Look at the XML Files. This IS a Civ V re-skin. :(

[stp602]

</3 This is incredibly disappointing.

I finished my first playthrough, and I found the affinity system to be illogical almost to the point of nonsense, because a player can max out all three paths, even though they are oppositional philosophies of life.

So I decided to look into the XML files. What I found were A LOT of materials that directly pertained to Civ V----"garbage files" such as civ technology era materials and diplomatic council and victory mechanics.... all of which are elements that don't exist in this game at all. There are even XML references to the great persons mechanics that are not a part of CivBE.

Open up your CivBE folder. Dig into assets gameplay xml info. Start poking around, then compare some of the files you find in there with their Civ V counterparts.

Fraxis, I never did climb aboard the hype train, but I did expect that after two or three DLC packages that this game would evolve into something amazing. But finding that this is not a unique product, but has been built directly upon existing code from a previous game, in spite of your very explicit claim that this is a whole new engine.... you disappoint me. This is dishonesty of the worst caliber.

[Sir_Chester]

cool story bro

[VDZ]

Originally posted by stp602:

in spite of your very explicit claim that this is a whole new engine....

When did they ever claim this? I thought it was pretty obvious it was using Civ V's engine from the moment we saw the first screenshots.

[stp602]

Fraxis repeatedly claimed that this wasn't a Civ 5 reskin, that it was a whole new game with a whole new engine. If it was a whole new game with a whole new engine, then there shouldn't be a boat-load of Civ V XML files that weren't trimmed out before launch.

I'm digging deeper into some of the other game components, and it is looking more and more like the engine is almost entirely intact from Civ V.

[screamingpalm]

It wasn't obvious like... a long time ago? I don't ever remember them saying it was a new engine. I wouldn't quite say reskin, but more like a total conversion mod perhaps. But really, this was already easily evident way back when lol. How is this a revelation?

[Natjur]

The fun part, is when you get Civ V to load up and look a lot like Civ : Beyond Earth by copying xml files and resource files into the Civ V directory.

[katzenkrimis]

Originally posted by stp602:

This is not a unique product, but has been built directly upon existing code.

game,

Except for the unit upgrade interface, which looks like it was ripped right out of XCOM.

And the virtue tree interface, which looks like it was ripped right out of Lotro, but Lotro stole it from someone else, who in turn, stole it from someone else.

Damn those virtue trees. They are in every bloody game nowadays.

[stp602]

The unit upgrade interface isn't a new engine. It's really little more than graphical flavor with a selection menu. The virtue tree doesn't take a whole lot to build, either. Based on the type of script used in these files, I could probably construct everything except for the graphical components of a custom virtue tree within a matter of a couple of hours.

The claim made repeatedly by Fraxis was that this game wasn't a Civ V reskin, but a brand new game with a whole new engine. And that's bullocks.

[SamBC]

The statements Firaxis/2K made were always that it was a whole new game, but clearly admitted they were building on Civ5 as a base, using the same engine (with some refinement). I'm not sure where, when or why you got the wrong end of the stick on that one.

[Syzy]

Its been said many times that each Civ is built on top of the code of the last, and that you can find relics of code from all the games in each new version

[stp602]

The very first words in the E3 Trailer is "a new science fiction entry into the civilization family of games". The language here---family of games---implies that this is a new civilization stand-alone product, not an extension of an existing line.

Further, there's no single statement anywhere on the Beyond Earth page that actually states that this is built upon Civ V. With paragraphs such as "Sid Meier’s Civilization: Beyond Earth is a new science-fiction-themed entry into the award winning Civilization series. As part of an expedition sent to find a home beyond Earth, lead your people into a new frontier, explore and colonize an alien planet and create a new civilization in space.", every attempt is made to distingush BE as its' own product.

By contrast, a product line extension doesn't strive to separate itself from its' roots, but to boast upon how it will improve the core product it is extending. At a 50$ US price point, the claim is inherently made that this is a brand new game. Existing product line extensions don't merit a $50 price point unless they commanded the construction of as much new content as the original product required for its' initial production. BE is not that revolutionary, above and beyond what Civ V was.

I could go further, and start digging into some of the promo materials which are not on steam but elsewhere online, but never once did I see anything that said this was a product line extension, and everything on the subject claims this to be an original good. People who haven't been involved in marketing probably don't see the difference, but I know an integrity failure when I see one. It's all about what you don't say, so customers draw the conclusions you want them to draw, and to pay the price tag of a brand new product for a re-skin of an existing and established commodity.

It's not about the money. It's about the ethics of the decision. This should have been promoted as Civilization V---Beyond Earth, not as Civilization: Beyond Earth. The distinction is a matter of honesty.

[SamBC]

All the interviews and press spots from the announcement onwards mentioned the fact it was built on the old engine. None of the things you're pointing at contradict that, you just read them as having an implication that they were not intended to give.

It's a new game, using the older engine. This happens all the time.

[Mike_Stock12]

....that's just ridiculous. Get upset that Beyond Earth isn't a radical departure from Civ V, but don't get mad that the games advertisements didn't have flashy, bold font proclaiming "BUILT USING THE CIV V ENGINE!!!!". Literally 10 seconds of Google searching reveals that Beyond Earth uses the Civ V engine, from articles as early as April of this year. This isn't something that the devs have been trying to hide. I think Beyond Earth could (and will) be better, especially after the usual plethora of patches and DLC/expansions, much in the same way Civ V is much, much better now with its multiple expansions than it was when vanilla Civ V was first released. Beyond Earth IS its own product, and that will only become more apparent as more time passes.

[VDZ]

Originally posted by stp602:

Fraxis repeatedly claimed that this wasn't a Civ 5 reskin, that it was a whole new game with a whole new engine.

When did they ever claim this? I thought it was pretty obvious it was using Civ V's engine from the moment we saw the first screenshots.

Originally posted by stp602:

The claim made repeatedly by Fraxis was that this game wasn't a Civ V reskin, but a brand new game with a whole new engine. And that's bullocks.

When did they ever claim this? I thought it was pretty obvious it was using Civ V's engine from the moment we saw the first screenshots.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_by_assertion

[Misfit Eye]

Getting tired of the "reskin/mod" whine. Clearly, regardless of file names and some things in them, Civ:BE is not Civ#5. It is just not.

1) The Tech Web - no pipeline development
2) Aliens - react diffently depending on how you intereact with them. You can even get some of them under your control. You cannot do that with barbs...
3) trade is not at all mandatory.
4) If this was a reskin then the faction leaders would not be so annoyingly one dimensional
5) There is no history involved
6) and a few other things.

[Boink]

Originally posted by Orion Nipp:

Getting tired of the "reskin/mod" whine. Clearly, regardless of file names and some things in them, Civ:BE is not Civ#5. It is just not.

1) The Tech Web - no pipeline development
2) Aliens - react diffently depending on how you intereact with them. You can even get some of them under your control. You cannot do that with barbs...
3) trade is not at all mandatory.
4) If this was a reskin then the faction leaders would not be so annoyingly one dimensional
5) There is no history involved
6) and a few other things.

1) The pipeline is done by scaled costs - you'll note that each layer of the onion has a distinct jump in research costs

2) Aliens - coded badly, not working as intended atm

3) LOL. You've no idea how badly trade is broken atm (esp. internal trading) so that gets a massive "whatever"

3a) Oh, did you mean with the AI? Well... of course. There are only six strategic resources, no luxuries and Stations can't hold territory, there's no culture / religion push and no world council. Phew, I'm glad I know why trading with the AI is pointless

4) Wut.

5) Wut.

6) Wut.



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