Return of the Obra Dinn

Return of the Obra Dinn

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Ending discussion [Spoilers obviously]
i've just beat the game, managed to uncover all the identities and the fate of everyone, but still, i thought there was going to be a timelapse or something that would tell the whole story but thats fine.

What i wanted to discuss is what are those shells? Just some cursed artifact brought in by the formosa royalty? Did it cause all of those unfortunate deaths? Because there were a lot of accidents, misuderstandings, some sort of plague, betrayals etc.

Also, maybe it was something that the sea wanted back and that's why there was a bunch of sirens and a kraken? Did it made some of the crew mad like something out of a lovecraftian story or they just thought it was valuable so that's why some tried to steal it?

Another thing, were the shells stored on that chest? Or was that just something different, something that seemed to give whoever put his hand inside a power capable of killing the creatures or banishing the kraken, perhaps that's what Filipe Dahl did and not the captain?

I am still trying to figure these things out, but that was an awesome game, thanks for this masterpiece Lucas Pope, i knew this would be this good back in 2014 or 2015 when i played the demo.
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Показване на 31-45 от 172 коментара
Първоначално публикувано от Jigsawn:
- First of all, is the shell on board (and in the chest) from the beginning of the Obra Dinn's voyage?

That was my intrepretation of it, since Chioh Tan explicitly talks about the shell needing to be protected (I guess by the chest) and you later see Dahl pulling one out of the chest. However, it sounded like there are multiple shells, since the cook gets killed trying to look at one (so I guess the mermaid in the sling is holding one?), and the Captain later talks about them in the plural. So I'm not sure where the other remaining shells came from.

Първоначално публикувано от Jigsawn:
- The question is what causes the "curse" to activate. Previously the shell didn't seem to cause any issues, assuming they had it in the chest the whole voyage. In fact is it just that the crew captured the merfolk and thus invokes the curse? Or is it that the captains steward takes out the shell again from the chest, thus unleashing the crabmen/kraken etc? If I recall the steward is imprisoned just after capturing the merfolk and before the crabmen are unleashed.

This part's a bit confusing since it sounds like at least one shell is already out in the open by the time the cook dies, so Dahl taking one can't have been the cause of the curse, but it's also not clear if he pulled the shell before or after the crabmen attack. Chioh does mention a shell having to be protected, so it's possible that the shell in the chest is a specific one that acts as a beacon of some sort when not in the chest.

Първоначално публикувано от Jigsawn:
- Based on what you guys say, the Doctor kills the monkey so he can use the pocketwatch to see what events transpired in the prison by jumping between gone corpses. And based off this he learns of the shells importance and releases the last mermaid. I wonder why the captain doesn't stop them, and what events lead to the final mutiny.

The issue here is that Martin's corpse is already in the room before Evans kills the monkey, so they must have already known to free the mermaid before then.




Where the timeline gets ambiguous is when the kraken goes away. The captain kills the 2 mermaids and has time to throw some shells overboard, and by the time the Martin enters the lazarette, the crew seems to already know about throwing out the shells. But why would the captain leave before killing the 3rd mermaid and only throw out some of the shells if the kraken is still attacking? So it's unclear whether the mermaids called off the kraken because of the captain's threats, or because of the 3rd mate's bargain.
iirc during the third mate's bargain scene, if you listen the sea seems to be calm? (Just pulled it up to check, yes, there's very little background noise in this scene while in the scenes with the captain there's a lot of background noise and the ship is very clearly being tossed around)

Also in the Bosun's death scene they talk about how the Captain is the one who got the kraken to leave ("The beast is dead? How? How did you kill it?" "We didn't. It left with the storm. Captain came up from the hold. Said he chased it off."). Not to mention that in the Third Mate's scene they talk about the final shell saying, "The Captain didn't toss 'em all overboard!" which seems like maybe THIS is what the captain did to appease the kraken. Or maybe the final mermaid being alive means she called off the kraken for fear of being killed. We can't be exactly sure.

These two things lead me to believe that the bargain was just to release the mermaid in exchange for her seeing the ship safely back home (but he didn't say anything about the crew, nor what would happen AFTER the ship was seen safely home), and that the Captain was responsible for the kraken leaving.
Several points I don't understand after finishing the game are:

Why did Nichols came back to the Obra Dinn rather than continue on to the Azures or Canary Islands? Presumably he couldn't have managed this by himself and returning to the Obra Dinn was his only option? He must have known he'd have been executed just as Hok-Seng Lau was for shooting a crew member, not to mention the whole abandoning ship, kidnapping etc.

What caused Fillip Dahl to attack John Naples. He says the shells and monsters are a curse etc and when you see the Cook in the far corner of his death scene you see him running off, but it doesn't explain why he'd attack someone unrelated to any of it? Unless he was just driven crazy by seeing all the deaths occur since leaving port?

Finally, after the escape chapter. Why does the second mutiny occur? Other than with just the four of them left there's probably no way to pilot the ship back? The captain shouting 'you bxx may take exactly what I give you' would suggest they were unhappy with him throwing the shell overboard? Though why would they all try to kill him for it?

Any theories?:ProblemBear:
Nichols might not have 'come back' to the ship, and instead the ship might have caught up with him as he says something like 'as long as we keep rowing we should reach the Canaries before the ship catches us', and obviously as the last surviving person he can't exactly row two boats quickly.

I don't think it's ever determined what caused Dahl to go crazy.

The second mutiny seems to occur because the remaining crew want the Captain to give them the shells (the shells are mentioned and when the Captain says he threw them overboard Brennan says "That's a lie", thus he thinks the Captain is keeping them.

This thought just came to me right now, but maybe the mermaid is the cause. It's assumed that the 'glow' in the distance we see as we explore is the final mermaid who guided the ship back to port... what if the remaining crew saw this and thought the mermaid was back for revenge? They would then assume that the Captain was being greedy and hadn't gotten rid of the shells, and was endangering them all. Thus they wanted to get rid of the shells to appease the mermaid.
Първоначално публикувано от Bees?:
Първоначално публикувано от Jigsawn:
- Based on what you guys say, the Doctor kills the monkey so he can use the pocketwatch to see what events transpired in the prison by jumping between gone corpses. And based off this he learns of the shells importance and releases the last mermaid. I wonder why the captain doesn't stop them, and what events lead to the final mutiny.

The issue here is that Martin's corpse is already in the room before Evans kills the monkey, so they must have already known to free the mermaid before then.

I don't think that Evan was involved, he merely sacrificed his friend to uncover the truth so he could write the book or to understand what happened. If you look at the page where the monkey death is, it's written there that he sacrificed him for the pursuit of knowledge or something like that.
Yep it seems we are still quite uncertain on the specifics.

The mutiny at the end could be caused by a number of reasons. You can see the Captain has kind of lost the plot by this point - in Escape you see he's happy to let people go and afterwards has his head slumped in defeat.

The remaining crew who didn't escape have seen the Captain not only lead them into total disaster a number of times, but now he's allowed people to escape with the last boat. It's quite possible the remaining crew also saw the last mermaid being released with the shell earlier. They think he's lost his mind and leadership. The rebelling officers want to stop the voyage and take command, and some of them also want the valuable/powerful shells which they believe the Captain still has.
Първоначално публикувано от TyrannisUmbra:
Nichols might not have 'come back' to the ship, and instead the ship might have caught up with him as he says something like 'as long as we keep rowing we should reach the Canaries before the ship catches us', and obviously as the last surviving person he can't exactly row two boats quickly.

Ah this makes sense! Also explains why he says he's found treasure when the ship catches upto him. Possibly looking to bargain it for his life?

One other point I'm wondering about is why the Russian Leonid Volkov attempts to stop everyone leaving on the final row boat. You hear him say 'you shan't take the last boat' but why would the group who escaped for Africa have stopped him from also getting on the boat with them? The Captain also gives them permission and aims his pistol at the Russian before Volkov gets shot by Emily anyway so it makes no sense why he would have acted like this?
Първоначално публикувано от Real KCT:
One other point I'm wondering about is why the Russian Leonid Volkov attempts to stop everyone leaving on the final row boat. You hear him say 'you shan't take the last boat' but why would the group who escaped for Africa have stopped him from also getting on the boat with them? The Captain also gives them permission and aims his pistol at the Russian before Volkov gets shot by Emily anyway so it makes no sense why he would have acted like this?

Maybe they wanted the last boat to escape with the shells/chest.
Yeah that's my take on it. Volkov is either in leagues with the mutineers at this point, or he just wants off the ship. It's also possible the magic has influenced a lot of people to make them kinda crazy!
Първоначално публикувано от TyrannisUmbra:
They would then assume that the Captain was being greedy and hadn't gotten rid of the shells, and was endangering them all. Thus they wanted to get rid of the shells to appease the mermaid.

None of the remaining crew were around the area during the events of the bargain though, so they wouldn't know the significance of the shell(s) or the mermaids? It's only after he's shot one of them that he even details that they're at the bottom of the sea.

Първоначално публикувано от Jigsawn:
Yep it seems we are still quite uncertain on the specifics.
They think he's lost his mind and leadership.

This actually makes sense, it'd also be highly probable after losing 95% of your crew that you'd be deemed unfit for command by your first mate.

Yeah Brennan and co. are only after the shells out of greed in the final Captain attack scenes, probably. Unless they saw the events in the prison or were told about them.

They do however know about the shell's existance due to the events in Chapter V, where the mermaids are brought on board. Remember the shell is mentioned when they are first hauled on board. Then the cook spots the shiny shell whilst carrying the mermaid on the stairs and goes to grab it and dies. During this time Brennan is even carrying the stretcher holding the mermaid so he knows full well about the shell and its valuable looks.

Actually this reminds me of some of Brennan's behaviour in the Crabman attack.

He gets caught up in the attack early on, hiding around where the carpenter is. Later though you see him going to open the door to the hold. I originally thought he was probably trying to get to safety or create more escape routes. But it could be he goes down there to try and get a shell as he knows the mermaids are imprisoned there. In the end, opening the hold door allows a crab guy to get down there and kill the carpenter.

Or I have the timings wrong and he's actually closing the hold door in the scene where he's tugging at it on the floor above. Either way, it seems a bit suspicious to me that he's the guy who first wants to go there. You do see the Gunner's mate at the other hold door as well during the fight but I think he's closing it because I'm pretty sure the Gunner's Mate joins the fight up top later on.
Последно редактиран от Jigsawn; 21 окт. 2018 в 12:57
I'm looking forward to the guide/wikia that lists the complete timeline, actions and motivations of all 60+1 passengers xD
The ending definitely is more of a fizzle than a bang, a lot of this comes down to the presentation. From the point you get the 58 souls the game winds down with The Bargain feeling more of an epilogue. If Obra Dinn were to take a note from mystery classics the narrative would build to its ultimate reveal after the player receives the watch (again).

To its credit it tries, but how the Obra Dinn returned is not the game's central mystery and even once the veil is lifted the player still has to finish their own work so that the credits may roll.
Why did the doctor have to sacrifice his monkey, when there were already dead bodies in the lazarette at that point? As a former pet owner, I would have much rather cut a dead person's finger, than sacrifice my beloved pet...

Also, a person who tried to hitch a ride, but died when the barrels crushed in Chapter 1, part 1, doesn't have any relevance to the story? I always thought there'll something more to this, especially as one of the options when determining the killer is "killed by an foreign agent"
Последно редактиран от Al'Eksandar; 21 окт. 2018 в 19:46
Първоначално публикувано от Al'Eksandar:
Why did the doctor have to sacrifice his monkey, when there were already dead bodies in the lazarette at that point? As a former pet owner, I would have much rather cut a dead person's finger, than sacrifice my beloved pet...

The monkey was "not altogether pleasant" or something. I don't think he was particularly fond of it.

He couldn't get in to take a piece of any of the bodies in there - the room was locked and the key was gone.

From memory, there is a rope on the monkey when he shoots it, so presumably after it dies he pulls it back to cut off the paw. The watch takes the holder to the place of death, so it is internally consistent there.

BTW, another point I haven't seen raised is: the pocketwatch shows you the time of death. This is actually a useful clue in a few places.
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