Is this controller based movement only?

[Los]

Is there an option for head oriented movement?
I found it much more natural to me to have head based movement with the touch controller than controller based one... i naturaly compensate for when i'm looking around without even thinking but games where its controller based i tend to walk like a drunken person and from what i've seen its only controller based

[IanL]

Originally posted by wanyfer:

Is there an option for head oriented movement?
I found it much more natural to me to have head based movement with the touch controller than controller based one... i naturaly compensate for when i'm looking around without even thinking but games where its controller based i tend to walk like a drunken person and from what i've seen its only controller based

How can you compensate for looking around unless you actually stop moving? In reality we are able to freely look around whilst moving without it changing our direction, It's pretty essential when in combat situations which is why most people request it and most developers support it.

I suppose there would be nothing wrong in providing both options, but as far as I'm aware it's not currently available.

[Los]

by moving the stick accordingly while looking around i can keep moving in a straight line with no problem i'm so used to that on other games that i do this when playing controller led movement and end up moving like a drunk when trying to look around

[Jayjay]

I'm really surprised how many people prefer controller orientation for movement, because the implementations of that are always terrible.

Lift your hand to your face to adjust your headset a bit? suddenly you're going backwards.

I have no problem adjusting my stick movement to where my head is looking, it's how people play FPS games on consoles. I guess it's harder on a Vive/touchpad based controller because you can't feel exactly where your thumb is though (eg: the thumbstick tries to pull back to center, giving great directional feedback)

[PSYberition]

I think the important part is that different people prefer different things, and releasing a VR game without basic VR control settings, and expecting a full $60 for it, is a disgrace. It would be like releasing a game without typical movement controls, if they didn't let you change WASD, gamepads would be near useless. Despite the fact that 99% of people never change WASD, the option is still there. This is to ensure comfortable/enjoyable gameplay by all parties interested.

I mean really, I'm a noob when it comes to game design, however I am learning, and the effort it takes to go in and add a control switch that changes quite literally ONE, PRE-EXISTING variable, is so minimal (even for a sole designer like myself) Bethesda's lack of doing so before releasing the game is sickening enough, and they've yet to fix it (despite the vast number of employees they have). Much like the Oculus Touch controllers, being useless without a 3rd party mod. Yes most people use the Vive, but that doesn't mean Bethesda should be blatently ignoring all of their supporters with an Oculus. Yet they are.

So as I said in the beginning, everyone is different, it would be just as hard for someone used to controller based locomotion, to force themselves to use HMD based locomotion, and equally as irritating/dissapointing.

This is (very sadly) exactly what I expect from Bethesda anymore. Putting forth as little effort as possible attempting to obtain the largest reward possible, all while trying to get it done as quickly as one can. I believe the saying goes, "A delayed game will eventually be good, a rushed game will ALWAYS be bad." First impressions stick, bad impressions stick harder, Bethesda's doing both. As much as I absolutely love both Fallout and Elder Scrolls, Bethesda clearly does not. Nor do they seem to care about correcting the reputation they've built for themselves. All it seems to me they want, is to get paid. At the expense of ALL who care about THEIR game more then THEM...

Apologies for the ramble that turned in to, but I miss what Bethesda used to be, and hate what they're becoming.

[IanL]

Originally posted by Jayjay:

I'm really surprised how many people prefer controller orientation for movement, because the implementations of that are always terrible.

Lift your hand to your face to adjust your headset a bit? suddenly you're going backwards.
...

Only if you are still pressing the touchpad to move and there is always the option of using the opposite hand.

Originally posted by Jayjay:

...
I have no problem adjusting my stick movement to where my head is looking, it's how people play FPS games on consoles. I guess it's harder on a Vive/touchpad based controller because you can't feel exactly where your thumb is though (eg: the thumbstick tries to pull back to center, giving great directional feedback)

By using the motion controller direction to control the direction there is no need to know where your thumb is on the touchpad because the only place it needs to be is the top. If you keep it parallel to your body then you simply turn physically to face the direction you want to move in, just like real life. The thumb never needs to move. Likewise physically moving to strafe using roomscale is the most natural thing as is directing your weapon by moving your arm. The whole time your head is completely independent. It's VR, it's supposed to simulate reality as much as is currently technically possible. There is nothing to learn as this is what you do in every day life. The only real issue is avoiding getting tangled in the pesky HMD cables but that's minimised with experience.

There is of course nothing to stop you doing exactly what you do with a gamepad and simply use controller direction to compensate for direction movement reducing the frequency for physical turning. It requires the same skills as you already have to offset movement. Personally I combine both depending on the situation.

Of course this all assumes you are standing in the first place and not sitting. But tbh, sitting in a game like this is not really embracing Virtual Reality!

Sure it takes some adjustment and that can take time when your body has been trained to instinctively react to a long used control device but personally I found it a quick process and I would never want to go back.

[PSYberition]

Congrats, good for you, we are all glad you are happy with the controls. We aren't, nor are we asking for your controls to change, we just want ours implemented. Everyones brain works differently, whats easy for you can be a pain for another and whats a pain for another can be easy for you. What makes sense to your mind can be gibrish to another, and whats gibrish to you may make sense for another. It's a simple concept that makes sense no matter how it's said. Why is it such a big deal to you that we can't do it your way? or prefer another? I don't care at all how you control your Skyrim, or quite frankly that you disagree with the controls we would prefer. Nor should you how we want to control it, or which controls we prefer. This has never been a problem before yet now that VR is a thing everyone is expected to do things the same way. Do you think the same exact process goes through your brain when you walk as goes through mine when I do? This can easily alter the way two different people THINK about navigating, which in VR by definition will affect (bet you won't see this coming) the way you navigate.

Move on level 0. Some of us are trying to better the game for all based on facts, rather than ourselves based on opinions.

[IanL]

Originally posted by Psyberition:

Congrats, good for you, we are all glad you are happy with the controls. We aren't, nor are we asking for your controls to change, we just want ours implemented. Everyones brain works differently, whats easy for you can be a pain for another and whats a pain for another can be easy for you. What makes sense to your mind can be gibrish to another, and whats gibrish to you may make sense for another. It's a simple concept that makes sense no matter how it's said. Why is it such a big deal to you that we can't do it your way? or prefer another? I don't care at all how you control your Skyrim, or quite frankly that you disagree with the controls we would prefer. Nor should you how we want to control it, or which controls we prefer. This has never been a problem before yet now that VR is a thing everyone is expected to do things the same way. Do you think the same exact process goes through your brain when you walk as goes through mine when I do? This can easily alter the way two different people THINK about navigating, which in VR by definition will affect (bet you won't see this coming) the way you navigate.

Move on level 0. Some of us are trying to better the game for all based on facts, rather than ourselves based on opinions.

If you bothered to read you would see that I had already supported having both options in the first post of this thread. I was simply responding to the statements Jayjay had made. Looks like I hit a raw nerve where you're concerned. You really shouldn't be so sensitive.

[Jayjay]

In real life I move where my head is facing, or deliberately side-step (at a much slower speed than I can walk forwards or backwards I might add).

Using the touchpad to simulate a DPAD / four button input is a real waste of its range of motion. With thumbsticks you have precise control of how fast you want to move in that direction, as well as no way to accidentally slide off the edge like you can a flat touch pad.

I don't play sitting, but I do use smooth (or less happily snap) turn on right stick (so I can't just use "the other pad") and movement on my left stick.

When VR goes fully wireless, not talking hacky TP-Cast wireless, then I will happily play in 360 room scale, but until then it's really not enjoyable having the cable touch me (I've used Vive and Rift and Windows MR in 360 degree setups, do not want!)

[Grestorn]

I accept that people prefer a gamepad. However, I can't understand it and I don't agree.

For VR the wands are much more convenient and immersive to use FOR ME.

And I think HTC as well as Oculus agree with me. Otherwise, they'd just shipped their VR sets with a gamepad.

[Jayjay]

Same, I usually use my Rift + Touch, but even the Windows MR controllers are just so much better immersion than you get with head tracking alone / single base station or camera tracking.

[PSYberition]

Originally posted by ianl:

Originally posted by Psyberition:

Congrats, good for you, we are all glad you are happy with the controls. We aren't, nor are we asking for your controls to change, we just want ours implemented. Everyones brain works differently, whats easy for you can be a pain for another and whats a pain for another can be easy for you. What makes sense to your mind can be gibrish to another, and whats gibrish to you may make sense for another. It's a simple concept that makes sense no matter how it's said. Why is it such a big deal to you that we can't do it your way? or prefer another? I don't care at all how you control your Skyrim, or quite frankly that you disagree with the controls we would prefer. Nor should you how we want to control it, or which controls we prefer. This has never been a problem before yet now that VR is a thing everyone is expected to do things the same way. Do you think the same exact process goes through your brain when you walk as goes through mine when I do? This can easily alter the way two different people THINK about navigating, which in VR by definition will affect (bet you won't see this coming) the way you navigate.

Move on level 0. Some of us are trying to better the game for all based on facts, rather than ourselves based on opinions.

If you bothered to read you would see that I had already supported having both options in the first post of this thread. I was simply responding to the statements Jayjay had made. Looks like I hit a raw nerve where you're concerned. You really shouldn't be so sensitive.

No "raw nerve" hit (which shouldn't matter anyways?), and I did "bother" to read it (can I not reply to statements as you do?). Being open to an option and fighting for it are two very different things. I feel as though I may have been the one to hit a "raw nerve", I assure you I meant no offense towards you. The fact however that this is becoming such a big thing, and Bethesda does not seem to care, or have any interest in addressing it however, is as I said, the important part. Not our differences in opinions on how the game should be controlled, which arguing about is useless, serving literally no purpose.

Has anyone else noticed how repetitive this is becoming? It's quite literally back and forth between the same things, over and over again no matter which discussion of this topic you find. We all love and want to play/enjoy the same game, instead everyone's just arguing over petty things like this. We all have every right to be upset with a AAA quality developer performing below the expectations of a Steam EA release, especially when they're asking twice the price. Indie developers easily incorporate a variety of control schemes into their VR games, so why is Bethesda of all unable?

What are we doing? Arguing over which control scheme is better and being baffled by the fact that anyone could think anything different. When in reality, EVERYONE thinks EVERYTHING differently. Apologies for seeming to imply anything else, didn't mean to make you so defensive that we drew from the topic of discussion.

What should we be doing? Fighting for the quality we deserve from a price like that, everything is relative. I personally am not going to pay $60 for a port that a AAA company made of a pre-existing world. When I can pay a mere $15-30 for something with actual love and care put in to it, made as well as possible for as many as possible. For VR, from the ground up. What Bethesda is doing is ridiculously unacceptable, and the poster should not have even needed to make this thread in the first place. Not on that of a AAA release, when Steam EA titles do better daily.

Fact of the matter, is that our disagreement is useless, you didn't see this kind of petty bickering when people wanted to change WASD, and why was that? Simple, when the idea was brought up, companies cared enough about those paying for them to live, to put forth the little effort it took to make it happen. Even indie devs are capable of this (AND ACTUALLY DOING SO). Something that no longer seems to be the case with Bethesda, and not only in this regard. Bethesda is by definition, being outclassed by indie devs. Yet continuing to ask AAA prices, for a VR title, without VR control options.

Considering I have now stated the intent of my comment multiple times, please don't misinterpret, and if one replies, please remain within the posters topic, for the sake of them not reading useless bickering. If anyone has hit one of my "raw nerves" it's Bethesda, not ANY of you.

[IanL]

Originally posted by Psyberition:

Originally posted by ianl:

If you bothered to read you would see that I had already supported having both options in the first post of this thread. I was simply responding to the statements Jayjay had made. Looks like I hit a raw nerve where you're concerned. You really shouldn't be so sensitive.

No "raw nerve" hit (which shouldn't matter anyways?), and I did "bother" to read it (can I not reply to statements as you do?).
...

Of course you can, but then you did state:

Originally posted by Psyberition:

...
or quite frankly that you disagree with the controls we would prefer.
...

which I don't. Hence the response and reference to not reading what I'd already posted.

Because I later suggest to someone a control method of avoiding the issues he was stating does not mean I disagree with him or you or anyone else for that matter having an alternative. It's your choice in the end and he subsequently replied giving reasons why for him that wasn't practical.

Let's hope Bethesda listen to those of you that have requested alternatives and respond.

[Grebo Punter]

Controller based orientation is silly. It negates the point of having two seprate tracked hands if you have to dedicate an entire hand to pointing every time you move around instead of using it to interact with objects. Might as well just use a gamepad in that case.

[Applesmacked]

Nah this movement is perfect

[fish]

Originally posted by Jayjay:

In real life I move where my head is facing, or deliberately side-step (at a much slower speed than I can walk forwards or backwards I might add).

You're very very odd then. If I'm walking down the street and pass a side street, if I glance down the side street I don't start walking down it. People look around all the time and keep walking the way their body is facing. If you honestly think you don't, I have to question when you last left the house.