Weapon Orders

[snuspak]

As the south, what is the best way to optimise weapon orders? Even with 25% weapon proficiency project, both the heavy industry and railroad faction traits, the time to produce the weapons has not changed. At this point, it would be impossible to create more armies without them running mixed muskets unless I want to play the campaign for three years. Any help? How do I decrease the time to produce weapons?

[LCcmdr]

This mechanic is geared to slow down weapon procurement.

First, get diplomacy 1 & 2 and start buying European rifles.

Second, produce 1,000 rifles as often as orders are completed. This raises the standardization for that particular weapon, allowing you to order 10,000 at much shorter order times (once standardization is higher).

Third, focus on military projects (and Military 1 and 2 in policies) to unlock the better weapons. To do this more rapidly, go to the finance tab and move the subsidy setting for "Military" to the highest possible setting on the slider bar. Once you have accumulated enough the Projects tab will highlight with a red-colored ! indicating it time to pick.

Though the better weapons are clearly superior and allow for easier wins on the battlefield, the lowly 6lb smooth bore cannons are terribly underrated when deployed well. Also, the 12 and 24 lb howitzers are short ranged but excellent field pieces. I've readjusted my recent play style slowly upgrading weapons. Lowly muskets and Springfield smooth bores are more fun now, even when outclassed. This makes me build more battlefield cover.

[snuspak]

Originally posted by LCcmdr:

This mechanic is geared to slow down weapon procurement.

First, get diplomacy 1 & 2 and start buying European rifles.

Second, produce 1,000 rifles as often as orders are completed. This raises the standardization for that particular weapon, allowing you to order 10,000 at much shorter order times (once standardization is higher).

Third, focus on military projects (and Military 1 and 2 in policies) to unlock the better weapons. To do this more rapidly, go to the finance tab and move the subsidy setting for "Military" to the highest possible setting on the slider bar. Once you have accumulated enough the Projects tab will highlight with a red-colored ! indicating it time to pick.

Though the better weapons are clearly superior and allow for easier wins on the battlefield, the lowly 6lb smooth bore cannons are terribly underrated when deployed well. Also, the 12 and 24 lb howitzers are short ranged but excellent field pieces. I've readjusted my recent play style slowly upgrading weapons. Lowly muskets and Springfield smooth bores are more fun now, even when outclassed. This makes me build more battlefield cover.

It has been a year into the war. I have completed about 3 orders of 3000 weapons for the plain and mississipi rifle. I sent those rifles to my armies as soon as they were ready. I dont think time reduced even a day and that was with 3 or 4 levels in weapon production efficiency.
Am I supposed to keep the weapons in the national stockpile to reduce the time? Im so confused as to why the time to make has not gone down even with a focus on industry, rails, weapon production and 3 orders of the rifles equal to about 9k plus whatever I had at the beginning of the campaign. I get that its not supposed to be super fast but damn why isnt it going down?

[Duck]

Originally posted by LCcmdr:

This mechanic is geared to slow down weapon procurement.

First, get diplomacy 1 & 2 and start buying European rifles.

Second, produce 1,000 rifles as often as orders are completed. This raises the standardization for that particular weapon, allowing you to order 10,000 at much shorter order times (once standardization is higher).

Third, focus on military projects (and Military 1 and 2 in policies) to unlock the better weapons. To do this more rapidly, go to the finance tab and move the subsidy setting for "Military" to the highest possible setting on the slider bar. Once you have accumulated enough the Projects tab will highlight with a red-colored ! indicating it time to pick.

Though the better weapons are clearly superior and allow for easier wins on the battlefield, the lowly 6lb smooth bore cannons are terribly underrated when deployed well. Also, the 12 and 24 lb howitzers are short ranged but excellent field pieces. I've readjusted my recent play style slowly upgrading weapons. Lowly muskets and Springfield smooth bores are more fun now, even when outclassed. This makes me build more battlefield cover.

question for you that I have been wondering about. Do you have to do 1k batches? Or if you order 50k, does standardization increase each time 1k are delivered?

[Wrigley]

Originally posted by snuspak:

It has been a year into the war. I have completed about 3 orders of 3000 weapons for the plain and mississipi rifle. I sent those rifles to my armies as soon as they were ready. I dont think time reduced even a day and that was with 3 or 4 levels in weapon production efficiency.
Am I supposed to keep the weapons in the national stockpile to reduce the time? Im so confused as to why the time to make has not gone down even with a focus on industry, rails, weapon production and 3 orders of the rifles equal to about 9k plus whatever I had at the beginning of the campaign. I get that its not supposed to be super fast but damn why isnt it going down?

Mississippi and Plains rifles in particular are extremely slow to procure. The historical reason, I believe, is that they were high quality weapons so it just took more time and skill to make them, plus they had been phased out so there weren't that many people/machines to build them.

You'll have a much better time getting the "Confederate Rifles" project. But going for imports is also fine. More expensive, but they are delivered quite quickly.

[snuspak]

Originally posted by Wrigley:

Originally posted by snuspak:

It has been a year into the war. I have completed about 3 orders of 3000 weapons for the plain and mississipi rifle. I sent those rifles to my armies as soon as they were ready. I dont think time reduced even a day and that was with 3 or 4 levels in weapon production efficiency.
Am I supposed to keep the weapons in the national stockpile to reduce the time? Im so confused as to why the time to make has not gone down even with a focus on industry, rails, weapon production and 3 orders of the rifles equal to about 9k plus whatever I had at the beginning of the campaign. I get that its not supposed to be super fast but damn why isnt it going down?

Mississippi and Plains rifles in particular are extremely slow to procure. The historical reason, I believe, is that they were high quality weapons so it just took more time and skill to make them, plus they had been phased out so there weren't that many people/machines to build them.

You'll have a much better time getting the "Confederate Rifles" project. But going for imports is also fine. More expensive, but they are delivered quite quickly.

Does it matter if I keep the guns in the stockpile or give them to my armies?

[LCcmdr]

No, it doesn't matter whether weapons are stockpiled or distributed.

MS rifles and Plains rifles have more complex production issues and don't scale up in standardization as quickly as Springfield rifles.

In my experience, more order of 1000 gains standardization increase faster than 3 orders of 5k or 10k. The reason, I suspect is this, numerous smaller orders of 6 1k batches simply increases std faster than 3 batches of more. So, frequency increases std faster. (I read that somewhere; but, I don't remember if it was in tutorial, the manual, or some post here.)

[snuspak]

Originally posted by LCcmdr:

No, it doesn't matter whether weapons are stockpiled or distributed.

MS rifles and Plains rifles have more complex production issues and don't scale up in standardization as quickly as Springfield rifles.

In my experience, more order of 1000 gains standardization increase faster than 3 orders of 5k or 10k. The reason, I suspect is this, numerous smaller orders of 6 1k batches simply increases std faster than 3 batches of more. So, frequency increases std faster. (I read that somewhere; but, I don't remember if it was in tutorial, the manual, or some post here.)

ok, i will try to mainly focus on the cheaper rifles and do 1k at a time, thank you!

[Towlie]

Actually sent a message to the devs on FB about this as it got me curious. If 1k of rifles gets the standardization up faster it made sense before because you would get the order in a lump sum. However with the trickle in of weapons now all rifles made (no matter how many), in theory, should all have the same standardization. Essentially by bringing in the trickle rifles and not the lump sum it SHOULD have made the 1k thing obsolete, wouldn't it?

[rahonbass]

Yes and no. The order uses the standardization at time of purchase to determine how long the order will take. Yes you will get guns and a rise in standardization over time but building up a bit with small orders then putting in large orders is still a good idea. I generally go for 5k guns/64 cannons for 2 orders then put in a large order.

[Towlie]

Originally posted by rahonbass:

Yes and no. The order uses the standardization at time of purchase to determine how long the order will take. Yes you will get guns and a rise in standardization over time but building up a bit with small orders then putting in large orders is still a good idea. I generally go for 5k guns/64 cannons for 2 orders then put in a large order.

If anything that SHOULD work in reverse though, long term. I mean you can produce 1k at a time but if you produce 1k of this and 1k of that then really the bigger orders should take less time over time since the industry would only be making 1 type of item very an extensive amount of time.

Kind of like Hearts of Iron where if you switch construction to something else you lose all the bonuses you had with them since you're essentially starting new. The longer you leave the same item to be built and the more they build it the better they get though.

[Towlie]

From the Devs:

"Standardization increases with number of said weapons. The trickle happens only within orders. So previously, if you ordered 50k weapons with low standardization, it would take ages. It was better to order smaller batches. Now, in same situation, the 50k weapons are delivered bit by bit and this increases standardization faster."

Essentially means makes no difference anymore I think except just extra micromanaging for the 1k ones.

[Duck]

Originally posted by Towlie:

From the Devs:

"Standardization increases with number of said weapons. The trickle happens only within orders. So previously, if you ordered 50k weapons with low standardization, it would take ages. It was better to order smaller batches. Now, in same situation, the 50k weapons are delivered bit by bit and this increases standardization faster."

Essentially means makes no difference anymore I think except just extra micromanaging for the 1k ones.

thanks!!!

[rahonbass]

Originally posted by Towlie:

Originally posted by rahonbass:

Yes and no. The order uses the standardization at time of purchase to determine how long the order will take. Yes you will get guns and a rise in standardization over time but building up a bit with small orders then putting in large orders is still a good idea. I generally go for 5k guns/64 cannons for 2 orders then put in a large order.

If anything that SHOULD work in reverse though, long term. I mean you can produce 1k at a time but if you produce 1k of this and 1k of that then really the bigger orders should take less time over time since the industry would only be making 1 type of item very an extensive amount of time.

Kind of like Hearts of Iron where if you switch construction to something else you lose all the bonuses you had with them since you're essentially starting new. The longer you leave the same item to be built and the more they build it the better they get though.

Think of the first few small orders like the prototypes and 1st production runs. Takes time to both manufacture the machinery and tooling to create the product and then test it in the field and make adjustments based on feedback. Then rebuild the tooling to account for the changes etc.

I need to do more testing on how the increase in standardization affects an order in progress. I have a feeling there is a sweet spot for order size for weapons with no standardization.

[Duck]

based upon some of the comments on this thread, I started tinkering.
(as union, summer 61) After initially unlocking springfields, an order of 50k was expected to take 500 some odd days. So I ordered a batch of 1k instead. Once delivered, i checked again. Now an order of 50k is only 233 days, so roughly cut in half. I have not documented, but in other campaigns I ordered an initial 50k batch, and only had received roughly 35k after about a year. To me, this suggests there is some value in ordering a small initial batch before massive orders.

[LCcmdr]

That is absolutely equal to my experience. I order minimum batches, enduring muskets until standardization climbs high enough to produce 3k rifles roughly every month. That leaves me fighting with the least effective weapons but allows the AI some breathing room with quicker access to better projects and weapons.

Doing min, frequent orders with artillery pays the same standardization increases--only about 50% slower.