I had the carpenter and the carpenter's mate around the wrong way for a long time.

[McFuzz]

Am I racist?

[Uhumsk]

It's not actually an unreasonable assumption to make for the time period - they are both American by nationality, and in the first decade of the 1800s it is unlikely that a Euro-American would accept a subordinate position under an African-American. How likely it is that the pair would find hire on a British ship I have no idea, but I suspect it would be difficult for a non-european to get a position as officer or tradesman aboard a ship.

[Badger]

I think it was reasonable to think that, because when we see them in the carpenters room one of them is cutting while the other has a hammer. In that chapter there's no indication who falls under who. It isn't until the Soldier of the Seas chapter that we get the audio cue that the guy who threw the axe is the subordinate.

[Bees?]

Plus, it's pretty easy to miss that he's referring to the other guy when he says "Come on, Boss!". I thought he was just taunting the monster initially.

[McFuzz]

Originally posted by Bees?:

Plus, it's pretty easy to miss that he's referring to the other guy when he says "Come on, Boss!". I thought he was just taunting the monster initially.

That's the one that made me think the boss was not the African-American, because he was behind the Carpenter's mate, like he was trying to pull him away. It wasn't until I read the log specifically that I realized who was speaking.

[Butterfly]

Originally posted by Frank McFuzz:

It wasn't until I read the log specifically that I realized who was speaking.

The log is incredibly important for this reason. I had a lot of trouble with a few of the deaths before I specifically looked at the log to try and decipher who exactly was saying what.

[McFuzz]

This game is criminally underrated. I'm shocked it doesn't have as much of a quick explosion of cult followers as Paper's Please did. How do we fix that?

[Badger]

Originally posted by Bees?:

Plus, it's pretty easy to miss that he's referring to the other guy when he says "Come on, Boss!". I thought he was just taunting the monster initially.

you might skip over it at first, but after you see that both of them are carpenters, their faces become unblurred. What I did to finalize it was that I noted how many memories both were in, and I went through the memories of the white guy. He had fewer, meaning I'd be spending less time trying to figure out his identity. I came across the "Come on Boss" line almost immediately, and it fell into place.

[Lim-Dul]

Originally posted by Frank McFuzz:

Originally posted by Bees?:

Plus, it's pretty easy to miss that he's referring to the other guy when he says "Come on, Boss!". I thought he was just taunting the monster initially.

That's the one that made me think the boss was not the African-American, because he was behind the Carpenter's mate, like he was trying to pull him away. It wasn't until I read the log specifically that I realized who was speaking.

Yeah, in this instance the crosses next to the person dying help a lot. The carpenter himself dies a few scenes later even though he's spiked in this scene too.

[SmackTubby]

Lol, yeah. I felt super bad when I figured out it was the other way around.

[funployee]

Originally posted by Uhumsk:

It's not actually an unreasonable assumption to make for the time period - they are both American by nationality, and in the first decade of the 1800s it is unlikely that a Euro-American would accept a subordinate position under an African-American. How likely it is that the pair would find hire on a British ship I have no idea, but I suspect it would be difficult for a non-european to get a position as officer or tradesman aboard a ship.

This was my rationale upon discovering this as well, but I had no idea who the carpenter was until I revisited the scene and the mate shouted "boss" and this was the only boss/subordinate relationship I hadn't established yet.

[Kurt]

Racist, no. Using historical perspective to make an educated guess, yes. It's not racist to make an assumption that falls in line with the setting. Black people were treated as if they deserved to be under the white people in America by the majority (whether actively or passively) during the stated time. It becomes racist only when you agree with that sentiment.

[SDSkinner2011]

I'm not sure of any racial stereotype of blacks being bad at woodworking.

That said a black American aboard the ship is odd; presumably he is one loyalist or child of a loyalist from the American Revolutionary war. The reason for him getting such a high position is probably the same reason that the crew is incredibly diverse- a massive manpower crunch.

The game takes place during the Peace of Amiens, a 17 month breather between the 13 years of war with Revolutionary France and the 12 years of war with Napoleonic France. The British used impressment to bloster the ranks of the navy which means the merchant marine has to take anyone they can get their hands on.

[Korgor]

Cheers SDSkinner, I was wondering where this fit into the Wars with France

Frank McFuzz, you're completely right about doing what we can to get this out there - step one is probably reviewing it, recommending it to friends, talking about it on FB, Twitter... The subreddit is pretty empty... Any other ideas?

[SDSkinner2011]

Originally posted by Lord_Eustace:

Cheers SDSkinner, I was wondering where this fit into the Wars with France

Looking up the historical details leads to several unexpected conclusions assuming the log isn't anachronistic- the Pole is Lithuanian (the only part of Poland on the sea before the last partician), the Italian is from the new Italian Republic and the Austrians are Belgian.

[Uhumsk]

The nationalities are somewhat anachronistic. The Austrians are likely not Belgians (accents do not sound Flemish, and the former Austrian Netherlands had been annexed by France at this point). They'd gained control of Veneto and parts of Dalmatia at this point, but any seamen from there would likely be ethnically Italian or Slovenian/Croatian. "Italian" is not a nationality at this point, in 1803 the peninsula was divided into the Italian republic, Papal states, Kingdom of Naples, Kingdom of Etruria, Duchy of Parma and the Ligurian and Luccan republics. The passenger list should specify one of those. And the concept of Formosan royalty is strange given that the island was under Quing control since 1683. The Lin Shuangwen rebellion of 1787-88 was mentioned elsewhere, and the Tiandihui movement kept rebelling throughout the 19th century - could be that the Formosan passengers are high up in their society. And if Olus Wiater is actually from the coast of Lithuania he would probably be a citizen of the Russian Empire since the partition in 1795, not listed as "Polish".