Devs: Knightly Armor - stats are of

[taitomagatsu]

Dear Devs,

before fighting the troll I tried to gear up. While searching for new equipment I realized, that there might be an error in the stats of the knightly armor. In the stat comparison it's apparent, that the Knightly Armor has no bleed resistance, while the cheaper brigandine has plenty. This is very unrealistic.

Brigandines were made by riveting steel plates to a fabric. Good quality birgandines often had an additional layer of fabric for added protection. While it makes somewhat sense, that the fire resistance is lower, the more layers of fabric there are. The missing bleed resistance is just wrong. The better birgandine should have more bleed resistance, (25% ?), not less.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2379732795

Another thing: The energy penalty of high-end armor is too much. Heavy armor wasn't as restricting as many people today might think. Here is some proof by modern experimental archeologists.
Mobility is only restricted a little:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RR6I-BLKbQ
Even handstands and lifting other armored opponents is possible:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzTwBQniLSc
A full set of plate armor was not more demanding, than the load of modern soldiers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2FB0goDq38Q

My suggestion is changing the energy cost of high level armor to:
25 for plate armor and 20 for the knightly armor. The other armors could be changed accordingly to keep the balance.

Also, the plate armor should have at least some bleed resistance. Nobody did wear the plate on their naked skin. There was almost always a gambeson underneath. That's the reason the plate armor should have at least the bleed resistance of a normal gambeson.

I humbly ask to consider changing this.

[Anarchist Wolf]

+1 , MACHICULATIOOOOOONS!!!!!!.

Now for real , claps for using Metraton as a source noble one and thou i agree with you that it is wierd that plate armours doesnt have bleed resistance in the game inmidiatly thought that it was for balancin reasons(includin differencfes betwin builds and manteinin pros and cons of each ) so im not sure if they woud aim to balance it differently in that matter ,

About energy cost , well , if you think about it is a diferent subject than mobility , while indeed there is a widespread misconception about both every kind of armor modern or older will restrict your movement somehow and refering to key point you asked indeed it will wear you out , again not as bad as pop culture and holliwood depicts it for the sake of enterteiment and other reasons but it will and more so dependin of the context and weather (ask heavily armored and equiped modern soldiers how much they love to run around alike on a desert for 30 minutes or if they do so offten affter all isnt like if they are wearing only a tshirt )

So about the matter of needin to adjust the existing energy penalty .. we cannot state that they are wrong , affter all those are just numbers out of a made up parameter and stadistic within their game system , coud it be tweaked? idk maybe , woud be a whole different story if they have introduced another penalty mechanic on top hand to hand with the less energy you have or if the stat penalty say the fumble or aditional ones alike were more extreme then you woud have a much more solid fundation and reasoning to claim for a change .Remember that this is only my opinion

Have a good day , fun at games , stay safe out there , dont forget to wear your bevor and remember.. the metraton has spread its wings .)

[Beholder]

Heavy armor isn't really balanced for the existing content and is mostly meant to be a teaser for future progression.
Later on there'll be a dedicated "Armor" skill tree which will partly negate the stat penalites applied by heavy gear.

[taitomagatsu]

Originally posted by Beholder:

Heavy armor isn't really balanced for the existing content and is mostly meant to be a teaser for future progression.
Later on there'll be a dedicated "Armor" skill tree which will partly negate the stat penalites applied by heavy gear.

Thanks for the information. An armor skill tree would be awesome!

Originally posted by Anarchist Wolf:

+1 , MACHICULATIOOOOOONS!!!!!!.

Now for real , claps for using Metraton as a source noble one ...

Props for quoting Shadiversity. He is another content creator, which I appreciate for his honesty and content quality.

Originally posted by Anarchist Wolf:

... and thou i agree with you that it is wierd that plate armours doesnt have bleed resistance in the game inmidiatly thought that it was for balancin reasons(includin differencfes betwin builds and manteinin pros and cons of each ) so im not sure if they woud aim to balance it differently in that matter ,

Balancing is indeed always to be considered. That's the reason plate armor has negative fire resist. Even thought in reality a human would be better protected against a fireball wearing a suit of plate armor, than being naked. This is already a huge downside to heavy armors. Without bleed resistance, they have another downside. Only one of those downsides can be properly compensated by enchantments. Making them inferior to lightly armored ranger and mage builds, which can use the enchantments to further buff themselves. This is one of the reasons ranged builds are easier to use in the current meta.

Originally posted by Anarchist Wolf:

About energy cost , well , if you think about it is a diferent subject than mobility , while indeed there is a widespread misconception about both every kind of armor modern or older will restrict your movement somehow and refering to key point you asked indeed it will wear you out , again not as bad as pop culture and holliwood depicts it for the sake of enterteiment and other reasons but it will and more so dependin of the context and weather (ask heavily armored and equiped modern soldiers how much they love to run around alike on a desert for 30 minutes or if they do so offten affter all isnt like if they are wearing only a tshirt )

Wearing a suit of armor will indeed wear out even the fittest fighter with enough strain. That's the reason I didn't propose to remove the penalties to energy regeneration.

What a suit of armor does not do is reducing stamina by about 1/4 just because it was buckled 3 seconds ago. Even a reduction of 20 energy is unrealistic. But I suggested it, because it could be the sweat spot, where heavy armor is useful but not overpowered.

Originally posted by Anarchist Wolf:

So about the matter of needin to adjust the existing energy penalty .. we cannot state that they are wrong , affter all those are just numbers out of a made up parameter and stadistic within their game system , coud it be tweaked? idk maybe , woud be a whole different story if they have introduced another penalty mechanic on top hand to hand with the less energy you have or if the stat penalty say the fumble or aditional ones alike were more extreme then you woud have a much more solid fundation and reasoning to claim for a change .Remember that this is only my opinion

I didn't want to insinuate the devs are wrong, about their game. I wanted to give my opinion and try to make the game better. Like you do.

Originally posted by Anarchist Wolf:

Have a good day , fun at games , stay safe out there , dont forget to wear your bevor and remember.. the metraton has spread its wings .)

You too, have a good day, stay save and have fun gaming.

[Anarchist Wolf]

thx fr anaswering and sharing ur thougts ,glad t find ppl alike insteed of you know close minded etc , escuses for not postin it before

[taitomagatsu]

Originally posted by Anarchist Wolf:

thx fr anaswering and sharing ur thougts ,glad t find ppl alike insteed of you know close minded etc , escuses for not postin it before

No worries. I'm just always happy to find friendly people. If those friendly people enjoy the same things I do it's even better. It was a pleasure to have a discussion with you. Thank you too for sharing your thoughts.

Edit: Because you seem to enjoy rogue like games with permanent death and also historical content, the following game might be for you: "A Legionary's Life"
The writing is great and highly accurate. The gameplay is challenging and fun. I found it very enjoyable.
*To clarify I have no stocks in this game. I'm merely a fan.

[Anarchist Wolf]

Funny that you mentioned that game , as i already have it from not so long ago and played extensively , in fact i stoped before finishing 2 last archivements , indeed i was suprised to like it as much as i did, i as well find myself postin largely and or debatin and defendin some logic and facts at times in games so i guess thou i dont normally do so woudnt hurt to clarify that i am as well merely a fan.

Normally dont like to recommend other titles in particular forums as this one but as you did mention one il share my own recomnendation, in case you didnt eard about it yet i belive ud like Battle Brothers , it is a very engagin , extense and replayable sandbox(gives you hundreds on top of hundreds houres) , procedual generated turn based combat medieval/fantasy insipired(partly in germanic folklore) where you take the lead , manage and improve a mercenary company , gives good vibes from mount and blade warband and xcom in a way , do some own reserch about it if you feel like to and out of curiosity , u may well like it .

[taitomagatsu]

We have a really similar taste in games. Great that you too enjoyed "A Legionary's Life". "Battle Brothers" is a good suggestion too. I supported the dev team as a beta tester and gave them my feedback on their forum. Right now I have more than 200 hours in game time and got more than my moneys worth. Just the level scaling is a bit to heavy-handed for my taste. It breaks my immersion and takes away any feeling of progress. That's the reason I don't play any more. Nonetheless, it's a fun game. Thanks for the recommendation.

[Anarchist Wolf]

Seems we do , nothing else to say of my part , woudnt mind sharing more recommendations but again we seem to share taste and i dont see apropiate to do so extensivly here , wish you have fun with this one and with any other you get into , if you ever plan gettin more houres on BB i woud say to get if you didnt already the content dlcs

As ussuall to you and everybody else: Have a good day , fun at games and stay safe out there