Trine 3

[TheTinFoilHatter13]

Ok, listen, this game is great so far, and I’m loving the story on its own merits. But it starts with the heroes living their seperate lives, the Astral Academy being back in order, and no mention of any of the conflict that was taking place in Trine 3. I thought that Trine 3 was pretty good, but since you very clearly ended it halfway through the story, and you abandoned the game to start on the sequel, I thought that the story arc would be continued here. Are you gonna release some kind of spinoff game, or a DLC/expansion for an existing one, that resolves the Artifacts Of Power saga? I would pay good money for any content that offers a proper resolution to the storyline. Just some food for thought

[Alcator]

While I'm not in any way affiliated with the developers, I followed the game ever since the beginning.
Trine 3 was a massive financial flop. They burned ALL the money they made from Trine 2 and ran out of it when they were just ONE THIRD of the planned progression through the game. That boss at the end of Trine 3 - that was supposed to be the end of the first act (out of three).
That's how expensive it is to make 3D platformers, as opposed to a 2D platformer.

Trine 3 was also received with mixed feelings, because the gameplay of Trine 1 and Trine 2 just wasn't there - no skill progression, no skillful combat, no complex puzzling... Many players of T1 and T2 don't want to replay T3.
As such, if the devs released some "continuation" of T3's story (even if it was in the 2.5D system of T1/2/4), it would pose a problem for those who don't know the story of T3 or don't want to play it.
It's best to just bury T3 and admit / accept that it was a step in the wrong direction.

[TheTinFoilHatter13]

Originally posted by Alcator:

While I'm not in any way affiliated with the developers, I followed the game ever since the beginning.
Trine 3 was a massive financial flop. They burned ALL the money they made from Trine 2 and ran out of it when they were just ONE THIRD of the planned progression through the game. That boss at the end of Trine 3 - that was supposed to be the end of the first act (out of three).
That's how expensive it is to make 3D platformers, as opposed to a 2D platformer.

Trine 3 was also received with mixed feelings, because the gameplay of Trine 1 and Trine 2 just wasn't there - no skill progression, no skillful combat, no complex puzzling... Many players of T1 and T2 don't want to replay T3.
As such, if the devs released some "continuation" of T3's story (even if it was in the 2.5D system of T1/2/4), it would pose a problem for those who don't know the story of T3 or don't want to play it.
It's best to just bury T3 and admit / accept that it was a step in the wrong direction.

Welp, now I'm just depressed. I enjoyed Trine 3, I had a thoroughly good time, and even if the game is dead in the water I'd like to see a proper resolution to the storyline. It was probably my favorite in the series in terms of the lore, the gorgeous locales and especially the creature design.

[AuraFB]

Yes, unfortunately we're not able to give Trine 3's storyline the conclusion it deserves right now. We still hope that we can do it one day, in one form or another, but currently we don't have the means to do so. Trine 4 takes place some time after the events of Trine 3 so 3 is still part of the official Trine canon (and it will remain so), but we wanted Trine 4 to be enjoyable for both new and old players alike so the events of the previous games aren't directly referenced in it.

[TheTinFoilHatter13]

Originally posted by LindaFB:

Yes, unfortunately we're not able to give Trine 3's storyline the conclusion it deserves right now. We still hope that we can do it one day, in one form or another, but currently we don't have the means to do so. Trine 4 takes place some time after the events of Trine 3 so 3 is still part of the official Trine canon (and it will remain so), but we wanted Trine 4 to be enjoyable for both new and old players alike so the events of the previous games aren't directly referenced in it.

That's understandable. I hope to see it get a proper resolution someday, thanks for responding in the meantime tho. Keep up the good work

[Terepin]

Again: Expansion Pack. The perfect and cheapest way to finish it. At least in some fashion.

[TheTinFoilHatter13]

Originally posted by Terepin:

Again: Expansion Pack. The perfect and cheapest way to finish it. At least in some fashion.

I agree. I’m assuming they’ll go back to 2.5D with the rest of the Artifacts Of Power story, so most likely it won’t be an update to Trine 3 itself, but it could easily be added on to Trine 4 or a future Trine game as a bonus story campaign. I’d be happy with anything as long as it gives us a proper resolution

[Terepin]

That's exactly what I had in my mind.

[JLarja]

Making an expansion isn't significantly cheaper than making another game. It would save some work on menus, but even those, like all the engine stuff (the renderer, network system and so on), is pretty easy to recycle to a new game.

-JLarja / Frozenbyte

[TheTinFoilHatter13]

Originally posted by JLarja:

Making an expansion isn't significantly cheaper than making another game. It would save some work on menus, but even those, like all the engine stuff (the renderer, network system and so on), is pretty easy to recycle to a new game.

-JLarja / Frozenbyte

Fair enough. It doesn't have to be the length of a full game though. It could be like the goblin uprising expansion levels for Trine 2, except as a prologue instead of an epilogue. I'm sure people would be happy to pay for it as a DLC for Trine 4 with the same 2.5D gameplay

[Terepin]

Originally posted by JLarja:

Making an expansion isn't significantly cheaper than making another game. It would save some work on menus, but even those, like all the engine stuff (the renderer, network system and so on), is pretty easy to recycle to a new game.

-JLarja / Frozenbyte

Looking back at EPs I played in the past like Doom 3: Resurrection of Evil (one of the, if not hte best EP ever created), Painkiller: Battle out of Hell, or F.E.A.R.: Perseus Mandate, a lot of stuff was recycled - menus, HUD, textures, sounds, AI, engine, etc. They were in development for a lot shorter time period than main games. They price tag was a lot cheaper too.
So in your case you wouldn't need to touch the engine, HUD, menus and a lot of game logic as well. I believe that would shave off a significant amount of time and finances. Plus, since expansion pack would require main game, it would support the main game as well. As a bonus, it would show that you are keeping the game alive and well.
I found The Goblin Menace to be an excellent expansion and would love to see something like that for Trine 4 as well. And as I said before, the fact that this game deals with dreams, it's a perfect opportunity to give Trine 3's storyline closure.

[Look! Its Billy McBoogerbuns]

I also really want a conclusion to The Artifacts of Power story and I'm glad to hear the team hasn't completely abandoned it and want to at least tell it in some form or another. I personally liked Trine 3 just as much as the others and I was so scared the franchise would end there due to all the circumstances surrounding the development and imo rather harsh reception, so imagine my joy upon finding out Trine 4 was in development!

Frozenbyte, I love you guys so much and Trine truly means a lot to me, I just wanted to let that be known if anybody's reading :)
Btw, I love that you guys named this one 'Trine 4: The Nightmare Prince' instead of just 'Trine: The Nightmare Prince', still acknowledging Trine 3 (and another way I won't spoil)! Plus I just like numbered sequels lol.

[TheTinFoilHatter13]

Originally posted by Look! Its Billy McBoogerbuns:

I also really want a conclusion to The Artifacts of Power story and I'm glad to hear the team hasn't completely abandoned it and want to at least tell it in some form or another. I personally liked Trine 3 just as much as the others and I was so scared the franchise would end there due to all the circumstances surrounding the development and imo rather harsh reception, so imagine my joy upon finding out Trine 4 was in development!

Frozenbyte, I love you guys so much and Trine truly means a lot to me, I just wanted to let that be known if anybody's reading :)
Btw, I love that you guys named this one 'Trine 4: The Nightmare Prince' instead of just 'Trine: The Nightmare Prince', still acknowledging Trine 3 (and another way I won't spoil)! Plus I just like numbered sequels lol.

Maybe there's some clues to how the rest of the story went down in this game. Don't spoil it, I'll find out in good time!

[Look! Its Billy McBoogerbuns]

Originally posted by TheTinFoilHatter13:

Maybe there's some clues to how the rest of the story went down in this game. Don't spoil it, I'll find out in good time!

It's nothing major so don't get your hopes up too much, but don't worry I won't spoil anything ;) Just know to get all the Knicknacks collectibles.

[JLarja]

Originally posted by Terepin:

Originally posted by JLarja:

Making an expansion isn't significantly cheaper than making another game. It would save some work on menus, but even those, like all the engine stuff (the renderer, network system and so on), is pretty easy to recycle to a new game.

-JLarja / Frozenbyte

Looking back at EPs I played in the past like Doom 3: Resurrection of Evil (one of the, if not hte best EP ever created), Painkiller: Battle out of Hell, or F.E.A.R.: Perseus Mandate, a lot of stuff was recycled - menus, HUD, textures, sounds, AI, engine, etc. They were in development for a lot shorter time period than main games. They price tag was a lot cheaper too.

I was talking about a Trine expansion vs. a Trine game. Other games, genres and studios may or may not be similar.

Originally posted by Terepin:

So in your case you wouldn't need to touch the engine, HUD, menus and a lot of game logic as well. I believe that would shave off a significant amount of time and finances.

We could do all that for a separate game too. It would be pretty bad (no new skills, only few maps), but only reason expansion would be better are lower expectations. The market would be smaller, as some people don't buy DLCs, or even take note of them.

Originally posted by Terepin:

I found The Goblin Menace to be an excellent expansion and would love to see something like that for Trine 4 as well. And as I said before, the fact that this game deals with dreams, it's a perfect opportunity to give Trine 3's storyline closure.

I think The Goblin Menace is a great expansion too, but it also took lot of work to get done. Probably about as many man-months per level as original game, if not more. It has new skills (also available in main game) and lots of tweaks under the hood (which benefited the main game too). The fact that it was a paid expansion actually meant that significant amount of work was required to handle online game between players with and without the expansion.

What The Goblin Menace thought us was that creating a paid expansion is much work, while the target market will be limited to those who already own the main game. I'm not the one making decisions about what projects we pursue or not, but I believe the thinking is still, that either an expansion is worth doing as a free update (like The Goblin Menace is now or like the arena update for Nine Parchments was made), or it's better to save it for another game.

All that said, I would personally love to see conclusion to Trine 3. I wouldn't just want it to be some three-map-quick-and-dirty wrap-up though. If it can't be done well, better not to do it at all. Everyone's free to disagree with that, of course.

-JLarja / Frozenbyte

[Terepin]

Originally posted by JLarja:

What The Goblin Menace thought us was that creating a paid expansion is much work, while the target market will be limited to those who already own the main game. I'm not the one making decisions about what projects we pursue or not, but I believe the thinking is still, that either an expansion is worth doing as a free update (like The Goblin Menace is now or like the arena update for Nine Parchments was made), or it's better to save it for another game.

You should taker notes from CD Project Red. They had huge success with The Witcher 3 Expansion Packs. And why? First off, they made a clear distinction between DLC and Expansion Pack. You see, while every Expansion Pack is DLC, not every DLC is Expansion Pack. And while many people are allergic to the term DLC, I never met anyone having issue with Expansion Pack. That's because, unlike DLC, it actually adds value for its money. The biggest mistake you made with The Goblin Menace was to call it a DLC, when in fact it was an Expansion Pack. That alone turned off a lot of potential buyers. Another thing to consider is the possibility to make a stand-alone Expansion Pack. My point is there are ways how to pull this off right. Just please don't make the same mistake of calling it a DLC again.

P.S.: The Talos Principle, which is a pure puzzle game, also got one. So it is possible. You just need to believe. ;)