Thea 2: The Shattering

Thea 2: The Shattering

View Stats:
OdinTheGrand May 15, 2019 @ 1:28am
First impressions and extremely disappointed
This may come off as harsh but that's only because I really liked the first game. I put nearly 500 hours into it and was genuinely excited for Thea 2. The first time in over 15 years that I was looking forward to a game release.


Thea 2 is not a worthy successor to the first game. Thea 1 is a much simpler game on the surface but is a much deeper experience; the sequel has lost the vision and Slavic charm without improving the game in any meaningful way. Keep in mind, I am comparing these games on their respective maximum difficulties.

You set up a game with a choice of a god among a pantheon. This is similar to Thea 1 but somehow it doesn’t feel as significant. The god-specific bonuses are extremely minor (except for Horz). Instead, the gods have two affinities which can accept one of several bonuses. All the gods nearly feel the same since there are only 6 affinities but 9 Gods.

The start of the game is noticeably different than Thea 1. There are islands and you do not have a town. Okay, great! The town management was stupid and meaningless anyways; Thea 1 was better in the field when you had to scavenge for gear and materials through events and combats. Awesome! Nope. You simply choose where to build your town. Your first town, actually, because you can get more than one. So they took the most boring aspect of Thea 1 and made it more boring by having to manage multiple meaningless towns.

The only purpose of the Town in Thea 1 was to provide a way to lose the game away from your super-powered A-team. If the town was captured then that’s it: game over. There are no such concerns in Thea 2. Your A-team will never die as long as you’re making good decisions and you will never come close to losing if you’re paying attention.

Fine, the only real way to lose has been removed from the game in favor of… nothing? That’s just it, and one of many confusing design decisions in Thea 2. I don’t see the logic in changing the starting conditions. In Thea 1, sometimes you got a hard start and sometimes you got an easy start. The appeal of the game was to make the best of what you were given. In Thea 2, you can cherry pick a prime location for your first town in every single game.

Not that it matters anyways with how gathering has been changed. In Thea 1, you were capped to one unit of gathering from every resource instance. That has been removed in Thea 2 so your first town is perfect as long as you have one food and one fuel. And any resource will work because the town gives so many bonuses to gathering that everyone is a great gatherer, even a rat.

The start of the game is where the game is hardest and most engaging. You’re limited on man-power and resources and the winter season is not a friendly environment. It’s hard to gather food and wood and I found myself relying on combat to eat for another couple turns. That was awesome. I felt like I had to make risky decisions and take questionable combats just to survive. That’s Thea.

Then Spring comes and I get my town built while my children grow up. The game feels all but won. I no longer have to worry about food or fuel and I have a place to recuperate and store all my loot. The game becomes incredibly boring after the first 30 turns because the focus of the game switches from surviving to managing a pointless town. I wish the developers could extend the feel of those first 30 turns throughout an entire 500-turn playthrough.

I suggest adding a difficulty option that completely removes the cosmic seed from the game. No towns and no “other ring”. If your chosen dies once then that’s game over. The player must survive through scavenging and living off the fat of the land. The oppression of carrying limits forces decisions on what to keep and what to throw away. No town and building bonuses makes it so gathering and crafting are actually costly in time and leave you vulnerable to roaming enemies.
Last edited by OdinTheGrand; May 15, 2019 @ 1:35am
< >
Showing 1-15 of 16 comments
Hawk May 15, 2019 @ 1:45am 
The town management is a significant point of the game that you're rebuilding civilization not a rampaging murder machine posse. If anything the fact that you could play it that way is a design fault not a benefit. That's not what the game is supposed to be.

This is a case where you might be in the 1% of all players but you're advocating for something the game isn't nor is wanting to be. Again, the whole point of the game is that the world is dying and you are saving it. That's the game. Maybe management could be better but it's integral to the identity of what Thea is.
OdinTheGrand May 15, 2019 @ 1:50am 
That's why I suggested it as a difficulty option.
DNLH May 15, 2019 @ 3:28am 
The game doesn't force you to settle down, though. Some of your criticism is valid, some comes from the fact that you decided to turtle and then ended up turtling. You can indeed win a game staying on the starting island and being bored for the next few hundreds of turns or you can resist siren call of this charming perspective and stay nomad. Maybe player could refuse when Cosmic Seed is handed to them in-game, for some minor skill boost for Chosen and with a warning that it will increase difficulty. I think that would be an easier solution rather than a difficulty setting that would require rewrite of events.

Not sure where 'losing Slavic charm' comes from, if anything, I feel like there are more random references and nudges thrown into the mix than it was in Awakening, while expanding greatly on its own lore. Maybe that's an issue? I'd agree that story focus shifted to its own mythology, but in this aspect the source material is lackluster and chaotic at best.

The new system for gods was an interesting idea and the affinities are much more than just slots for cards. I felt it the most last game, when switching from my favourites I suddenly lacked Turmoil options in-game which forced me to change my playstyle. The god skills in Awakening look better on the paper, but I haven't end up using most of them, as it was mostly 'max one out in one playthrough, move to next one next playthrough'. I think I returned only to two of them in the end.
mk11 May 15, 2019 @ 3:49am 
The basic god bonus is minor but does lead to some difference in play, about what a level 0 god did in Thea 1. The individual god cards allow for very different starts although there are few that make a significant lasting difference. What to me feels like it is missing is the events that have god specific ways of resolving; like the Dwarf encounters in Thea 1 for Lada.

To me, the game feels comparable to where Thea 1 was at release. It is hard to remember but there were lots of tweaks since then to Thea 1 and the Giants expansion made the game more interesting and opened ways to lose.

I suspect the winter start is actually the easiest option; you get a big experience bonus from some easy encounters and when you start wanting to settle down or move to another island the weather is nice.
Lirion May 15, 2019 @ 4:44am 
You can build 2 towns or no one. Is seem very easy to choose your own way with this options.
Play by one God now (but very long already), see no problems with it.
Valekrin May 15, 2019 @ 5:02am 
As DNLH said, you don't have to settle down. If I build a town, it's usually around 600 turns when I've gathered enough of the top components from combat to make my place spiffy. When you're roaming with a crew of 30+, you'll start concerning yourself with having enough food. Usually I'll gather for a couple of turns while having a high movement character roaming around within range of the main party so I can trigger a few more events while collecting food. The playground opens up a ton of choices for your children when they are getting top attribute bonuses, which in turn can give you more options during encounters.

As for God bonuses, Marovit's spiritual regeneration is phenominal if you prefer magical fights. Zorya's warcry bonus is great if you like to do manual fights and play with more strategy (some fun Strength of the Swarm fights I've had). Stribog is good for the very early game if you want to torture yourself and set sail right away for another island and tough it out.

The game gets very enjoyable once I have a large, diverse party with all the options different events can have. I had a pretty good laugh for the "Love knows no bounds" event in which my Unliving Rat and Eldercone made an Unliving Corpse. 40 turns or so later, that Unliving Corpse hooked up with a Tainted Goblin Shaman and had an Unliving Rat.

Also, try playing with no saves or save-scumming. You're going to get your ass handed to you eventually, be it by a poor dragon choice or a demon portal on steroids. Or maybe just the Red Cave bandits.
Lumisteria May 15, 2019 @ 5:02am 
It's important and great to have feedbacks, and some players do find the hardest settings not hard enough currently to their tastes, so maybe it is possible to give more settings here to make the game a bit harder.

Originally posted by OdinTheGrand:
So they took the most boring aspect of Thea 1 and made it more boring by having to manage multiple meaningless towns.
Except that you don't have to make a town at all, it's a choice you didn't had in Thea 1 and that you have now.

Originally posted by OdinTheGrand:
Fine, the only real way to lose has been removed from the game in favor of… nothing?
You still have ways to lose, it may be not enough for you, of course, but since some people are still struggling in easiest difficulty, i would say that it may be the lack of higher difficulty setting your issue.

I agree that the cosmic seed at the moment is something that not all players want to use in hardest difficulty, the other ring can be really powerful.
Thunderllama May 15, 2019 @ 10:32am 
I agree that the god and card system seems inferior to Thea 1. I wish the Thea 2 god bonuses had a way of leveling up like in Thea 1.

For difficulty, I think it's easy for a player to manage their difficulty according to their choices. Yes, the beginning island is easy, and beginning players will find it appropriate, but if you want a challenge there are lot of options:

1) Only start with 1 character (for bonus bragging points make that character a rat)
2) Leave the starting island by turn X (turn 30?) and never come back. Aim to settle on one of the harder islands (early Dwarf island gives lots of opportunities for game over)
3) Never use Codexes, Scrolls and/or Heavy Armor
OdinTheGrand May 15, 2019 @ 11:34am 
Originally posted by DNLH:
The game doesn't force you to settle down, though. Some of your criticism is valid, some comes from the fact that you decided to turtle and then ended up turtling.

Where did I say that I was turtling? On the contrary, I sought out fights and challenges and pushed the limits of my party. I took 7+ fights (lightbringers) with T1/T2 gear. From what I can tell, these are the toughest fights in the game though I certainly haven't explored everything yet. What I noticed is that these monsters might roam to your town maybe once every 100 turns so you have to go seek them out to have any fun. I think the huge sight range of the town keeps them from spawning anywhere close.

Originally posted by DNLH:
Not sure where 'losing Slavic charm' comes from, ...

I didn't expand on this because it's not really what I want to discuss. Basically, the events feel like a random mixture of memes with superficial references to Slavic folklore. I suppose that's the result of the developer's Kickstart model.


Originally posted by mk11:
The basic god bonus is minor but does lead to some difference in play, about what a level 0 god did in Thea 1. The individual god cards allow for very different starts although there are few that make a significant lasting difference. What to me feels like it is missing is the events that have god specific ways of resolving; like the Dwarf encounters in Thea 1 for Lada.

To me, the game feels comparable to where Thea 1 was at release. It is hard to remember but there were lots of tweaks since then to Thea 1 and the Giants expansion made the game more interesting and opened ways to lose.

I suspect the winter start is actually the easiest option; you get a big experience bonus from some easy encounters and when you start wanting to settle down or move to another island the weather is nice.

The difference is that the developers didn't have a Thea 0 to build from so the incompleteness of Thea 1 at release is more forgivable.

You may be right about the winter start, though there are some winter weather events that can limit movement to 1 or 2 hexes a turn which makes it hard to avoid stuff you don't want to fight. There could be a difficulty option that makes it permanently winter and removes the double XP bonus.


Originally posted by Valekrin:
As DNLH said, you don't have to settle down. If I build a town, it's usually around 600 turns when I've gathered enough of the top components from combat to make my place spiffy.

600 turns? How have you not won the game by then? This also tells me that there's not a time limit (like the Giant's Return) and there needs to be.

As for God bonuses, Marovit's spiritual regeneration is phenominal if you prefer magical fights. Zorya's warcry bonus is great if you like to do manual fights and play with more strategy (some fun Strength of the Swarm fights I've had). Stribog is good for the very early game if you want to torture yourself and set sail right away for another island and tough it out.

The faith healing ritual heals 30-60% faith or something like that. I know that 2 rituals will heal from -10 to 50 in one turn so Marovits regen is perhaps decent in the first 10 turns, if you can manage to find a hex fight by then.

Zorya's warcry is unusable at the highest difficulty from what I can tell. You generally don't want to play your hand until the last turn in combat because card positioning is so important. And besides, the lightbringers have such insane initiative that the 0.5 reduced delay isn't going to matter anyways.

There is a neutral affinity card to start with a raft. Stribog's bonus is not unique.

These bonuses are so minor that I wouldn't have noticed even if they were bugged and not working.

Also, try playing with no saves or save-scumming. You're going to get your ass handed to you eventually, be it by a poor dragon choice or a demon portal on steroids. Or maybe just the Red Cave bandits.

I allowed save-scumming in my first playthrough so I could learn the game without having to worry about making obvious mistakes and so I could explore different decision trees in events. I haven't save-scummed in my subsequent playthroughs and the experience hasn't been any different.


Everyone is missing the point of my complaint. Thea 1 was a decent game that was held back by how easy it became once a player became familiar enough with it. Thea 2 was a chance for the developers to have a hard look at making the game more enjoyable for that caliber of player. Thea 2 has something enjoyable for those first 30 turns then the game becomes laughably easy, even at 200% difficulty.

Thea 2 has nothing for the hardcore fans of the first game. That's my disappointment and I'm surprised that similar players don't feel the same way.
Friend_Of_The_Cats May 15, 2019 @ 11:50am 
Well I think modding will add a lot and give more different approaches to play/win/loose the game and different challenges. Having an hard core option without cosmic seed would be interesting to have.
XenoReaver May 15, 2019 @ 12:15pm 
Originally posted by OdinTheGrand:
Originally posted by Valekrin:
As DNLH said, you don't have to settle down. If I build a town, it's usually around 600 turns when I've gathered enough of the top components from combat to make my place spiffy.

600 turns? How have you not won the game by then? This also tells me that there's not a time limit (like the Giant's Return) and there needs to be.
Some people don't want to win the game quickly but rather take their time. Most of my games take around 500+ turns not because I can't but because I'm completely my own personal goals I'm setting for myself.

Originally posted by OdinTheGrand:
Originally posted by Valekrin:
As for God bonuses, Marovit's spiritual regeneration is phenominal if you prefer magical fights. Zorya's warcry bonus is great if you like to do manual fights and play with more strategy (some fun Strength of the Swarm fights I've had). Stribog is good for the very early game if you want to torture yourself and set sail right away for another island and tough it out.

The faith healing ritual heals 30-60% faith or something like that. I know that 2 rituals will heal from -10 to 50 in one turn so Marovits regen is perhaps decent in the first 10 turns, if you can manage to find a hex fight by then.

Zorya's warcry is unusable at the highest difficulty from what I can tell. You generally don't want to play your hand until the last turn in combat because card positioning is so important. And besides, the lightbringers have such insane initiative that the 0.5 reduced delay isn't going to matter anyways.

There is a neutral affinity card to start with a raft. Stribog's bonus is not unique.

These bonuses are so minor that I wouldn't have noticed even if they were bugged and not working.
Zorya's warcry isn't useless in high difficulties, it's useless if you decide to place your cards last. I play with combat difficulties on maximum and I always play Zorya when I'm going for the physical combat approach. There may be some times I play my cards last depending on my enemy and my equipment but for the most part I play my cards first.

The neutral raft trait card is pretty bad compared to Stribog's special raft. The neutral raft will barely ever be able to carry your stating group from turn 1. Stribog's raft can last quite a while before you get overloaded with loot and people.

I do agree that they are a little on the low end but overall I'm still satisfied with them.
OdinTheGrand May 15, 2019 @ 1:08pm 
Originally posted by XenoReaver:
Some people don't want to win the game quickly but rather take their time. Most of my games take around 500+ turns not because I can't but because I'm completely my own personal goals I'm setting for myself.

You're not seeing my complaint here. The game is trivial if there's no time limit. Players like you might be okay with that but I've already put many hours into the first game. I want something engaging with victory not so sure.

They had this in the first game so why take it out in the second?

Originally posted by XenoReaver:
Zorya's warcry isn't useless in high difficulties, it's useless if you decide to place your cards last. I play with combat difficulties on maximum and I always play Zorya when I'm going for the physical combat approach. There may be some times I play my cards last depending on my enemy and my equipment but for the most part I play my cards first.

If you think Zorya's warcry is useful then you're taking fights that are trivial for the power of your group. If you feel safe playing a card onto an empty board then you have nothing to fear from your opponents hand. Also, playing cards last allows you to avoid inefficient overkill and to properly set up tanking hits. An absolute necessity for squeezing the most from your cards.

Powerful effects, like first strike and weakness/hunter's mark, require things to be on the board to properly use. Summons come in with zero delay regardless of when they're played. There's no place for Zorya's warcry when you're pushing the limits of combat.

Originally posted by XenoReaver:
The neutral raft trait card is pretty bad compared to Stribog's special raft. The neutral raft will barely ever be able to carry your stating group from turn 1. Stribog's raft can last quite a while before you get overloaded with loot and people.

Huh? Are we even playing the same game? They're both about the same movement and the neutral raft can most certainly carry your starting crew since you'll have 4 people or 3 people and 2 children at most.

If you're not immediately setting sail then the bonus is wasted. And if you are then you don't have the loot to concern yourself with anyways.

When you are finally established then it takes like 2 turns to build something as good as Stribog's raft and like 4 turns to build something much, much better which nullifies his bonus for the rest of the game.

Originally posted by XenoReaver:
I do agree that they are a little on the low end but overall I'm still satisfied with them.

That's because you're not seeing the bigger picture. I said there's no real difference between the gods. This was more or less the case with Thea 1 but Thea 2 should be different. The selection of your god should radically change the way the game is approached otherwise what's the point of having the selection? Flavor? This aspect of the game is wholly underwhelming.

I think Nyia comes closest to having an interesting bonus. Horz and Triglav have powerful bonuses but I don't think they're particularly interesting. The rest are comparable to zero-level gods from Thea 1.
Last edited by OdinTheGrand; May 15, 2019 @ 1:18pm
WarOrk May 15, 2019 @ 1:49pm 
Interesting, I have exactly the opposite complaint. I've played 7-8 times now, and given up on 5 of them. 1 I played to level 150 and never built a town because (1) I couldn't figure out how compared to Thea 1 and (2) I read here that the game was designed to be played nomadic. However I did do a lot of resource gathering an crafting, but at level 150, the Lightbringers just WHALLOPED me into a pulp. So I restarted and skipped much crafting & gathering, just going nomadic wandering from quest to quest, but again around turn 150-160, the lightbringers WHOMPED me. So another restart and about turn 160 I just avoided the lightbringers, but was forced to do the "lightbringer" quest that forced me into a RED 7 fight that crushed me. So I gathered, crafted and worked my way up to beat that one by turn 250... but now at turn 300 I've just made my way off main island to explore another, only to find myself getting CRUSHED by the stacks there.

I absolutely MISS the ability to build a "home" to come back to and level up for defense, research etc.

That said, I agree completely with your sentiments about the greatness for Thea 1 and missed opportunities here in 2 to capitalize on the few flaws in 1.

For now, I'm going to hang up my Thea 2 playtime until some more updates, tweaks and adjustments come from the devs. Just not enjoyable at all in current state. Not buggy, not bad, just BOOORING.

I ask again, why build a game with elements of 4X, CCG, RPG, Resource Management and storyline, only to force a playstyle that doesn't allow those elements to play measurable roles in the outcome of the game?
The Hat May 15, 2019 @ 2:19pm 
I enjoy building up slow. I detest rushed timers in games and like taking my time. I like a long campaign with ups and downs. Deaths and challenges that I have to work around. As a bonus for me that more closely models how life works, and how it would be building up from nothing in a harsh environment.
OdinTheGrand May 15, 2019 @ 2:30pm 
Originally posted by WarOrk:
Interesting, I have exactly the opposite complaint. I've played 7-8 times now, and given up on 5 of them. 1 I played to level 150 and never built a town because (1) I couldn't figure out how compared to Thea 1 and (2) I read here that the game was designed to be played nomadic. However I did do a lot of resource gathering an crafting, but at level 150, the Lightbringers just WHALLOPED me into a pulp. So I restarted and skipped much crafting & gathering, just going nomadic wandering from quest to quest, but again around turn 150-160, the lightbringers WHOMPED me. So another restart and about turn 160 I just avoided the lightbringers, but was forced to do the "lightbringer" quest that forced me into a RED 7 fight that crushed me. So I gathered, crafted and worked my way up to beat that one by turn 250... but now at turn 300 I've just made my way off main island to explore another, only to find myself getting CRUSHED by the stacks there.

So far, I've only found 2 ways to reliably beat the lightbringers at a relatively early point in the game:

1. First strikes with wound healing at a friendly town. Basically you whittle down the monster band by playing your first strike attacks and then surrender the fight before committing the round. Then you heal your group by talking to a friendly town and asking to get healed (full heal). You can repeat this several times in one turn, eventually getting the band down to a winnable fight. This is the same trick as Thea 1 with the healer's hut. I think it's easier, actually, because of how distant groups are pulled into the same fight within an area.

2. Summons and weakness/hunter's mark. You use your summons to tank the hits while attacking the card strength of your enemies rather than their life. Weakness and hunter's mark are persistent in combat turn after turn so if you reduce an enemy card to zero damage that card is effectively killed.

Both methods are pretty good but take some practice to reliably pull off. Summons that scale with your power are obviously better. This includes blood summons like Horz werewolf and Zerca unliving rats, as well as codex summons. Pet summons don't seem to scale but they can take one hit at least.

Of course, eventually you'll have the gear to just kill them in a straight fight. You can simply just auto-resolve at that point because the fights are trivial.

I think the lightbringers are one of the better points about the game. They're the only thing that's threatening. I just wish they were more aggressive.


< >
Showing 1-15 of 16 comments
Per page: 1530 50

Date Posted: May 15, 2019 @ 1:28am
Posts: 16