Let's talk about the Forsworn.

[tripudium animarum decembrium]

Do you think their hearts are in the right place? Or do you hate them?

[Aegix Drakan]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από YetiGamer:

Well if you're talking about the briarhearts then their heats are not in the right place... Seeing as they've been ripped out of their chest by a hagraven and replaced...

Damn, you beat me to it. XD

Overall...I have sympathy for the Forsworn, but I hate what they're doing and thus cannot take their side.

Like, they apparently ran Markarth pretty well and mostly fairly, when they took it over, but then Ulfric went and took a dump all over that when he not only massacred every forsworn man woman and child in the place, but also killed anyone who didn't join the fight on his side. That's not right.

But while I sympathize with that...Their current "kill everything" retaliation strategy is not acceptable at all.

[Armchair Civilian]

i'd like to see the Reach self-governed by the Reachpeople, give the Forsworn a chance to re-assimilate into the general populace, hunting down those who persist in destructive activities. As for Daedra Worship and the Hagravens: if they weren't given such good reason for a persecution complex, who's to say they couldn't make perfectly bearable littermates?

[Taiwan Number One]

Wasn't the book about the Markarth Incident written by a pro-Imperial? I don't know for sure, but I heard that somewhere on the Internet which would call alot of those claims into question. As for the Forsworn, they may have once been peaceful, but they are hungry for blood now.

[J.D. Hus]

I hate forsworn for no reason, but today I accidentally joined them and killed all guards in markarth :/ :D

[ambosen]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από The Winking Skeever:

i'd like to see the Reach self-governed by the Reachpeople, give the Forsworn a chance to re-assimilate into the general populace, hunting down those who persist in destructive activities.

Which they did. In the second era. Reachmen, and forsworn aren't even the same faction, and it's heavily implied the Forsworn are *actual* Bretons likely from High Rock itself and possibly sent to cause problems *by* the resurgentAldmeri dominion's Thalmor agents (which coincidentally, controls High Rock and Elsweyr at the time Skyrim is set in), unlike the Reachmen (mix of Breton and Nordic ancestry, and having been law abiding, productive members of the population since at least the second era, )

If you look really close in the cities of Skyrim, peaceful, law abiding reachmen are in nearly every one of them, and Reachmen outright control several of the smaller towns. Their status isn't perfect, but it's a better one then say, Dark elves, and argonians have in Windhelm.

[桜内梨子💓可愛い]

I ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ hate them, along with the effed up Snow Elves

[Doomerang]

Would you not be hungry for blood if you got massacred the way Ulfric did? what else could they possibly do against a regime like that? have a political debate over free cups of coffee? no, instead they are forced into the mountains like that.

[Blackfox Kitsune]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από ambosen:

Actually if you guys paid attention to any of the series lore, you'd know that High Rock itself hasn't claimed the Reach as it's territory since at least the second era (Skyrim takes place in the fourth.). Furthermore, many of the Reachmen had become naturalizedd citizens of the area, and no longer participate in violent attacks on Nord cities, with many even having managed to attain political power. Secondly let me be blunt; with the exception of one group, Forsworn, are hostile to literally *everything* and they're also Daedra worshippers.

Then, several of the non hostile Reachmen in the game make references to violent attacks perpretrated against *them* by Forsworn for not being willing to follow "the old ways".

At best, they're actively feeding a lot of the ethnic strife that Skyrim has with unprovoked attacks on Nord and Breton alike.

Whoa Whoa Whoa, Where did you get the Idea that they are Daedra Worshippers? they say OLD GODS not Daedra and when you check the Names of their old gods you find their the OLD names of the "8" devines.

[Blackfox Kitsune]

The Forsworn are among a few factions I think should have been linked to race choise. there a whole bunch of fanctions in the game that we should have been able to play into or join, but their sorta half backed and just kinda there, the Forsworn are one of those. we know that hagravens twist their faith here and there that some groups follow the Deadric prince of hunt while others follow the Et'Ada (or Aedra).
Now and then you'll run into a friendly Forsworn not living out in the wilds but in prison, or one man and a young boy from Helgen who sends you on a quest to get the blessing of Kyne.

The Forsworn are men and women of the Reach are the most closely linked to the distant Mer blood then of any of the races of Men, as well as being part Nord as well. This diversity encouraged the development of a unique culture over a period of centuries. Following the Nords' conquest of The Reach- which they had laid claim to and held- a deep rooted hatred of the Nords has since become ingrained in their culture.

Frankly I think Bathesda should have gone more indepth with the Forsworn, not just some wishy-washy cow dollops the skyrim game is full of.
The so called war in skyrim, that was what a few quests and done, you are the dragonborn! you should be taking over skyrim and becoming the new leader of all the land.
Next the Thalmor. OMG their background and story of how they took over is so LAME I could write an essay on pulling all the plot holes and BS apart. But again it is another faction we should have been able to join as a high elf, Wood elf or Kajiit.

Then we have the sudden thing with the snow Elves, so somehow they became eyeless twisted goblin things, from the true Mer rulers of skyrim? the last two snow elves are still men like at least, one living a life as a paladin the other is a vampire? WTF... that makes no sense at all like half the rest of the stuff in the DLC.

I really could go on and on about races and factions that make no sense because Bathesda forgot their own story and lore as well as trying to rush out for deadlines and so end up having to cut things short. Anyone that makes their own mods knows the scripting is still in place for some of these factions and quests its just been turned off. its a shame that Bathesda have been opting for the lazy quick fix way out, instead of saying " you know what we need 2 or 3 more months to finish this and make it awsome, not wishy-washy and lazy."

[numinex51]

I think forsworns are just a few stupid bandits.

[Noble Ten]

A good Forsworn is a dead Forsworn. Seriously, they are like large band of bandits, who kill, rape and pillage cause they want too. No wonder they're outlawed and hunted. In that, I do my part ^_~

[Fabea]

To me they are just a pain and who might, possibly have something interesting on them from time to time, I rarely even bother to check them for loot now.

They are a mixed bunch that are totally mixed up in their heads, their tenet is to attack first and ask questions later........Except for one small bunch who do actually speak to you and that was so amazing that I kept going back to talk to them for a few minutes.

[Dux]

While they have some legitimate claims to the land they live in at this point they're basically barbarians/savages who have dealings with other not very "good" beings such as Hargravens etc, with very few of them being civilized, and those for the most part live in Markarth already.
As such with my favourite character being a hero Dragonborn I do not sympathise with their cause.

[Taiwan Number One]

@ Firebrand

We really don't know what happened during the Markarth Incident, but let's assume the accusations are true. Being butchered does not justify butchering ohters especially people who had nothing to do with it. Forsworn will kill anyone who isn't them including fellow Bretons. Stormcloaks, Empire, and even the Thalmor aren't that bad.

[ambosen]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Blackfox Kitsune (Whisp Lupa):

Whoa Whoa Whoa, Where did you get the Idea that they are Daedra Worshippers? they say OLD GODS not Daedra and when you check the Names of their old gods you find their the OLD names of the "8" devines.

Because of the fact that they are. One of the first things the Forsworn did after taking over Markaerth *before* the "incident" was to *legalize* daedra worship. Then there's the fact that many of their encampments feature daedric symbols, which appear to be more recently carved the draconic ones you sometimes see in tombs and various books in game to help set the backstory mentions they actually routinely descrate temples of the 8 divines. Also, maybe you've noticed, maybe you haven't, but hag ravens are canonnically created by daedra. Also, the removal of hearts, and reanimation of the victim is a standard ritual in various rites of daedric worship, and if you interupt the ritual, you can in fact be sometimes attacked by briarhearts who will be reanimated *before* getting their briars as hearts.

So, we have evidence of daedric worship, knowledge of daedric symbols, legalization of daedric worrship under a forsworn regime, A violent attitude to other, provably divine worshippers (disputes between cults of the 8 divines mostly tend to be verbal, non violent ones, historically in the series, mostly about naming conventions.)

Also, Hag ravens on occasion carry daedric weapons specifically daggerrs and short swords, and almost *never* carry actual forsworn weapons, which otherwwise, uniquely for Skyrim of the enttire series, aren't carried by non daedra worshippers *except* the player character.