what happen to dark hole and fissure and change of heart?

[hawley.kevin]

what happen to dark hole and fissure and change of heart? there not in the game wtf !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! x( im trying not to flip the ♥♥♥♥ out xD.... anyone who ever used these cards in the past would total understand after playing this game...... ahhhhhh lol

[Little Nemo]

They're too powerful.

[hawley.kevin]

o ok those old cards are to powerful but these new ones arnt........ BS:

[Revelanth]

Originally posted by hawley.kevin:

what happen to dark hole and fissure and change of heart? there not in the game wtf !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! x( im trying not to flip the ♥♥♥♥ out xD.... anyone who ever used these cards in the past would total understand after playing this game...... ahhhhhh lol

Originally posted by hawley.kevin:

o ok those old cards are to powerful but these new ones arnt........ BS:

Change of Heart...
Of course that forbidden, broken card should be in a game which main focus is PvP.

By "new cards" I assume you're referring to archetypes such as Fur Hires. These can easily be nerfed, and are a different thing entirely than overpowered splashable cards.

[76561198847045296]

Too powerful with no cost or restrictions, making PvP broken. Only Bosses from PvE events are allowed to use them. However, Konami just recently implemented a crystal item in Duel Links that allows you to use these OG cards in PvE.

[hawley.kevin]

mrsdiacc thank for explaining...

[Firewalk]

Something to consider:

Old staples like that (except Fissure, that one is laughably obsolete now) have aged rather well for the most part. They have competent, no-cost effects that don't require setup.

Take Change of Heart of instance, one of the MOST broken cards in any modern format, moreso than when it came out in LOB / Starters in 2002.

Back then, all that would do was take a monster which you could either:

- attack your opponent with

and / or

- tribute for a card effect, Tribute Summon or Ritual Summon.

- use as material for a fusion (extremely unlikely).


Today, you gotta add the following to the list:

- Used as cost for a Synchro Summon.

- Used as material for an Xyz Summon.

- Used to conduct a Link Summon.

- If the target is correct, you could even use them for certain fusions more reliably (normal monsters for First of the Dragons for instance)

Adding all of this makes Change of Heart just utterly busted without a cost. Unless it's some crazy errata like a huge LP cost and a once-per-turn restriction, that thing ain't coming back.

[Ninja Consultant]

Originally posted by Firewalk:

Something to consider:

Old staples like that (except Fissure, that one is laughably obsolete now) have aged rather well for the most part. They have competent, no-cost effects that don't require setup.

Take Change of Heart of instance, one of the MOST broken cards in any modern format, moreso than when it came out in LOB / Starters in 2002.

Back then, all that would do was take a monster which you could either:

- attack your opponent with

and / or

- tribute for a card effect, Tribute Summon or Ritual Summon.

- use as material for a fusion (extremely unlikely).


Today, you gotta add the following to the list:

- Used as cost for a Synchro Summon.

- Used as material for an Xyz Summon.

- Used to conduct a Link Summon.

- If the target is correct, you could even use them for certain fusions more reliably (normal monsters for First of the Dragons for instance)

Adding all of this makes Change of Heart just utterly busted without a cost. Unless it's some crazy errata like a huge LP cost and a once-per-turn restriction, that thing ain't coming back.

If you go first and open something like Dark Hole, the card does nothing. It doesn't help you make a board. Going second it only does something if your opponent doesn't have any negations or have Cerberus and good luck having the stars align for that to happen.

Also, you point out all the things Change of Heart can do but Mind Control does just about the same thing and that card is at 3. Nobody tribute summons anymore (except Monarchs, but they can just use Stormforth instead of Change of Heart anyways) and ritual decks aren't going to bother playing it with how good ritual support is now. Lair can just tribute your opponents monsters from their side of the field without even needing to bother taking it first. Being able to attack with the monster you steal with Change of Heart isn't all that valuable in my opinion.

Change of Heart is busted without a cost? It does nothing going first and good luck using it second after your opponent sets up a Knightmare board. Once per turn restriction? Just look at the Sky Strikers and Firewall.

[Little Nemo]

I don't know how in current meta, but Change of Heart was uded to be a broken card indeed. you could steal the uber monster your OP summoned and tribute it, so the OP wasted materials for summoning a monster that right after that died.

[Firewalk]

Originally posted by Ninja Consultant:

Originally posted by Firewalk:

Something to consider:

Old staples like that (except Fissure, that one is laughably obsolete now) have aged rather well for the most part. They have competent, no-cost effects that don't require setup.

Take Change of Heart of instance, one of the MOST broken cards in any modern format, moreso than when it came out in LOB / Starters in 2002.

Back then, all that would do was take a monster which you could either:

- attack your opponent with

and / or

- tribute for a card effect, Tribute Summon or Ritual Summon.

- use as material for a fusion (extremely unlikely).


Today, you gotta add the following to the list:

- Used as cost for a Synchro Summon.

- Used as material for an Xyz Summon.

- Used to conduct a Link Summon.

- If the target is correct, you could even use them for certain fusions more reliably (normal monsters for First of the Dragons for instance)

Adding all of this makes Change of Heart just utterly busted without a cost. Unless it's some crazy errata like a huge LP cost and a once-per-turn restriction, that thing ain't coming back.

If you go first and open something like Dark Hole, the card does nothing. It doesn't help you make a board. Going second it only does something if your opponent doesn't have any negations or have Cerberus and good luck having the stars align for that to happen.

Also, you point out all the things Change of Heart can do but Mind Control does just about the same thing and that card is at 3. Nobody tribute summons anymore (except Monarchs, but they can just use Stormforth instead of Change of Heart anyways) and ritual decks aren't going to bother playing it with how good ritual support is now. Lair can just tribute your opponents monsters from their side of the field without even needing to bother taking it first. Being able to attack with the monster you steal with Change of Heart isn't all that valuable in my opinion.

Change of Heart is busted without a cost? It does nothing going first and good luck using it second after your opponent sets up a Knightmare board. Once per turn restriction? Just look at the Sky Strikers and Firewall.

Don't even compare Brain Control to Change of Heart, they are light-years apart.

- Brain Control costs LP to activate.

- Cannot target face-down monsters.

- Can only be used on monsters that are normal-summonable. You literally cannot use it on any Ritual, Fusion, Xyz, Synchro or any monsters with the "cannot be normal summoned" clause.

I'm sorry, but CoH remains busted. Take it off the the ban list and see what happens.

[Sparse Dunes]

Originally posted by hawley.kevin:

o ok those old cards are to powerful but these new ones arnt........ BS:

Hmm, conditional single spot removal or a potential +4. Gee, I wonder which one is more broken...

It remains limited in the tcg for a reason.

[Ninja Consultant]

Originally posted by Firewalk:

Originally posted by Ninja Consultant:

If you go first and open something like Dark Hole, the card does nothing. It doesn't help you make a board. Going second it only does something if your opponent doesn't have any negations or have Cerberus and good luck having the stars align for that to happen.

Also, you point out all the things Change of Heart can do but Mind Control does just about the same thing and that card is at 3. Nobody tribute summons anymore (except Monarchs, but they can just use Stormforth instead of Change of Heart anyways) and ritual decks aren't going to bother playing it with how good ritual support is now. Lair can just tribute your opponents monsters from their side of the field without even needing to bother taking it first. Being able to attack with the monster you steal with Change of Heart isn't all that valuable in my opinion.

Change of Heart is busted without a cost? It does nothing going first and good luck using it second after your opponent sets up a Knightmare board. Once per turn restriction? Just look at the Sky Strikers and Firewall.

Don't even compare Brain Control to Change of Heart, they are light-years apart.

- Brain Control costs LP to activate.

- Cannot target face-down monsters.

- Can only be used on monsters that are normal-summonable. You literally cannot use it on any Ritual, Fusion, Xyz, Synchro or any monsters with the "cannot be normal summoned" clause.

I'm sorry, but CoH remains busted. Take it off the the ban list and see what happens.

I said Mind Control not Brain Control. You should probably know what cards are before you start talking about what is and isn't "busted".

That being said the only way to find out how bad it is would be by unbanning it and putting it to 1, just like they did with Monster Reborn which I would say is more powerful than Change of Heart for several reasons.

[PisangGore.ng]

Originally posted by Ninja Consultant:

Originally posted by Firewalk:

Don't even compare Brain Control to Change of Heart, they are light-years apart.

- Brain Control costs LP to activate.

- Cannot target face-down monsters.

- Can only be used on monsters that are normal-summonable. You literally cannot use it on any Ritual, Fusion, Xyz, Synchro or any monsters with the "cannot be normal summoned" clause.

I'm sorry, but CoH remains busted. Take it off the the ban list and see what happens.

I said Mind Control not Brain Control. You should probably know what cards are before you start talking about what is and isn't "busted".

That being said the only way to find out how bad it is would be by unbanning it and putting it to 1, just like they did with Monster Reborn which I would say is more powerful than Change of Heart for several reasons.

Mind Control isn't as broken as Change of Heart. I know it still can be used as Synchro material but that's not broken. But Change of Heart? It is the strongest "switch control" cards out there. It's no brainer.

-It has no cost(Brain Control or second effect of Enemy Controller)
-No weakness(Snatch Steal, can be negated more easily because it's an equip spell card)
-No restriction(Mind Control, can't be tributed and atk)

Konami change Snatch Steal from Forbidden to Limited in early 2015, guess what? That card got banned again in the next banlist.

[hawley.kevin]

sounds like sum butthurt kiddies because now it just seem like they moved them cards into monster that are crazy op when someone summon 3 lvl 7 over 2700 attack all in one move really?? gtfo here...... salty over a change of heart that takes control of a monster really lol xD new gen so salty i love it xD

[chelinox6]

Banned since 2005

[hawley.kevin]

lol whatever