Debug log?

[Lampros]

Most games I've played recently have a way to get to the crash report log where I can locate the reason for crash. Does Skyrim have something similar?

I am still getting an unusually high number of crashes even after getting rid of some mods that I thought were the culprits.

[Lampros]

Ok, found this online; but I see no folder called "scripts" and no 4 new log files:



"Go to My Documents/My Games/Skyrim and open up Skyrim.ini.

Then add this:

[Papyrus]
fPostLoadUpdateTimeMS=500.0
bEnableLogging=1
bEnableTrace=1
bLoadDebugInformation=1

If the section [Papyrus] already exists, then you might add it without the section identifier. Next time you start the game you should see a new folder called "logs" inside that folder. And there is another folder called "scripts" and inside that 4 new log files."

[gnewna]

Papyrus logs are not as useful as people make them out to be, unless possibly you know exactly what to look for, but even then as I understand it they probably won't tell you what caused the crash, simply because Skyrim tends to crash so instantly to desktop, so there's no time for anything to be logged.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by gnewna:

Papyrus logs are not as useful as people make them out to be, unless possibly you know exactly what to look for, but even then as I understand it they probably won't tell you what caused the crash, simply because Skyrim tends to crash so instantly to desktop, so there's no time for anything to be logged.

Is there an external program or a mod that lets me know then? It's simply intolerable to play with a crash an hour. Before I downloaded so many mods, I had maybe 2 crashes in 200 hours that were not alt-tab bug-related? Now it's literally once per hour.

[Lampros]

Update:

LOL, I see the script folder now, and it opened a huge log that I cannot read. Anything I should look for? ;)

[Lampros]

Half the log seems to be something like this:

"warning: Property ArmorHeavy on script DuelPlayerProc attached to Active effect 3 on (FF000E61) cannot be initialized because the script no longer contains that property."

I guess Duel - Combat Realism script error? I really should switch this ASAP.

Edit:

Actually 90 percent of it seems like Duel scripts cannot be initialized warning.

[Lampros]

Hmmm, some folks say papyrus logs mean nothing, but others say it's very important? Very confused.

[Bomb Bloke]

It depends. Much of what gets logged are warnings, and can be ignored (if the game is able to spend hours reporting the same fault in DCR, then odds are that fault isn't a crash bug... probably). Some indicate serious problems. It's difficult to tell the difference unless you're able to read and understand the original scripts yourself.

Generally the way to go is to look for logged lines that only tend to pop up immediately before a crash. Such lines may or may not exist, but if they do, then odds are they'll tell you which mod - if any - is causing your problems. Obviously the logs are helpful if that data is there, but they're not so helpful if it isn't.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Bomb Bloke:

It depends. Much of what gets logged are warnings, and can be ignored (if the game is able to spend hours reporting the same fault in DCR, then odds are that fault isn't a crash bug... probably). Some indicate serious problems. It's difficult to tell the difference unless you're able to read and understand the original scripts yourself.

Thanks. So my computer language ignorance strikes again.

Originally posted by Bomb Bloke:

I

Generally the way to go is to look for logged lines that only tend to pop up immediately before a crash. Such lines may or may not exist, but if they do, then odds are they'll tell you which mod - if any - is causing your problems. Obviously the logs are helpful if that data is there, but they're not so helpful if it isn't.

Hmmm, the other issue is that some folks online claim that having the papyrus turned on decreases performance dramatically. Is this true? In fact, Duel - Combat Realism's author says that.

Finally, I had the strangest bug I've seen.

In Helgen at the beginning of the game at the torture room, Hadvar killed a Stormcloak, and that Stormcloak fell. But his health meter still said he was alive! So Hadvar and I couldn't progress further, as Hadvar kept hacking at the dead Stormcloak. I tried to use console "disable," but that wouldn't delete the dead Stormcloak. Is this a common occurrence, and is there a work around it?

It's early in the game, so I can re-start, but it worries me that new bugs are creeping up with my rebuilt mod collection this early.

[Lampros]

Ok, I did an online search and I got Nazenn saying you shouldn't touch it either. So I reverted to default.

[Lampros]

WTF, started a new game, and now horse is stuck and won't move during the initial carriage ride. Jesus fug.

[Lampros]

Hmmm, some claim that Skytweak and Matter of Time are not compatible?

[Bomb Bloke]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Hmmm, the other issue is that some folks online claim that having the papyrus turned on decreases performance dramatically. Is this true? In fact, Duel - Combat Realism's author says that.

It does lower performance, yes, as the game is writing data to the disk that it otherwise wouldn't be. Whether the effect is "dramatic" depends on exactly how many mods are causing messages to be logged, and how often they're doing it (the log files can potentially become very large very quickly - as in, hundreds of megabytes of data in minutes - under some setups, and the resulting gameplay is similar to what you get if you mash your quicksave button). As a general rule, you'll want logging turned off unless you actually intend to read the logs that're written.

That said, I once encountered a reproducable crash bug, and when I finally gave in and enabled logging to attempt to figure out what was going on... that alone fixed the bug. Presumably the change in performance somehow managed to get whatever was going wrong to resolve correctly. I don't expect it to ever work again.

But yeah, leave logging off if you're not actually needing it.

Originally posted by Lampros:

In Helgen at the beginning of the game at the torture room, Hadvar killed a Stormcloak, and that Stormcloak fell. But his health meter still said he was alive! So Hadvar and I couldn't progress further, as Hadvar kept hacking at the dead Stormcloak. I tried to use console "disable," but that wouldn't delete the dead Stormcloak. Is this a common occurrence, and is there a work around it?

Some scripted / animation mods can cause this - they attempt to affect a dying NPC, and as a result, they fail to actually die at the correct moment and go into a "limbo" state. If memory serves you can get around this with a "raise zombie" spell (which'll kill 'em properly when that expires, by way of turning them into an ash pile), but obviously you wouldn't have such a thing at that stage of the game...

Originally posted by Lampros:

WTF, started a new game, and now horse is stuck and won't move during the initial carriage ride. Jesus fug.

Won't move at all, or moves for a bit then gets stuck?

Silly question, but you haven't allowed your frame rate to sneak upwards, have you?

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Bomb Bloke:

Originally posted by Lampros:

Hmmm, the other issue is that some folks online claim that having the papyrus turned on decreases performance dramatically. Is this true? In fact, Duel - Combat Realism's author says that.

It does lower performance, yes, as the game is writing data to the disk that it otherwise wouldn't be. Whether the effect is "dramatic" depends on exactly how many mods are causing messages to be logged, and how often they're doing it (the log files can potentially become very large very quickly - as in, hundreds of megabytes of data in minutes - under some setups, and the resulting gameplay is similar to what you get if you mash your quicksave button). As a general rule, you'll want logging turned off unless you actually intend to read the logs that're written.

That said, I once encountered a reproducable crash bug, and when I finally gave in and enabled logging to attempt to figure out what was going on... that alone fixed the bug. Presumably the change in performance somehow managed to get whatever was going wrong to resolve correctly. I don't expect it to ever work again.

But yeah, leave logging off if you're not actually needing it.

Thanks for the comprehensive explanation; I should just turn it off, given that I know nothing about these things.

Originally posted by Bomb Bloke:

Some scripted / animation mods can cause this - they attempt to affect a dying NPC, and as a result, they fail to actually die at the correct moment and go into a "limbo" state. If memory serves you can get around this with a "raise zombie" spell (which'll kill 'em properly when that expires, by way of turning them into an ash pile), but obviously you wouldn't have such a thing at that stage of the game...

I guess I could use the console to give myself this spell the next time it happens.

Originally posted by Bomb Bloke:

Originally posted by Lampros:

WTF, started a new game, and now horse is stuck and won't move during the initial carriage ride. Jesus fug.

Won't move at all, or moves for a bit then gets stuck?

Silly question, but you haven't allowed your frame rate to sneak upwards, have you?

I do have Vsynch turned on, but the FPS still ocassionally - and briefly - goes over 60. But then it usually settles around 35-50. Would even a brief (like a second or two) spike over 60 would cause this? If so, what can I do, given that I do have Vsynch on - which supposedly prevents this?

[Bomb Bloke]

Truth be told, the framerate thing is less known for stalling the horse than it is for giving it dramatic powers of flight.

Odds are you're going to have to start disabling mods. Kill them all to start with, to verify that the horse moves that way. Then enable half - if that works, switch halves, if not, halve again and repeat until you've got it narrowed down to a culprit.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Bomb Bloke:

Truth be told, the framerate thing is less known for stalling the horse than it is for giving it dramatic powers of flight.

Odds are you're going to have to start disabling mods. Kill them all to start with, to verify that the horse moves that way. Then enable half - if that works, switch halves, if not, halve again and repeat until you've got it narrowed down to a culprit.

I re-started; I am hoping it's a one-time thing.

I also removed possible culprits: A clock mod conflicts with SkyTweaks, and I'd prefer to keep Skytweaks; I am also switching from Duel - Combat Realism to Deadly Combat. Finally, I dropped the spawn increaser for now and will likely turn back again after leaving Helgen.

Only thing about Deadly Combat I am wary about is the supposedly extreme archery damage. It's unrealistic and possibly game-breaking for archers to do so much damage, but then I've only read about it. I wish there was a possibility to decrease archery damage across the board, but apparently all mundane damage seems to be controlled by the same field.