Which factions would the canonical dragonborn join?

[xvii-Dietrich]

On my current playthrough (for the 10th anniversay of ES5 :) ), I am playing the default, "canonical dragonborn", namely: minimal mods, default build, studded armor with the iron gauntles/helmet/boots, banded iron shield and steel broadsword. Basically what you would see in the trailer/posters. I'm trying to play the role too: so using lots of shouts, no looting Nord tombs, etc..

But what I'm wondering is: would that "canonical dragonborn" join any factions?

I mean, I guess he wouldn't take sides with the Empire (outlawing Talos seems wrong), and the Dark Brotherhood also seems a bit out of character. But what the Stormcloaks? Or the Companions? Or Bards' College? Or any others?

[slayor3000]

Originalmente postado por alexander_dougherty:

Originalmente postado por slayor3000:

Almost true but I go further because I do get a little puzzled sometimes by the constant use of the word "canon" for this game. The game has no canon unless you wish to pick a side and even then some things are contradictory.

"a general law, rule, principle, or criterion by which something is judged."
"a collection or list of sacred books accepted as genuine."

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/canon
see 3C
"An accepted group or body of related works", given that the social standard is that the makers of a game/film define what is or isn't canon, this means Bethesda defines what is canon (God help us)

Yes.
Which is why that definition was left out, if you think I could approve or agree with what Bethesda sanctions, lol. They change the lore from game to game and with it everything else.
Even if you did agree with that, then sanctioning the canon, still makes "choose a side" still pertinent. Because each side sees its "canon" differently. Which is what my post is mainly about. Also answered the OP question on what would be more "canonical".

[Master Talon]

Originalmente postado por slayor3000:

Originalmente postado por Master Talon:

The only things that actually Canon with the Dragonborn Story is the main game's story and the Dragonborn DLC's main story and killing Harkon at the end of the Dawngaurd main story

Almost true but I go further because I do get a little puzzled sometimes by the constant use of the word "canon" for this game. The game has no canon unless you wish to pick a side and even then some things are contradictory.

"a general law, rule, principle, or criterion by which something is judged."
"a collection or list of sacred books accepted as genuine."

Each side views things differently. Nearly anything you may read has another book written by someone else that says the opposite.
Example is Orc lore. Two different stories of how Boethiah and Trinimac duelled.
Accounts of Orc tribes that existed well before Trinimac and Boethiahs encounter. Which is the truth? Even dates contradict themselves in the game.

So choose a side, Thalmor, Imperial etc and look at what is canon to them and you will see it is all contradictory.

Also over the DragonBorn - The original was Miraak an Atmoran.
The Atmorans that came to Tamriel were enslaved by the Ayelid. They later had a slave rebellion and eventually started the first Imperial Empire.
So the first Dragonborn was in reality an Imperial and not a Nord.
So if you want to play a "canonical" Dragonborn - choose Imperial.

my point was that we know that the main story is what the Last Dragonborn actually did and Canonically the Dragonborn is a male Nord and defeated Alduin, Harkon and Miraak.

[xvii-Dietrich]

Thanks everyone who has posted so far. It has been really interesting to read the different takes on the Stormcloak/Imperial dichotomy. Lots of things that I hadn't considered although, once pointed out... yes, good points all. I think this is part of what makes the setting so compelling... namely that the choice is not clear-cut, both sides are flawed, and the province politics are murky and complicated. And then there are the apparent inconsistencies.

I guess my use of the word "canon" was misguided. I apologise for that. As was pointed out, the "canon" is sort of what is set out in the lore and prophecies (such as that Dragonborn book, found early on). Perhaps I had more in mind that "sterotypical Dragonborn" (as per the trailers). The point about defeating Alduin, Harkon and Miraak, does define a few paths, but doesn't lock down the factions too much.

I've also been wondering about how the different factions react to having the Dragonborn in their ranks. I know that the civili war have a view on this, but I'll have to look into the others. However, some seem rather innocuous (e.g. Bards College), but others don't seem to sit well with the "sterotypical Dragonborn" (e.g. Dark Brotherhood).

[258789553873]

There's actually a word wall in the DB sanctuary, funny enough. I think there may be a few word walls locked behind the TG questline too. Really, I think all the quest lines have word walls that are only accessible by doing the questline. As for the ones where you can pick between two opposing sides, their quests largely run parallel to each other, so you have access to the same word walls no matter which side you choose.

As for people reacting to you being the dragonborn, its rare anyone mentions it. I think only the npcs involved in the main questline (and a few dragons you can talk to) ever mention it. It seems virtually no one realizes that you are dragonborn. There's actually this one npc in the game who'll initially express disbelief when you tell them that you're the dragonborn. I think the only Jarl that ever mentions it is Balgruuf. I've also seen a number of people complaining about how no one seems to realize you're the dragonborn. Then again, virtually none of the npcs in the game will realize you and various npcs are vampires, despite Dawnguard making them pretty freaking obvious. Maybe everyone in Skyrim is just stupid? Who knows.

[Trash boi]

i guess dragonborn would join if good at thing like join guild if he good at sneak speech lock pick

[Joizen18]

Originalmente postado por xvii-Dietrich:

On my current playthrough (for the 10th anniversay of ES5 :) ), I am playing the default, "canonical dragonborn", namely: minimal mods, default build, studded armor with the iron gauntles/helmet/boots, banded iron shield and steel broadsword. Basically what you would see in the trailer/posters. I'm trying to play the role too: so using lots of shouts, no looting Nord tombs, etc..

But what I'm wondering is: would that "canonical dragonborn" join any factions?

I mean, I guess he wouldn't take sides with the Empire (outlawing Talos seems wrong), and the Dark Brotherhood also seems a bit out of character. But what the Stormcloaks? Or the Companions? Or Bards' College? Or any others?

It makes alot sense for the dragonborn to join The Companions. I don't think that the dragonborn should join any side in the Civil War. It is pretty safe to assume that the dragonborn would follow the way of the voice and favor the Greybeards over the Blades. Arngeir has explained that the Greybeards refuse to involve themselves in politics, and won't take a side in the civilwar. They do however somewhat involves themselves during "Seasons Unending", but Arngeir is very clear that the Greybeards are very reluctant to do it and that it goes against everything they stand for. With this in mind, i highly doubt that the "cannonical" Dragonborn would do it either.

[Joizen18]

Originalmente postado por IXBlackWolfXI:

All we know so far is that NEITHER side's victory in the civil war is canon; the canon ending is the truce you help make during Season Unending, even though you can continue the civil war questline after doing that (its what I did on my first playthrough, I opted to save the Civil War quest for after the main storyline, seeing as the fate of the entire world seemed to be a bit more important).

The truce is not an ending though since they explicitly say that the meeting in High Hrothgar did not stop the war, only paused it so that the Dragonborn could get to Skuldafn. Then when the dragonborn returns to Skyrim, the civil war continues from where it paused (maybe even earlier when they realized that the Dragonborn had left).

[no1schmo]

Originalmente postado por IXBlackWolfXI:

snip

So I'm still not seeing any citation for the Aldmeri Dominion trying to destroy the world. Absolutely nothing suggests that in game, so until you can present it, I am calling BS.

If the Grey Quarter is so recent, why is it mentioned in old books? If no one else gets help, why are there two high-elf merchants in the main square, one of whom even has amiable chats with powerful locals and outright tells you it's the Dark Elves themselves who cordoned themselves off? Maybe you're right and I've forgotten a book, but even if you are, that just means we have contradictory accounts. Again, I am not denying that there are racists, and it's not Ulfric's high priority to deal with it, but you're not showing me anything that specifically says Ulfric himself caused this. And, like you admitted, the Empire also abandoned Morrowind at the first sign of trouble, so don't tell me they are nicer to Dark Elves (although why you say Morrowind joined only recently is odd; they joined when everyone else did, when Tiber Septim came knocking, although Morrowind got a better deal on account of their three demi-god rulers at the time). Also, if we're going to talk about, say, how Argonians are treated, let's recall that the Dunmer raided Black Marsh and enslaved Argonians regularly for thousands of years, and the Empire was totally fine with that (they also enslaved some Khajiit).

You sort of realized your own error about the Jarls; they basically all have problems. Balgruuf is maybe the best. But the rest on both sides have issues. Elisif seems nice, at least, but that's because she's a completely unprepared and incompetent child, a puppet Jarl who would be a puppet High Queen. The rest are corrupt, lazy, incompetent, etc. Again, the writers clearly wanted to make it not an obvious choice. I'm also curious about Torygg being an Ulfric supporter; pretty sure if the High King had thrown in with Ulfric to begin with, there'd be no Civil War. He may have liked Ulfric, like everyone did 20 years ago, but he wasn't actually a SUPPORTER, as far as I know.

Again, to me, it seems like the whole Empire has decayed; it already lost one war, and has done nothing but lick boots and spend it's time oppressing it's own people since--maybe it would be better for it to die off. I understand your logic that, hey, it still seems like the best counter to the Aldmeri Dominion, but real history shows that's often not the case; after Persia and the Byzantines slugged it out for centuries, the "primitive" Arab armies swarmed out, totally conquered Persia and much of the Roman land in a matter of a century. Perhaps striking when the two corrupt empires are weakened after another war is the best plan (and remember that the Dominion is also oppressing Valenwood, and probably Elswyr, to maintain control--they almost certainly have internal trouble too).