Doubts about Alaya-Vijnana and Zero System Mobile Suits

[tgiudice]

Barbatos says it needs an Alaya-Vijnana ability of lvl3 or higher to activate its AV system but which are the higher ones? Is Type E higher? Original? Bio? What's the correct order? Is it lvl1 < lvl2 < lvl3 < Bio < E < Original?

Also what Suits have the Zero System? Wing Zero, Wing Zero EW, Epyon, Epyon EW, which ones am I missing?

[Etria]

thats a good question acutally

[Xarathos]

Originally posted by tgiudice:

Barbatos says it needs an Alaya-Vijnana ability of lvl3 or higher to activate its AV system but which are the higher ones? Is Type E higher? Original? Bio? What's the correct order? Is it lvl1 < lvl2 < lvl3 < Bio < E < Original?

Also what Suits have the Zero System? Wing Zero, Wing Zero EW, Epyon, Epyon EW, which ones am I missing?

as far as i know it means only this ones Alaya-Vijnana Lv. 1 - Lv. 3 as the ones to use in barbatos or tekada

Gundam Bael use original, also seems original is lower than Lv !

type e is for the one who has gundam vidar

bio one is for Graze Ein

as for zero system you are missing the wing zero custom

[lPaladinl]

It is kinda confusing lore-wise.

Original AV is supposed to be the best because it's the original method of installing AV for full connections and few risks, but there's only one person who got that operation and I don't think they could stand up to Mikazuki in the Barbatos. That also comes down to pilot experience, despite AV bypassing the need for systems training, it doesn't make up for actual combat experience. McGillis also never bypassed his limiter iirc.

It's possible that the current AV at Level 3 was offering higher bandwidth, considering the damage it can do to the human body, but that's not really clear. Could just because of how crude that iteration of AV operations were.

Could also have something to do with the Barbatos specifically, it's the only unit that was shown to have a limiter, while it's assumed that others probably also had limiters, and it's the only one that had it bypassed.

AV-Bio and AV-E are technically the same thing, kinda.

AV-Bio was Ein when he was in the Graze Ein, he was entombed within a Mobile Suit, similar to a 40K Dreadnought or a Starcraft Protoss Dragoon/Immortal if you're familiar with those franchises. He was in control as the pilot, but the damage to his body and extensive connections to his custom Graze had severe impact on his mental state, he was going insane and lost part of his humanity, if not all of it. Also similar to 40K Dreadnoughts where their humanity is often lost and even overwritten by software within the unit.

AV-E is the system used by Vidar/Gaelio to connect to a custom AV system within the Kimaris-Vidar and Vidar units which also had what was left of Ein after he was further destroyed as a supplemental processing unit run by his brain. Usually the AV system just connects people to their Mobile Suit, in this case it was connecting them to Ein's Brain, who was also connected to the Suit.

So are the Ein variants more powerful? In Graze Ein's iteration, he had more connections to his unit than anyone else has ever had, even Mikazuki. He was a real monster but Mikazuki also tore him apart like he was made of Butter once he bypassed his limiter. In the Vidar variants, maybe his brain is a more powerful co-processor than what was in mobile suits? But that's not really made clear.

In the end Mikazuki is the only clear example of AV Level 3, and he trumps absolutely everything save for the Dainsleif blasts, and that didn't even kill him right away.

As for Zero Systems, I don't even know what they do in SD Gundam, and in lore they were only ever in Gundam Wing Zero and Epyon variants. There's some non-canon or maybe soft-canon versions in Gundam Lucifer and Seraphim, but I don't see those units being brought up in games often or any other lore. I'll refrain from lore dumping on it for everyone's sanity, I'm sure most people know what the ZERO system does in lore.

[✨Nutkun7993✨]

As for in-game both Original and Bio-Unit are considered Lv0. Type-E is only unique ability one.

Original and Bio-Unit ability as pilot side can still give benefit eventhough the machine system aren't matched what they require for. McGillis can pilot Barbatos and give weapon critical benefit to the suit but won't get anything from the Barbatos's ability itself.

Mikazuki can pilot Bael and he will gives out weapon critical in full extent, even when go super tension but won't get any bonus from the suit ability because in suit side it requires pure one or "original" specifically.

Bio-unit can pilot any suit with AVs and will have their personality changed and give out weapon critical but won't get anything from the suit itself unless it's Graze Ein suit.

Type-E is only ability in AVs series that exactly need to match with the suit system in order to work.

This is all explained in lore. Original is the mother of all but also oldest and only give some benefit to extent without any risk. Lv3 is a result of keep expanding the system and very risky to the human body, it gives better performance for that exchange. Type-E required very specific method to install in body and how it was used. Bio-unit is similar to regular form of AVs except it literally takes over entire body as it also act as life saver to that person, it however by no mean of any better than regular one.

So the order is actually Original - Bio unit < Lv1 <Lv2 <Lv3

Type-E is out of the order because it's unique one.

[lPaladinl]

Yeah something I forgot about the AV-Ein system is that Ein takes all of the risk away from the pilot, but Ein is the one who ends up taking control of the unit, and he's not mentally stable.

[✨Nutkun7993✨]

Yup on Physical side of view. Ein literally take zero risk to the human body...well technically is. So it's almost identical to Original in term of human body risk. Though Ein himself is not mentally stable by that point and since bio-unit use computer procession, he instead is running on the risk of losing humanity.

[tgiudice]

Originally posted by ✨Nutkun7993✨:

As for in-game both Original and Bio-Unit are considered Lv0. Type-E is only unique ability one.

What confused me is why say "Lvl 3 or higher" in its description at all if there's no ability higher than Lvl 3 in-game? Was that just a localization error?

[✨Nutkun7993✨]

Originally posted by tgiudice:

Originally posted by ✨Nutkun7993✨:

As for in-game both Original and Bio-Unit are considered Lv0. Type-E is only unique ability one.

What confused me is why say "Lvl 3 or higher" in its description at all if there's no ability higher than Lvl 3 in-game? Was that just a localization error?

It says "not less than Lvl" in japanese version. So yes it's just confused choice of word.

[lPaladinl]

Originally posted by tgiudice:

Originally posted by ✨Nutkun7993✨:

As for in-game both Original and Bio-Unit are considered Lv0. Type-E is only unique ability one.

What confused me is why say "Lvl 3 or higher" in its description at all if there's no ability higher than Lvl 3 in-game? Was that just a localization error?

Welcome to Bandai Namco quality assurance for Western releases... they're dropping the ball for translations.

[tgiudice]

Originally posted by ✨Nutkun7993✨:

It says "not less than Lvl" in japanese version. So yes it's just confused choice of word.

Thank you for both answers, it was a pleasure to read all the lore-wise content and finally get it clear in-game wise without wasting any abilities and money.

Originally posted by lPaladinl:

Welcome to Bandai Namco quality assurance for Western releases... they're dropping the ball for translations.

Yeah, it really seems like sometimes, also thanks for the lore part it's always good to know more lore bits. Also got that 40k comparison in my mind.

Originally posted by Xarathos:

as for zero system you are missing the wing zero custom

Thanks, it really was the one missing.