T4 dungeons starting room.

[Koop]

Am I just unlucky or do these always start with 4-6 enemies in the first room and a locking gate? Been going ranged weapons quite comfortably but cant approach this situation.

[duckman]

Do you have Hunter's Mark yet? It's the ranged tree's crowd control skill. You can quickly rack up +20% crit chance, +60% crit efficiency, and +40% body part damage by killing chaff and just obliterate the heavies with 100+ damage crits with a T4 bow.

[Pixel Peeper]

The gate that locks behind you is one of the random possible conditions (and by far the best one to get), but they're not all like that.

Admittedly it makes the first encounter in the dungeon quite difficult, and for me it was an experience very similar to what you're describing: a whole bunch of new and very strong enemies that ended up being way tougher than the boss room.

[Ellavina]

It will warn you about the hazard before you go in (open your map while on the dungeon tile)

Once you've unlocked the local informants upgrade from caravan you'll see the hazards without traveling to the dungeon itself.

If you have a hard time with just the first room - honestly just take drugs before you go in and toss some smoke bombs and fire grenades liberally.

[Koop]

Great suggestions thanks! Didnt know about the hazards deal Ill check it out.

[Pixel Peeper]

Originally posted by Koop:

Great suggestions thanks! Didnt know about the hazards deal Ill check it out.

Oh yeah. Really important to check first, so you can prepare and bring the consumables required.

If it's "Miasmas", for example, you're really gonna want some injectors/antitoxins.

[Maa22]

just had this exact same experience, just mine had 6-8 enemies :DDD like com on, i know i may be under-geared, but once they got to me i could not even escape trough the entrance just besides me :DDD

They say "you need to prepare toughly for 4 skulls+) yehh.. prepare exactly what, to die?? :D

So far i still hit this real problem in game feel balance: its either you easy breeze trough a dungeon or you get instantly destroyed :D like where is middle ground?

[duckman]

Originally posted by Maa22:

just had this exact same experience, just mine had 6-8 enemies :DDD like com on, i know i may be under-geared, but once they got to me i could not even escape trough the entrance just besides me :DDD

They say "you need to prepare toughly for 4 skulls+) yehh.. prepare exactly what, to die?? :D

So far i still hit this real problem in game feel balance: its either you easy breeze trough a dungeon or you get instantly destroyed :D like where is middle ground?

The middle ground is barely winning every fight, but going into debt because you can't afford to repair any of your gear. So worse than dying if you're not playing on permadeath.

[money3030]

Originally posted by Pixel Peeper:

Originally posted by Koop:

Great suggestions thanks! Didnt know about the hazards deal Ill check it out.

Oh yeah. Really important to check first, so you can prepare and bring the consumables required.

If it's "Miasmas", for example, you're really gonna want some injectors/antitoxins.

Lancets better since you will use then frequently.

[money3030]

Originally posted by Koop:

Am I just unlucky or do these always start with 4-6 enemies in the first room and a locking gate? Been going ranged weapons quite comfortably but cant approach this situation.

That's why you keep two smokebombs before hand and a Net for some really scary dude and even a Nistrian Flask just to help block the door for that.

I mean you could also get creative here, toss smoke, put one Runic boulder by the Door to make it 1 tile path then net the whatever fakker comes to also block it completely for a bit.

[Pixel Peeper]

Originally posted by money3030:

Originally posted by Pixel Peeper:

Oh yeah. Really important to check first, so you can prepare and bring the consumables required.

If it's "Miasmas", for example, you're really gonna want some injectors/antitoxins.

Lancets better since you will use then frequently.

Not a big fan of the Lancets, I've never even used them once. They do remove 30 intoxication over 60 turns, but there are several penalties. And they're not even permanent tools, apparently they're so fragile your bare flesh will make them break after 20 uses.

Whereas a simple Antitoxin will remove 25 intoxication immediately and another 25 in the next 25 turns. They do make you more thirsty but you're probably going to want to be drinking from your Cleansing Chalice often anyway. Really, only the Fatigue change (it adds 2.5% Fatigue, which is pretty nasty) is a problem. But you're likely not going to be drinking a lot of Antitoxins.

Antidotes are nice because they remove pretty much all existing Intoxication and give you +25% Intoxication Resistance for 360 turns, greatly slowing the rate at which you get intoxicated by the miasmas.

And interestingly, Leeches will also remove some Intoxication. Only 15% per leech, but they'll also restore a tiny bit of your Immunity (3%), and if you're using them to heal yourself anyway, then it's free detox on the side.

Antitoxins and Leeches have the added benefit of being free.

[money3030]

Originally posted by Pixel Peeper:

Originally posted by money3030:

Lancets better since you will use then frequently.

Not a big fan of the Lancets, I've never even used them once. They do remove 30 intoxication over 60 turns, but there are several penalties. And they're not even permanent tools, apparently they're so fragile your bare flesh will make them break after 20 uses.

Whereas a simple Antitoxin will remove 25 intoxication immediately and another 25 in the next 25 turns. They do make you more thirsty but you're probably going to want to be drinking from your Cleansing Chalice often anyway. Really, only the Fatigue change (it adds 2.5% Fatigue, which is pretty nasty) is a problem. But you're likely not going to be drinking a lot of Antitoxins.

Antidotes are nice because they remove pretty much all existing Intoxication and give you +25% Intoxication Resistance for 360 turns, greatly slowing the rate at which you get intoxicated by the miasmas.

And interestingly, Leeches will also remove some Intoxication. Only 15% per leech, but they'll also restore a tiny bit of your Immunity (3%), and if you're using them to heal yourself anyway, then it's free detox on the side.

Antitoxins and Leeches have the added benefit of being free.

Lancets are cheap to repair though and well technically each is 9/10 uses if you don't let it break , and if you use them proactively your immunity won't drain as fast. Two or three of them is usually enough for a comfortable looting session.

It does save Inventory compared to Carrying Antitoxins and Leeches at the end of the day.

[brown29knight]

Originally posted by money3030:

Originally posted by Pixel Peeper:

Not a big fan of the Lancets, I've never even used them once. They do remove 30 intoxication over 60 turns, but there are several penalties. And they're not even permanent tools, apparently they're so fragile your bare flesh will make them break after 20 uses.

Whereas a simple Antitoxin will remove 25 intoxication immediately and another 25 in the next 25 turns. They do make you more thirsty but you're probably going to want to be drinking from your Cleansing Chalice often anyway. Really, only the Fatigue change (it adds 2.5% Fatigue, which is pretty nasty) is a problem. But you're likely not going to be drinking a lot of Antitoxins.

Antidotes are nice because they remove pretty much all existing Intoxication and give you +25% Intoxication Resistance for 360 turns, greatly slowing the rate at which you get intoxicated by the miasmas.

And interestingly, Leeches will also remove some Intoxication. Only 15% per leech, but they'll also restore a tiny bit of your Immunity (3%), and if you're using them to heal yourself anyway, then it's free detox on the side.

Antitoxins and Leeches have the added benefit of being free.

Lancets are cheap to repair though and well technically each is 9/10 uses if you don't let it break , and if you use them proactively your immunity won't drain as fast. Two or three of them is usually enough for a comfortable looting session.

It does save Inventory compared to Carrying Antitoxins and Leeches at the end of the day.

I disagree. You will want to bring the lancets out with you. So they take up space. Every leech, used or not, can stay in that dungeon. There will be more in the river. Leeches only take up space on the way in. On the way out leeches give you more room for loot then lancets do.

[money3030]

1x2 with 10 max uses each versus how many 1x1 leeches? and Leeches might come with extra side effects later, they already got nerfed this time.

It's up to you if you want to drop extra lancets either, Derrel frequently sells them, can't remember if Leif does.

Antitoxin is the worst option, why wait for Intoxication to build up? It causes Immunity to drop faster compared to actively managing intoxication levels at 0% whenever possible with Leech or just bleeding the toxins out.

[laveley]

The answer you are looking for is smoke bombs

[Pixel Peeper]

Originally posted by brown29knight:

Originally posted by money3030:

Lancets are cheap to repair though and well technically each is 9/10 uses if you don't let it break , and if you use them proactively your immunity won't drain as fast. Two or three of them is usually enough for a comfortable looting session.

It does save Inventory compared to Carrying Antitoxins and Leeches at the end of the day.

I disagree. You will want to bring the lancets out with you. So they take up space. Every leech, used or not, can stay in that dungeon. There will be more in the river. Leeches only take up space on the way in. On the way out leeches give you more room for loot then lancets do.

This is correct.

On the way in, you've got as much inventory space as you want.

On the way out, you're just gonna drop all your consumables (except maybe your Vivifying Essence, if you haven't used it) on the floor.

That Lancet is never going to be repaired because it'll be on the floor of the dungeon.

And for the next one, I'll be stocking up on Antitoxins and Leeches since they're both free.

Don't get me wrong, they are not useless. But you can't argue that they save money or space. They don't.