After 63h i can say balance overall is pretty good.

[Sonnenbank]

So i reached 4000+ combat rating today and in total played for 48h while also watching ~ 15h of Twitch high level gameplay. ( jrm1ah, CaveRetin, Freshmeditations, EndoZoa)

So overall 63h that i did spend on learning this game.

I think outside of old Starcraft Broodwar (which i had 3600h)this game seems to have the best Balance i ever noticed in any game.

There is no question that some Units are a bit stronger that others.

Stormcallers and Vulcans are S Tier imo.
Ofc they can be counterd but overall they are a tiny bit too good .

There are also Units that are a bit too situational and overall a bit too weak.
Rhino and Wasps i would consider B- since they are only good for winning 1 or 2 rounds but get insanely hard counterd if you commit to them.

Also Overlord is a tiny bit too weak compared to the other Giants


But every unit has its place and can decide a game if used at the correct moment

Overall i am insanely impressed though
I have lost vs 20+ different strategies and i have won with 20+ different strategies

My tipp for all the guys saying Unit xy is op is :

Play the unit as your core unit yourself and see how you eventually will meet players
who destroy you by good positioning with the right counter units.

I played a lot of Hacker + Fangs lately
My winrate is ~ 50%

I got destroyed by Boat switch ... i got destroyed by Mass Stormcallers... i got destroyed by counter Hackers with better positioniung... i got destroyed by cards and i got destroyed by tower pressure.....

I also won a lot of games with Hackers but really:

Before saying something is op -> use it yourself every game and eventually you will meet more and more players who destroy you.

[Kopernik]

balance even at this points is very good, i also use a lots of strats for fun and tests. Still dont like haker i just refuse to use it (i can recall once or twice to see how ppl react to it but not to play on regular basis) i dont know but it look alien design compared to other unit and it's just annoing to me i would rather see it as healer/necro/ or making units explode rather than what it is today

the least used units by me are wasps - like their desing but they need a LARGE buff desperatly, only brought them if gone overlord mothership tech since spawns have the same tech i buy 1 squad to buy tech to make spawns stronger but other than that i just been loosing them all the time

next i rhino but recently i just place it at last line to make it come into battlefield as a dead last it works rather well but still i would like to see them buffed

no other balance problems for me i use all units depending on the starting units of cards i get.

[Sonnenbank]

Originally posted by Kopernik:

the least used units by me are wasps - like their desing but they need a LARGE buff desperatly, only brought them if gone overlord mothership tech since spawns have the same tech i buy 1 squad to buy tech to make spawns stronger but other than that i just been loosing them all the time

....

Funny you say that ;)
FreshPro just went 9-0 on stream with Wasps as core unit backed up by Vulcans with fire rockets on 23K combat rating.
His stream name is freshmeditations on twitch

I thought so too that wasps are not good except for winning 1-2 rounds....

But then again
he went 9-0 using them as core of his army every of the 9 games on the highest ratings.

I am at 5K now ..... went 10-1 on 4K ....:P and marched straight through it.
many of my wins were vs people trying to use wasps or overcommiting on snipers
So i had the same impression as you
i only used them to back up my overlords with wasp tech

[puschit]

I guess Wasps are like Fangs: Weak until they get a crapload of support and unlocked abilities but then they rock, if not for the fact that opponents underestimate them and have no experience how to kill an entire horde. They DO have more abilities than other units to choose from and most of them are pretty good.
However, much like the famed Fang spam, I have yet to meet anyone using that strategy.

[Iso Koala]

Originally posted by Kopernik:

the least used units by me are wasps - like their desing but they need a LARGE buff desperatly, only brought them if gone overlord mothership tech since spawns have the same tech i buy 1 squad to buy tech to make spawns stronger but other than that i just been loosing them all the time

I use wasps all the time as the core attack force, and win all the time doing it. Well not ALL the time of course, but still, I have no problem making wasp armies. Be sure to take the Shield tech for them , that makes them 400% better against snipers, motherships, fortress, and phonixis.
And vulcan is often mandatory support for them, to take mustangs out. Wasps spam are good way to force enemy use mustangs, which then become obsolete with the vulcan, but your wasps are still working.

[ben]

Dont think Vulcans are OP in anyway and my current strategy revolves around baiting my opponent into investing in them.

[Shakajolt]

Originally posted by Sonnenbank:

Originally posted by Shakajolt:

Define "different strategies". Most games just boiil down to snipers or overlords, or a combo of both.
Certain units get unlocked and played almost every game, while others rarely show up. That's not balanced, that's just checkers with extra flaire.

Thats not my experience at all.
Its also not what i see at highest level on twitch.

Nobody plays the "highest level no twitch". Games are 90% casuals 10% tryhards. Catering to that 10% is what kills games like this. The average player is the one that matters, and for the average player, every game is the same.
And right now, every ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game boils down to "someone got 10 overlords first and is uncounterable, because phoenixes get ♥♥♥♥♥♥, snipers get ♥♥♥♥♥♥, and mustangs get ♥♥♥♥♥♥."

[Sonnenbank]

In the End FreshPro went 11-2 on highest level with forcing mass wasps every game.
In the end it becomes a game of positioning since the normal sequence will be like this

round 3 or 4 go mass wasps and win the round
enemy forces Mustangs and you force Vulcan
enemy forces Steelballs or/and Melting point
you need Counter Melting point and fangs to block the steelballs

What will decide the game is if he manages to break through to your tower or not

@Shakajolt i am gonna ignore you
all you do is cry all day how you dont like the game and everything is unfair....

today i went from 4000 to 5000 going 10-1 so all pretty low level
and i used Overlords 1 game and Snipers 2 games....
My oponents spammed snipers most of the time which made them lose....
I dont know how your oponent can get 10 Overlords....
Most of my games end with maximum 3 Giant Units for one side

Overlord by most good players is considerd slightly underpowerd....

edit: you also messed up how to quote >-<
Now it looks like what you said is what i said T_T when indeed i said what looks like what you said >-<

[Shakajolt]

Originally posted by Sonnenbank:

@Shakajolt i am gonna ignore you
all you do is cry all day how you dont like the game and everything is unfair....

All you do is post lies and can't e ven punctuate properly. Most gamers have lives, and don't want to earn a freaking bachelor's degree in every game they play. This game doesn't even have proper matchmaking.
Most units are worthless and just serve as cannon fodder until someone can easily snowball on turn 3/4 into an automatic win that their opponent has no way to recover from.

today i went from 4000 to 5000 going 10-1 so all pretty low level
and i used Overlords 1 game and Snipers 2 games....

Congrats, you confirmed the meta is still about 1 broken unit, ignoring the majority of units because the game is poorly balanced and far too opaque for most players. Hence why you see the same people in matches game after game.

I dont know how your oponent can get 10 Overlords...

A) Hyperbole
B) Turn 6/7 drops.
The game is broken, and fans telling the devs "everything is fine" is why it's going to be another flash-in-the-pan PVP that might survive for a little while on good faith, but will quickly fall by the wayside.


Pros experiences don't matter unless you have a player base in the hundreds of thousands, minimum. Outside that, you need to ensure casual players can actually play the game. Otherwise, you just scare off any new blood and the old gets bored and moves to the next new thing for them to sweat and dominate.

[Sonnenbank]

I truly feel sorry for you.

pointing out that you messed up quoting is actually important cause you quoted me on things i didnt say .
you messed up the .[.quote.]. brackets....so that it looks like i said things.... which is not what happend

calling me a liar for saying the game is actually pretty good balanced between the units and strategies is just cheap....

sarcasm:
So highest level doesnt matter according to you
me having success at low and mid levels with tons of different strategies also does not matter
what matters is that you are angry because you lose a lot

okay dude
best for your mental health to move on and play a different game
a game the relies mostly on your ability to analyse situations and come to the right conclusions is not a good game for a person with very limited abilities in that area

[ben]

Originally posted by Shakajolt:

Define "different strategies". Most games just boiil down to snipers or overlords, or a combo of both.
Certain units get unlocked and played almost every game, while others rarely show up. That's not balanced, that's just checkers with extra flaire.

Loool, this is not remotely close to true.

[Shakajolt]

Originally posted by ben:

Loool, this is not remotely close to true.

You're meta =/= the meta bud. Every game I see winds up using 2~3 units constantly and half the roster doesn't see play. The half that does is purely because it's starting units.

[puschit]

Originally posted by Shakajolt:

Originally posted by ben:

Loool, this is not remotely close to true.

You're meta =/= the meta bud. Every game I see winds up using 2~3 units constantly and half the roster doesn't see play. The half that does is purely because it's starting units.

You aren't either! I, too, cannot confirm your claims. In my region (around 5000 CP) it is very mixed and mirrors more or less the forum posts here: All the units that are frequently called OP are played which means almost every units with the exception of Stormcallers that are played but not much. Fangs and Wasps are rarely seen, Hackers begin to be utilized but it is mainly myself that is using them.
Also, the lower rating the region is you play in, the less indicative the meta of that region will be regarding balance and actual diversity. Because lower players don't know how to utilize certain units, they stick to the ones that are easy use. More importantly they copy what other players do and don't have the skills to evaluate outcomes of battles. Hence they will copy each other, unaware of other strategies, causing an inbred meta that has nothing to do with the actual capabilities of units.

[♠↔Fao™]

Dude enlight me on how you counter StormFckcallers? Even if you manage to tell me how you come back from the initiative you lost when it cost 200 ressources for your opponent?

[Iso Koala]

Originally posted by ♠↔Fao™:

Dude enlight me on how you counter StormFckcallers? Even if you manage to tell me how you come back from the initiative you lost when it cost 200 ressources for your opponent?

Wasp, or any aerial units. Vulcans with extended range.
Scariest thing in Storms is not their damage even, but their EMP, that can shut down Melting Points.

[puschit]

First step: Realize you don't need to win every round. This games seems like a ping-pong game where you answere A with B and B with C every single round until someone loses but that just isn't the case. Usually I just follow my own plans, adjust them slightly, lose the early rounds and win later. I can't give you a standard recipe because every game is different. But things I often do is placing Sledgehammers at strategic points. At level 2 with Field maintenance upgrade they tank Callers long enough or even outpace them. Sometimes it's Fortress with shield bubble that protects my other units, especially when I can pick up the reinforcement card that buffs shields. Could be air units. Could be a strong flanking. Could be anything ... including starting off with setups and units that discourage the use of Stormcallers. My enemies rarely use more than 2 anyway because they just aren't the end-em-all units many think they are.