys?

Sorry, but either remove the durability timer, or cut it WAY down.

I've never had any tools fail me in real life (aside from the aforementioned Black & Decker junk) after only 5 minutes of use.

I literally only built 2 solar panels, a transformer and a battery pack and started welding a truck, when my blowtorch broke... Like what the actual frack?

Let me not even mention the grinder and the spectral sensor (which seems to wear down just holding it in your hand).

Now, here's how it would make sense in REALITY. Instead of a durability on the tool, it should have a durability on it's attachment.

Use the grinder too much? You wear down the blade, and need to replace it.

Use the blowtorch a lot? You need a new gas tank / canister.

Spectral sensor? (Battery runs out, need to recharge it, or replace the batts).

The jackhammer, should have spade / chisel bits that wear down over time and of course, depending on the hardness of the material being broken up.

The tool itself, shouldn't break for a long, long time. Now, starting out, they could provide some extra bits / blades / gas tanks... but after those are used up, you're on your own.

After all, where's the durability on the heavy rover? You expect me to believe those tools are indestructible? Guess now I know where the money went..... They skimped out on the hand tools, in favor of the rovers.

Also, durability has NO PLACE in sandbox / freeplay. Should only affect campaign mode, IMO. Or, it could be a disable-able option under difficulty settings. (Some may find this a nuisance, and a pointless extra unnecessary step in the gameplay loop)

[Boatabike]

Got to say agree on a lot of what Evil says, replace blades gas canisters that are craftable. Grinders wear down way to fast as do jack hammers too. maybe make it a 2 tier repair, blades and drill bits and gas wear out fast, can be crafted and replaced, plus main tool wear which is a lot slower but needs the workbench to repair it.

[Steppenrazor]

idk.. it would add extra work - tagging to different bits, setting up a repair system for them.

yea "seems easy" but when you've so many other things to work out.. like most survival games - 'just make them build a new one"

maybe make a repair kit item that works on most/all items would be easier?

[SAS-Vet]

Tend to agree with the above said....... Durability is fine, but the tools should last much longer, yes it's easy to repair, but already people are running around doing 101 things. You do not want to make the Game overwhelming, even big games like Conan or Ark have durability in them, but in Ark a Stone Axe lasts longer than a Tier 3 Welder in this game.
I vote for Longer durability.

[Bremen76]

Originally posted by Steppenrazor:

idk.. it would add extra work - tagging to different bits, setting up a repair system for them.

yea "seems easy" but when you've so many other things to work out.. like most survival games - 'just make them build a new one"

maybe make a repair kit item that works on most/all items would be easier?

The repair kit does work on tools now. If you start a new game, you get a handful instead of 2. They do the helmet and tools.

Just hope you don't run out before you can build repair kits. The amount you can build with the welder is disappointing.

[Tantalus]

I assume you're all aware, but nobody's mentioned it yet, so just in case: once you have a workbench, repair kits are mostly unnecessary for tools.

As for increasing tool durability, I agree. They wear down too fast as it is right now.

[Bremen76]

I think the level 1 tools need the most attention. I started over and have upgraded to L2 tools, and the durability on those seems "good enough". It definitely makes me want to progress to L3, but it's workable. And the difference between the L1 and L2 tools is drastic. Maybe double the L1 durability but slow down the build speed?

I should be able to build a starter base (workship, airlocks x2, and enough power to let the airlocks open on auto...imo...without having to repair my welder.

I think, for the "long expeditions out", the repair kits are a great tool. Fix everything up at home before you head out, and then take a stake of repair kits with you so you can grind way to your hearts content, and then do an honest-to-god refurb once you get back home.

That might be an interesting mechanic as well - repair kits are only X% effective - the workbench is where you actually full repair/refurb the tool?

[bongerman85]

okay i have just started playing a new sandbox game. and this mechanic is complete trash. i built 2 buildings, a well and an hq and the damn welder is below 25% durability. ARE YOU F*ING SERIOUS?!?! once again devs why are we not getting any say in these changes that are being made, first it was the damn wells and now its the tool durability?

stop trying to fatten up the game with tedious mundane mechanics. especially if i am on the easiest of difficulties. the only things i can really praise in this update is that there seems to be more loot at abandoned bases (starting ones anyway), and that the tweaks to the games engine have made the game feel easier to play with and more responsive.

[bloodscon1976]

oo boy another that make tools break game. I understand they want to be semi-realistic but adding tools breaking has to be done with care
1 ) can the tools be replaced / repaired easily
2 ) can the game be locked if your your tool breaks at a bad time (no repairs kits in inventory or at base and your drill / grinder breaks as gathering to make/get repair kits

Might be better to treat a tool that has no durability as it will still work but only at 30% speed that way if your tools breaks you can still use it in a pinch but the speed reduction will make you want to get it repaired

[longword]

I haven't experienced the durability problem myself, not sure I want to continue on my current save until the water bug(s) are fixed, but to me it seems reasonable that a player should expect brand new tools to last until at least Sol 7 without repair or replacement, having done all the things a player is likely to do in those 7 sols.

[Kaligula]

Started new and I have to agree: the tier1 tools wear out way too fast. tier2 tools seem to be fine. So the small stones on the ground can get picked up directly, you don't need the jackhammer in order to build repair kits or new tools. but you might have 10 worn out tools before even built the workbench or the first own repair kit

[-₪EPIC₪- Fail]

I would strongly suggest that tools DO NOT just stop working when the durability goes down. They should act like the previous tier tech. A level 1 grinder should act like a 0.5 grinder(slow as heck but still serviceable if you don't have a way to repair).

[LukaszP]

Originally posted by 💕𝓢𝓱𝓪𝓭𝓸𝔀🐾:

Dev's went overboard on this one. I don't think they even play-tested it. While it's not "Game Breaking" it certainly is "Immersion Breaking" and annoying as hell.

With all the urgency of things you have to do in the beginning, now you have to stop everything, and repair your equipment before Noon.

I have a Grinder & Welder in my garage for when I did car, and home repairs that still work today after 30 years with no repairs. All I needed was spare grinding wheels, and canisters for the welder.

Just as I think the game got better... it got worse. Well, back on the shelf it goes, again.

this is very unfair and offensive what you said, this is also completely false.

We have heavily tested that feature, becouse it changes gameplay. It makes player THINK and PLAN development, it makes you CAREFULLY choose what tobuild next, instead of wandering around without any plan.
We are open to adjustment/rebalancing this mechanics, like adding more repair kits or improving HP of tools, but we think this is good, well designed mechanics, that some other games have too. There are two ways of repairing tools, workbench and repair tools and there is also a reason, why, at the beginning you can unlock printing new tools.

Last but not the least - you are comparing good mechanic stuff on earth conditions with the same on Mars. Good Luck. Those are the same picture, if you know what i mean.
One of the things we want to emphasise is that person in such hostile enviroment is very, very dependant on very imperfect and unreliable technique. Check out last Elon's rocket start. Billions of dollars and see what - it exploded. Damm, that human technique can be really unreliable, even if its designed for cosmos and very expensive.

[Ellmite]

Originally posted by LukaszP:

Originally posted by 💕𝓢𝓱𝓪𝓭𝓸𝔀🐾:

Dev's went overboard on this one. I don't think they even play-tested it. While it's not "Game Breaking" it certainly is "Immersion Breaking" and annoying as hell.

With all the urgency of things you have to do in the beginning, now you have to stop everything, and repair your equipment before Noon.

I have a Grinder & Welder in my garage for when I did car, and home repairs that still work today after 30 years with no repairs. All I needed was spare grinding wheels, and canisters for the welder.

Just as I think the game got better... it got worse. Well, back on the shelf it goes, again.

this is very unfair and offensive what you said, this is also completely false.

We have heavily tested that feature, becouse it changes gameplay. It makes player THINK and PLAN development, it makes you CAREFULLY choose what tobuild next, instead of wandering around without any plan.
We are open to adjustment/rebalancing this mechanics, like adding more repair kits or improving HP of tools, but we think this is good, well designed mechanics, that some other games have too. There are two ways of repairing tools, workbench and repair tools and there is also a reason, why, at the beginning you can unlock printing new tools.

Last but not the least - you are comparing good mechanic stuff on earth conditions with the same on Mars. Good Luck. Those are the same picture, if you know what i mean.
One of the things we want to emphasise is that person in such hostile enviroment is very, very dependant on very imperfect and unreliable technique. Check out last Elon's rocket start. Billions of dollars and see what - it exploded. Damm, that human technique can be really unreliable, even if its designed for cosmos and very expensive.

Why schould this be "game breaking"? I build 5 solarpanels, one splitter, one battery pack, one workshop-hub, one sink, one well and one workbench. And I have only need 1 of the 6 given repairkits. I don´t understand the crying of game breaking, sorry...

[Rob]

Originally posted by LukaszP:

Originally posted by 💕𝓢𝓱𝓪𝓭𝓸𝔀🐾:

Dev's went overboard on this one. I don't think they even play-tested it. While it's not "Game Breaking" it certainly is "Immersion Breaking" and annoying as hell.

With all the urgency of things you have to do in the beginning, now you have to stop everything, and repair your equipment before Noon.

I have a Grinder & Welder in my garage for when I did car, and home repairs that still work today after 30 years with no repairs. All I needed was spare grinding wheels, and canisters for the welder.

Just as I think the game got better... it got worse. Well, back on the shelf it goes, again.

this is very unfair and offensive what you said, this is also completely false.

We have heavily tested that feature, becouse it changes gameplay. It makes player THINK and PLAN development, it makes you CAREFULLY choose what tobuild next, instead of wandering around without any plan.
We are open to adjustment/rebalancing this mechanics, like adding more repair kits or improving HP of tools, but we think this is good, well designed mechanics, that some other games have too. There are two ways of repairing tools.

Last but not the least - you are comparing good mechanic stuff on earth conditions with the same on Mars. Good Luck. Those are the same picture, if you know what i mean.
One of the things we want to emphasise is that person in such hostile enviroment is very, very dependant on very imperfect and unreliable technique. Check out last Elon's rocket start. Billions of dollars and see what - it exploded. Damm, that human technique can be really unreliable, even if its designed for cosmos and very expensive.

It can be game breaking, I'd just started my 2nd play through just before the patch, after playing for a couple of hours and losing all my crop seeds tho having learnt a few things I thought i'd have a better and speedier start, However on the new game I ran out of resources and had all my tools broken before I'd even managed to finish building the workbench, and couldn't build the last few electrical parts, so I had to resort to wandering around picking up rocks until I just scraped together the raw materials I needed.
Yes you might be able to have a careful plan and know exactly what to build after several hours of play through or i don't know.... knowledge from designing the game, but to the average new player it is now way too easy to get to a dead end situation at the start of the game.

I've always hated any durability system in games because they are always too unrealistic on the drain, but if you do want such a system my suggestion would be change it so the tools need power instead and have a recharge station in the drop pod and then a research line that gives better batteries and bigger / faster charging etc. (and ideally as a slide setting so everyone can have it as harsh or relaxed as they want)