Calorie calculation

[Ex-Mørtis]

Just wondering how calorie burn is estimated in this game. I know it's a *very* hard thing to get right and anything given is just an estimation, but the figures in BoxVR just seem unrealistically off the charts. 42 cals for a 2 minute workout? Running a mile burns approximately 100 cals and most people take 7-10 minutes to do that. So you're telling me, BoxVR burns 50-100% more than the calories of a running a mile? That seems unrealistic to me. My FitBit also usually throws much lower figures if I put it in workout mode too (20 for the 2 min workout as an example). And 10-15 cals per minute is believable and much more in line with what is usually expected as a baseline from what I've seen.

Love the game and it's a great way to get exercise, but I think either I'm seriously missing something, or these figures should be re-assessed, as even though they are just estimates, it would be nice to have them a bit more in the realm of reality, I'd personally prefer low estimates over high ones. Better to over workout than to under workout.

[bavi]

Hi Kitty Rampage, we’re really happy to hear that you love BOXVR! Our calorie counter is estimated by the users weight and the intensity of the workout. The calories are based on a 100% maximum effort output. We appreciate that everyone is different and burns calories differently so we are not able to provide 100% accurate calorie burn readings. We are currently revising our calorie counter so watch this space! Matching your workout with your Fitbit is a great way of adding another estimation to how many calories you have actually burnt!

[ravenoverride]

Hi ;) what happened to the suggestion to integrate a BT heartrate monitor? This could help to calculate the calories and if it is too unhealty (220 heartbeats per minute) you could warn the user.

[Ex-Mørtis]

It would be awesome if it were possible to sync up the Fitbit via bluetooth to the game, though I'm not sure if that's even possible. I've long wished that were an option on the Vive in general. A standard BT heartrate monitor would be fantastic too though.

[Dragonfillet]

Yeah, they're calculating based on how many calories a person burns while boxing, and just applying that per second you are in the game. If you are going full tilt on your own music at 160bpm+, that would be absolutely right. I would guess that the reality of most of the workouts is somewhere between 1/2 and 2/3 of the estimated calories.

[bavi]

Hi Ravenoverride, we are still working on introducing integration for heart rate monitors. That’s a really great idea about ensuring users are playing safely.


[Cego em Tiroteio]

Yeah, I saw the game on Oculus Home and the calorie counter did make me suspicious the game would be a hoax. That and the trailer that doesn't show prolongued gameplay, starting with 50 seconds footage only of shiny happy people wandering.

My impression is that I'm better sticking to SoundBoxing and AudioShield unaware of calorie burn and with the entertainment focus than to stare at a clear mockery of data with the home placebo workout stigma.

You seem to have a nice game on the make, please fix the counter and keep it classy.

[Kjaye]

Originally posted by Cego em Tiroteio:

Yeah, I saw the game on Oculus Home and the calorie counter did make me suspicious the game would be a hoax. That and the trailer that doesn't show prolongued gameplay, starting with 50 seconds footage only of shiny happy people wandering.

My impression is that I'm better sticking to SoundBoxing and AudioShield unaware of calorie burn and with the entertainment focus than to stare at a clear mockery of data with the home placebo workout stigma.

You seem to have a nice game on the make, please fix the counter and keep it classy.

I agree the calorie count is very high. it would take somebody walking or running 36 miles to run off a lb of fat in real life for example (3600 calories = 1 pound fat appox) and I can burn 1000 calories in ths game in no time, which is clearly not correct.

Don't let that discourage you from trying the game however. I just don't pay any attention to it, the workouts themselves are great fun. I have 18 hours in Audioshield and about 5 in Sounboxing when I first bought this game. I've not played Audioshield or Soundboxing at all since purchasing this, now at 65 hours of play time (in two and half months). For a workout this game literally blows those two out of the water, so much more fun, and it uses your legs as well.

The only games I've found that are more demanding than this are Holopoint and Thrill of the Fight, but they are more gamey and I can only play them for short periods at a time. BoxVR I can sink an hour a night into no problem.

This title is well worth the money. If I didn't own a VR headset and this was available at a local gym I'd have no qualms about paying a fiver a session to work out in this for an hour so a one time purchase of £14.99 is a steal.

[bavi]

Hi Cego em Tirotelo, thanks for reaching out to us. Our calorie counter is an estimation based on an individual’s height and the intensity of the game, created by our professional trainers. We are still aiming to optimise our calorie counter to make it a closer estimate.

[Cego em Tiroteio]

Cool! Thanks for the input, Kjaye. The comparison is much welcomed.

Let me stray a little bit more off-topic and ask if the tracks are human generated like soundboxing or procedurally generated like audioshield?
Despite reckoning audioshield's algorithm as a mighty competent master piece, I loved soundboxing human made fun that doesn't shy away from repetition of good patterns. Even paid of the graphics downgrade.

Back to calorie count, I imagine it can't really be exact science with the hardware we have. But if what Dragonfliet said is true (a plain time*calories/second - assuming a standardized boxing session correcting for weight/height), then there's room for improvement for sure. Audioshield artistic score and Soundboxing default score both factor the intensity of the punch in addition to the timming. Otherwise it will pass a vibe of those "as seen on tv" ads for miraculous workout machines.

I'm sorry to sound negative and hyperbolic. I really appreciate the work it took to get the game here. It's just... I hope you understand this as a pet peeve (although I believe it's not so particular).

[Kjaye]

Hey Cego. I never got really into soundboxing as I found it a bit difficult (I'm not terribly coordinated) but I put a lot of time into Audioshiled, a really great game which I enjoyed immenseiy.

Where this game differs is that is is workout focused. They have various workouts divided into different sections - Beginner - Power - Speed - Endurance - Super Endurance.

Power workouts mainly focus on leg and core work with lots of squats and side bends. The balls travel towards you slowly and you score more points for how hard you hit them

Speed workouts feature little to no leg work, it's more about fast combinations, balls coming at you much faster and requiring to punch quickly and in combinations. These are the most exciting workouts and can be really exhilirating when you are able to complete without dropping a ball.

The Endurance workouts are much longer and combine Power and Speed elements interspacing heavy leg focused sections with fast arm combinations and rest sequences.

They all follow a set and repetition style, so you'll soon remember how each 'workout goes'. A particular punch combination in a left stance is followed by the same sequence with stances reversed for example, so two right jabs, left jab, dodge sideways right, left uppercut becomes two left jabs, right jab, dodge sideways left, right uppercut etc. You soon get to recognise the deliberate sets and repetition structure. I really love this is as I know I'm doing a complete workout rather than just a random generated piece.

Unlike Audioshield and Soundboxing your legs and core are really worked in this too.

Another thing I love about this game is that transitioning from one Power workout to a Speed workout takes around 5 - 10 seconds so you can complete mutliple short workouts with no downtime at all. In Audioshiled it would stop every damn song, tell me my score then have to load the next song and make me select the arena and shields again, and take maybe 40 seconds or more. That started to piss me off after a while as it really broke the flow of the workout. That problem is entirely eliminated here, you can go continuous with no breaks at all for an hour.

If you haven't bought it yet I'd definitely have a go with it. Steam has an instant refund option if you don't like it which I have used a bunch of times. I actually bought this game twice to show my support to the devs. It's an awesome game, and the main reason I use my VR.

If you like fitness in VR you NEED this game frankly!

[crossmr]

Originally posted by bavithiran:

Hi Cego em Tirotelo, thanks for reaching out to us. Our calorie counter is an estimation based on an individual’s height and the intensity of the game, created by our professional trainers. We are still aiming to optimise our calorie counter to make it a closer estimate.

I think your professional trainers have it wrong. Exactly what exercise are they basing this on? The calories burned for boxing are very different depending on if you're in the ring boxing and if you're just doing a punching bag.

if I look at something like this: https://captaincalculator.com/health/calorie/calories-burned-boxing-calculator/

and put in my weight and time boxed it seems very much like they're using the calories burned for being a ring boxing and not for simply using a punching bag. While some tracks do have you ducking and dodging a bit, not all do and that really isn't the same as being in a ring, moving around, getting hit, and actually hitting someone else. It's basically punching bag + amount for how much you move around in that particular course. But speed courses which have absolutely zero ducking and dodging burn the same calories as other courses which do.

[Judge Shred]

Like others, I have seen that the calories are off...WAY off. Rather than getting estimates from trainers, or a web form, they need to get a group of people in, have them wear fitbits (or heart rate monitors) and actually collect data. They can then have an idea of the typical calorie count and adjust accordingly. As others say, it will be a fraction of what's displayed

[Kjaye]

For me the calorie count isn't an important issue anyway. I don't use BoxVR to count calories, I never even pay it any attention. I don't use my Fitbit for it either for that matter. What I'd like to see is some useful metrics that could easily be recorded and that would allow us measurable statistics by which to chart our progress. The followin is what I think would be great;

Duration of workouts, by day, week, month, year etc. User definable searches included

Number of punches thrown, again by day, week, month etc with the ability to compare across sessions. This could be BoxVR's version of Fitbit's step feature. A daily punch target would be great, with each day receiving a star or something when achieved, so you can see on the calendar how you are doing in maintaining your punch targets.

Number of squats. This would be another useful metric and a target we could set ourselves each day or week. They could even allow for weight added, if somebody has a weighted vest for example so we could record progress properly like a workout.

Then maybe a bunch of achievements that can be unlocked, for achieving a set number of consecutive days worked out, or total workout times, total career punches thrown etc. If there was achievements like plaques that could be hung on the wall of our Oculus Homes or Steam homes, like games like most major games already do that would be awesome. I'd like to be the first to get the 500 hours worked out plaque for example and proudly hang it on my virtual wall in my Oculus home next to my giant T Rex statue!

[Night Eye]

I would love to see weighted vest as an option to help determine calories burned.