Does Nocturnal or Mora get your soul?

[Ghetsis]

The dragonborn sells their soul to nocturnal to kill mercer frey however Mora says your soul is his in the DB DLC, where would your soul go if they both claim it?

[Brandybuck]

You're also told you will get admitted to Shor's Hall. Akatosh would probably get first dibs, except that Shor outranks him (Shor being the Nord name for Lorkhan). The thing with the Dragonborn is that the rules don't apply.

Also, you never assented to a contract with Nocturnal, it was Karliah who did. The quest makes it seem like you did, but check the dialog out and you'll find that you did not actually agree. A half-assed lawyer could got you off in a heartbeat.

Hermaeus Mora only claims you soul if you head down a certain dialogue path. And then it's still not clear he will actually take it. These are not omnipotent and omniscient beings.

[Ghetsis]

Originally posted by Brandybuck:

You're also told you will get admitted to Shor's Hall. Akatosh would probably get first dibs, except that Shor outranks him (Shor being the Nord name for Lorkhan). The thing with the Dragonborn is that the rules don't apply.

Also, you never assented to a contract with Nocturnal, it was Karliah who did. The quest makes it seem like you did, but check the dialog out and you'll find that you did not actually agree. A half-assed lawyer could got you off in a heartbeat.

Hermaeus Mora only claims you soul if you head down a certain dialogue path. And then it's still not clear he will actually take it. These are not omnipotent and omniscient beings.

Could you explain what you mean about the Nocturnal thing? im not sure what you mean? (Sorry for the trouble, i am easily manipulated XD)

[Hare+Guu!]

Hircine does because you're a werewolf, or Molag Bal if you're a vamp.

But then again, you're dragonborn, so maybe Akatosh can save your ass.

[voehringer_nitron]

There are some people that say that by doing each Daedric Lord's quest and becoming their champion, each of them could claim dominion over your soul.

[Tryst49]

Best bet is to become the champion to all of them. Then while they are all arguing over who gets your soul, you can sneak past and head off to Shor's Hall. Once there, talk to the other heroes who have gone before you and I'm sure, after being the one who was instrumental in taking down Alduin, you'll find a few heroes to stand beside you against any of those Deadric Lords who try to lay claim to your soul.

Hircine, Molag Bal, Nocturnal, Hermaus Mora and all the others are not gods anyway, they are Daedric Lords (or demigods) and would be outranked by Akatosh, a bit like a General giving you orders and several Lieutenants trying to countermand them. If they tried to go against Akatosh, they'd have their butts handed to them on a plate.

[Solomon Hawk]

NONE will have me. I return to Aetherius for Aetherius is from whence I came.
I may serve daedric princes to serve a purpose, but in the long run my service serves my purpose. The princes are satisfied.

[Brandybuck]

Originally posted by Lord Ghetsis:

Could you explain what you mean about the Nocturnal thing? im not sure what you mean? (Sorry for the trouble, i am easily manipulated XD)

Nocturnal is all about business. AIn the game there was consideration and an offer. But there was no assent. The character never actually agreed. Karliah says that these two agree, but the character never actually said "I agree", or even a "yes". It's not a dialog option. There is no valid contract.

Remember, this is business. It isn't some web page saying they have the right to your first born merely because you visited. There has to formal assent. A signature. Making your mark. An oath. Something. But it didn't happen. Karliah said yes, you did not. Go play the sequence and again and see.

So was this a legal mistake on Bethesda's part, or was it deliberate? Consider that without the assent Nocturnal doesn't need to provide anything. You gain nothing from her but she gets her key back. Does your luck improve afterward? Nope. You do get a power from the Sepulcher, but that's not part of the deal that Karliah describes, it's what every pilgrim gets who completes the path.

In short, Nocturnal has no legal claim over you.

[Tryst49]

Conversely, not moving or walking away from your position on the platform when Karliah describes the terms of the contract is a consent in itself. A lawyer for Nocturnal would use the fact that you elected to remain where you were, therefore you gave your consent, albeit non-verbal.

[alexander_dougherty]

Originally posted by Brandybuck:

Akatosh would probably get first dibs, except that Shor outranks him (Shor being the Nord name for Lorkhan).

Not sure Lorkhan outranks Akatosh, apart from being dead, I'm pretty sure Akatosh/Auriel was the leader of the Aedra. I could be wrong, but if Akatosh doesn't outrank Lorkhan, he at least was his equal. But the fact Lorkhan is dead renders it all moot, he might dwell in his hall, which itself is part of Aetherius, but he is deceased, thus powerless.

Originally posted by tryst49:

Hircine, Molag Bal, Nocturnal, Hermaus Mora and all the others are not gods anyway, they are Daedric Lords (or demigods) and would be outranked by Akatosh, a bit like a General giving you orders and several Lieutenants trying to countermand them. If they tried to go against Akatosh, they'd have their butts handed to them on a plate.

Hmm, you appear to be confusing the term Divines with Gods, The Daedric Princes (or Lords) are gods. Unlike the Aedra they didn't take part in the creation of Mundus (material plane Tamriel exists on), but all that means is they can't be killed (unlike the Aedra) and their power isn't depleted (again unlike the Aedra). Also Daedra are not subject to the Aedra/Divines, so are not outranked by them.

Remember the term Aedra is just elven for kinfolk and Daedra is elven for not kinfolk, neither in themselves refers to godhood.

[Ghetsis]

Originally posted by Brandybuck:

Originally posted by Lord Ghetsis:

Could you explain what you mean about the Nocturnal thing? im not sure what you mean? (Sorry for the trouble, i am easily manipulated XD)

Nocturnal is all about business. AIn the game there was consideration and an offer. But there was no assent. The character never actually agreed. Karliah says that these two agree, but the character never actually said "I agree", or even a "yes". It's not a dialog option. There is no valid contract.

Remember, this is business. It isn't some web page saying they have the right to your first born merely because you visited. There has to formal assent. A signature. Making your mark. An oath. Something. But it didn't happen. Karliah said yes, you did not. Go play the sequence and again and see.

So was this a legal mistake on Bethesda's part, or was it deliberate? Consider that without the assent Nocturnal doesn't need to provide anything. You gain nothing from her but she gets her key back. Does your luck improve afterward? Nope. You do get a power from the Sepulcher, but that's not part of the deal that Karliah describes, it's what every pilgrim gets who completes the path.

In short, Nocturnal has no legal claim over you.

Ah, alright, thank you for explaining XD Im sorry, didnt quite get it at first, i dont get out much lol.

[Incunabulum]

Originally posted by Brandybuck:

You're also told you will get admitted to Shor's Hall. Akatosh would probably get first dibs, except that Shor outranks him (Shor being the Nord name for Lorkhan). The thing with the Dragonborn is that the rules don't apply.

Also, you never assented to a contract with Nocturnal, it was Karliah who did. The quest makes it seem like you did, but check the dialog out and you'll find that you did not actually agree. A half-assed lawyer could got you off in a heartbeat.

Hermaeus Mora only claims you soul if you head down a certain dialogue path. And then it's still not clear he will actually take it. These are not omnipotent and omniscient beings.

Look, you took the vendor trash armor - that's exactly the same as 'clicking agree to continue'.

[[deleted]]

Good thread. I remember getting confused about this when I first got to this part.

Originally posted by Brandybuck:

You're also told you will get admitted to Shor's Hall. Akatosh would probably get first dibs, except that Shor outranks him (Shor being the Nord name for Lorkhan). The thing with the Dragonborn is that the rules don't apply.

Also, you never assented to a contract with Nocturnal, it was Karliah who did. The quest makes it seem like you did, but check the dialog out and you'll find that you did not actually agree. A half-assed lawyer could got you off in a heartbeat.

Hermaeus Mora only claims you soul if you head down a certain dialogue path. And then it's still not clear he will actually take it. These are not omnipotent and omniscient beings.

Half-assed is censored on steam ?_?

[velvetsanity]

Dibella gets your soul if you're single, Mara if you're married :D

[DrSuperEvil]

Mora only gets souls if they get lost in their hunger for the knowledge of apocrypha.

[Gearheart]

Can I pick my drinking buddy, Sanguine?