Custom animations and skeletons

[Ilja]

This matter has come up a lot recently. There has been some amount of confusion about the proper installation and overwriting process, so I thought it would be best to make a separate post about it. I will cover the most popular skeleton and animations, and make few notes to clarify certain things.

What is needed?

Simple animations, such as most dance and idle mods, do not need any special skeletons. Install them and run FNIS after that. Look instructions from below. If you are using a body mod like CBBE or UNP, then you should install it before animations.

Morea in depth mods – like Dual Sheath Redux – will require custom skeleton mod and dependency mod for that. Vanilla skeleton is not flexible enough to support more complex animations, so custom skeleton is needed for them to work.

You will need following mods to properly install and use more complex animations.

Realistic Ragdoll and Force by dDefinder
Fixes strange physics of Skyrim and is a dependency for XPMS.
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/601/?

XP32 Maximum Skeleton -XPMS by xp32
You will have to be signed in to Nexus to see this file.
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/26800/?

XPMSE by Groovtama
Extended version is available from the same download site than XPMS above. It requires SKSE. Pay attention to SKSE version, because it may not be using the latest stable release. XPMSE has slider set plugin for RaceMenu. If you used them together, then you should select your weapon position from RaceMenu, instead of installing them. Pay attention to animation links in XPMSE description. You can enter the RaceMenu view again in game by opening console and typing showracemenu.

Fores New Idles in Skyrim – FNIS by fore
Nothing moves in your game without this. FNIS registers all custom animations you have added and you have to run it every time you have either included or removed animations from the game. You will need FNIS Behavior VX_y_y -- ALWAYS necessary (where X_y_y is the current version number.) Spells addon will include the ability to start animations as spells for both PC and NPC. Creature pack includes support for creature animations, if you need them.
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/11811/?

Installation order for skeleton animations

1. Install Realistic Ragdoll and Force first. It acts as a base for animations and parts of it can be overwritten in NMM.

2. Install mods with animations. Installation and overwriting order rarely matters, but be sure to check compatibility notes from mods.

3. Install XPMS or XPMSE last and let it overwrite everything.

If you install new animations later, then do not let anything to overwrite the skeleton. Select "No" in NMM for all overwrite attempts for skeleton, or move it last in your Mod priority list in MO.

If you did, just uninstall the skeleton in NMM and install it again, letting it overwrite everything. If you are using ECE (look below), then do not forget to select support to it from skeleton installer widget.

Running FNIS is always necessary

Every time you add or include animations, you need to run FNIS.

Activate GenerateFNISforUsers.exe. Once you have installed FNIS, then it can be found from your Steam folder, under SteamApps > common > Skyrim > Data > Tools > GenerateFNIS_for_Users. When you run it first time, FNIS will as the permission to create a shortcut to your desktop. That is usually a good idea.

- Before running, make sure that “GENDER Spesific Animations” and “SKELETON Arm Fix” are selected.

- You do not need other patches, unless you have mods specifically meant for them. They do not include animation data.

- PCEA means, that certain animations can be made as player character exclusive, instead of shared globally with other characters. Do not check it, unless you have related mod and animations.

- If your characters are standing arms wide and not performing any animations, then FNIS isn't installed properly, or not ran at all.

HDT, BBP, TBBP

There is no specific place for HDT Physics Extensions plugin in the installation order. If you have BBP and TBBP animations, then they should be installed with other animations.

HDT Physics Extensions
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/53996/?

Body mods

CBBE, UNP or similar body mods are more likely to do changes to your custom skeleton than animations. You should not let them overwrite your skeleton mod. I am quite aware how strange it may sound that body mods and animations should not overwrite XPMS, but consider this in this way: skeleton must be allowed to move freely for animations included to be displayed properly.

Enhanced Character Edit

If you are using ECE instead of the Race Menu or vanilla menu, it will ask about your skeleton. When asked, select Skeleton + Normal. This would be true even with a body mod like CBBE. Skeleton is the more important one here, so do not select Vanilla/CBBE/UNP option, if you have Realistic Ragdoll and Force + XPMS installed in your game.

Enhanced Character Edit
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/12951/?

Troubleshooting

- Study FNIS output report. It is visible and available for scrolling in the window of FNIS. You can even copy the text and include it to forums, if someone asks you to do so.

- Always run LOOT after adding or removing mods. If you haven't done so, then don't ask questions before doing so.

Additional links

LOOT
https://loot.github.io/

RaceMenu by Expired
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/29624/?

SKSE
http://skse.silverlock.org/

Post changes

20.1.2015
- Added: Links to RaceMenu and SKSE
- Added: section Additional links
- Separated XPMSE from XPMS, because of SKSE and RaceMenu support information.

[Miku]

you won this forum for today

[Ilja]

Typos. Typos everywhere.
Let's see how many I missed.

[identity001]

O.o I use xpms just fine without realistic ragdolls. I also installed ECE long before I added the skeleton or current body mods and also no problems.

[Ilja]

Originally posted by identity001:

O.o I use xpms just fine without realistic ragdolls. I also installed ECE long before I added the skeleton or current body mods and also no problems.

RRaF is not a parent mod for XPMS, that is true. It is needed for character and body mod physics to work properly and therefore listed as dependency by xp32. I am not about to give only half-way advices, but the ones that make the game work properly, so RRaF is included here. :)

I did not say anything about the installing order between ECE and XPMS. If you haven't included support for XPMS layers to appear in ECE, then that is your own decision. Just remember that they are available, if you happen to reinstall your skeleton.

[identity001]

Originally posted by Ilja (Ref):

Originally posted by identity001:

O.o I use xpms just fine without realistic ragdolls. I also installed ECE long before I added the skeleton or current body mods and also no problems.

RRaF is not a parent mod for XPMS, that is true. It is needed for character and body mod physics to work properly and therefore listed as dependency by xp32. I am not about to give only half-way advices, but the ones that make the game work properly, so RRaF is included here. :)

I did not say anything about the installing order between ECE and XPMS. If you haven't included support for XPMS layers to appear in ECE, then that is your own decision. Just remember that they are available, if you happen to reinstall your skeleton.

Is there a major benefit in doing this? You have me feeling as if I am missing out on something or something is not working the way it shoudl be. I currently use Pinup Poser, Halo's Poser, Adultxxshow, Pretty Pose, Puppetering Master and one other that I am not so sure I would want to admit to using on this forum lmao. They all seem to function ok. No Problems with ECE either. I only mentioned ECE because you said there was an option when installing to select custom skeleton?

Would this by chance be the reason that half the follower mods I have attempted all revert to vanilla skin?

[Ilja]

Originally posted by identity001:

Is there a major benefit in doing this? You have me feeling as if I am missing out on something or something is not working the way it shoudl be. I currently use Pinup Poser, Halo's Poser, Adultxxshow, Pretty Pose, Puppetering Master and one other that I am not so sure I would want to admit to using on this forum lmao. They all seem to function ok. No Problems with ECE either. I only mentioned ECE because you said there was an option when installing to select custom skeleton?

Would this by chance be the reason that half the follower mods I have attempted all revert to vanilla skin?

Physics don't only apply to PC, enemies and followers as well. Have you ever sneak attacked a bandit with a bow and saw him/her flying from the cliff? Realistic Ragdoll and Force was meant to fix silly physics just like that.

It does not direclty affect to you characters movements, but will take effect every time they ragdoll - often saving PC's life, when he/she collapses instead of flying down from the mountain.

As for skeleton purposes, RRaF affects to how certain body mods and addons will work with your character and NPCs. You are free to continue without it, but installing it would likely make you notice that several silly things that you considered as "normal Skyrim" are away and replaced with proper body + combat physics.

About ECE. Yes. There is an option with XPMS and extended version of it for ECE. It includes new sliders and enchanted vertex edit for face. As direct quote from the mod, where option is selected (XPMS Extended Sliders for ECE User <- I had to run it for that :)

Full CREDIT for Groovtama for making these files. Contain modified .ini files that using XPMS scale for ECE sliders and also adds new sliders.

About skin texture:
No, I really do not think that body textures have anything to do with this. You are likely haveing a mod conflict or busted load order. Did you accidentially install more than one body texture and have you studied what notes LOOT say about your load order?

[identity001]

Originally posted by Ilja (Ref):

Originally posted by identity001:

Is there a major benefit in doing this? You have me feeling as if I am missing out on something or something is not working the way it shoudl be. I currently use Pinup Poser, Halo's Poser, Adultxxshow, Pretty Pose, Puppetering Master and one other that I am not so sure I would want to admit to using on this forum lmao. They all seem to function ok. No Problems with ECE either. I only mentioned ECE because you said there was an option when installing to select custom skeleton?

Would this by chance be the reason that half the follower mods I have attempted all revert to vanilla skin?

Physics don't only apply to PC, enemies and followers as well. Have you ever sneak attacked a bandit with a bow and saw him/her flying from the cliff? Realistic Ragdoll and Force was meant to fix silly physics just like that.

It does not direclty affect to you characters movements, but will take effect every time they ragdoll - often saving PC's life, when he/she collapses instead of flying down from the mountain.

As for skeleton purposes, RRaF affects to how certain body mods and addons will work with your character and NPCs. You are free to continue without it, but installing it would likely make you notice that several silly things that you considered as "normal Skyrim" are away and replaced with proper body + combat physics.

About ECE. Yes. There is an option with XPMS and extended version of it for ECE. It includes new sliders and enchanted vertex edit for face. As direct quote from the mod, where option is selected (XPMS Extended Sliders for ECE User <- I had to run it for that :)

Full CREDIT for Groovtama for making these files. Contain modified .ini files that using XPMS scale for ECE sliders and also adds new sliders.

About skin texture:
No, I really do not think that body textures have anything to do with this. You are likely haveing a mod conflict or busted load order. Did you accidentially install more than one body texture and have you studied what notes LOOT say about your load order?

I actually just ran Loot for the first time earlier this morning. I do have a multitude of body textures that are probably overlapping but Loot does not specify what is overlapping what and I am scared to death of changing them around because the way I have my character after many months of alternating and compiling mods I finally have my character so under certain lights they look photorealistic. I can also equip almost every type of armor too with no problems. I would love to get it all sorted out but I am running about 121 mods and to go back and see what is all compatable with what is just too much work. I am not even sure what Loot did but the game runs absolutely flawlessly for me now in terms of performance. It was like a godsend.

[Ilja]

LOOT fixed your busted load order. It is important to run LOOT after each time you add a new mod.

About textures and body mods, Skyrim can run only 1 compatible set at a time. For example body and related texture mods that are not overlapping with each other. If you have multiply body mods or textures, then they will clash. My own set is below.

1. Caliantes Female Body Mod Big Bottom Edition (CBBE)
2. CBBE skin texture V2 V3 plus Thepal and UNP compatible
2.1: Fuller lips and character patch

What ever other modifications I want to do, I will use ECE slices and layers to create them.

[Krowten]

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR writing this!! This has really helped me and I appreciate you taking the time to write it all down.

[Delta 1038]

Huh, didn't know you wrote this.

[Ilja]

Originally posted by Delta 1038:

Huh, didn't know you wrote this.

Overwriting skeleton is a common enough mistake, so I decided to write this post. I just made few fixes to it, but I may have to rewrite it as a whole.

For those interested, I am no longer using ECE. RaceMenu3 (especially with XPMSE) supersedes it's previously unique features. RM sliders are much better, less clunky and give proper support for other mods.

[kholodininverochka]

I have a question. when you say Skeleton + Normal, do you mean Realistic Ragdoll and Force skeleton or none at all?

[kholodininverochka]

I know this sounds like a stupid question but I'm very cautious as to how to install this to Mod organizer.

[Ilja]

This post is very old. I should rewrite it. Install Realistic ragdoll and force. Use Groovtama's XPMSE skeleton and move it last in MO left panel.

[Avrie]

Definitely worth the re-write, especially with a couple of versions of XPMSE now floating around. (2 and 3) After reading this I need to go back into MO and make sure XPMSE is below all my animation mods ... I know ragdolls and force is first but I never considered the body mods ... More information I didn't know.

Edit ... I got lucky and accidently placed them right ;-) but I very much prefer knowing why.

Thanks, You should also add this to your updated guide(s), or maybe CFS's tutorial thread. Good info to have handy