Struggling to enjoy DMC 5.

[AlphaSpectre]

This is not a discussion where I hammer on the game for being bad, because I understand I'm not good at it. The reason I find myself more frustrated then entertained is due to a couple of reasons. Before that, I want to stress that I am BAD AT THIS GAME. This is where these complaints come from, not from the game being poorly made.


1. The camera. The camera is perfect for framing the action on screen, but it sucks balls when actually playing. I played through most of the story mode with tracking turned on, I turned it off in an attempt to keep the camera still during action. I eventually realized that it's nearly impossible for me to find the time during combat to adjust it. The reason I hate the camera so much is because all the moves that require directional inputs are tied to the camera, which wants to constantly move.

2. Controls. Dodging works maybe half the times I try, directional inputs require me to try 2 or 3 times before they register, and inputs that need forward and back movements simply never work.

3. Devil Breakers. Only because you can't swap between them without destroying the one you have equipped.

4. (Unrelated to enjoyment) Visuals. This game looks incredible in every department except color and level design. The entire is either grey or red, depending on where you are in the story, and the all levels in the Qliphoth(?) are an eye sore. I know, because it hurt my eyes.


While all of these complaints are completely subjective, I just wanted to get this off my chest. I hate not liking a game everyone else seems to love because I feel like I'm missing something. To balance out the negativity I did enjoy many things in the game anyway.


1. Dante. I absolutely suck playing as him due to his absurd number of weapons and combos, but his Balrog (which I'm convinced is Gilgamesh from 4) is my favorite weapon in the game. Plus his "special form" is incredibly satisfying.

2. The story. The story was one hell of a time, a mix of over-the-top action movie with just a hint of Michael Jackson.

3. V. V has probably my favorite combat system overall with Dante a close second. Nero's was fine too.

4. Music. What can I say? It was badass.


With that off my chest, I guess a discussion can be had or something.

[Gin-chan]

A little advice about the devil breakers and dodging. I'd say just plan out the order of devil breakers you like to use so that you don't get too annoyed at the mechanics. They are pretty much designed to be a discard and draw weapons with all the break ages for them. As for dodging its preferable to dodge using normal jumps as opposed to the dedicated dodge skill as jumps as i-frames in this game and its a lot more reliable and forgiving as opposed to the normal dodges which requires you to be a bit more skillful with the timings.

As for Dante. Yeah....its all about practice really...He's a lot of fun to use once you get into the mindset of how to use him.

[stiel560]

I'm surprised that you like V the most. He doesn't have that many attacks. And in DMD, it feels like hell playing as V.

[Spectrum Legacy]

I agree with the overall sentiment concerning the camera affecting directional buttons during combos is ridiculous and level design regarding Qlipot™️ stages were something I just tried to get through asap. Those parts felt like a chore and didn't even enjoy combat in them due to uninspiring backdrops.

Camera control at least for me is easier ofc using mouselook with camera tracking turned off. However it's far from ideal, due to the angle affecting directional keys.

Being forced to play as characters with different gameplay styles resulted for me in not learning any of them properly after first playthrough, where in previous games you mostly build the skillset and your muscle memory at a steady pace. It's all just too diluted and forced upon the player. Honestly they should have made a mode where after you finish the game once as intended, then you can play with any character in any mission, story continuity be damned.

One thing that I find baffling is how some people bashed dmc from ninjatheory, while to me it wasn't a letdown in any shape or form, except maybe vergil's dlc felt like being a notch of lower budget/quality, reusing the zones and all that. It had very good kb/m controls, combat felt good with meaty impacts (esp. with heavy weapons like the axe), levels were varied enough, etc.

Cinematics are noticeably better in dmc5 of course, but that's hardly a surprise. If I bought the game full price or something due to hype, I'm sure I would feel somewhat let down after finishing it. I don't know whether the satisfaction would come later after finishing all the modes or i'm missing something here, but to think I should play those characters which I don't enjoy much on the hardest modes simply puts me off completely.
I.e. for me dmc5 is not as bad as dmc2 but doesn't hold the candle to what dmc3 meant back then. Heck, I even prefer the consistency of ninja's dmc overall to dmc5...damn it! I said it, alright!

[mdesaleah]

3 is there for balancing reasons, if that wasn’t in, Nero would be broken. The rest comes down to preference. Dante is difficult to use, but his options are what makes him so fun to learn. You might enjoy Bayonetta as well since the camera is zoomed out, and Bayonetta 2 is extremely colorful.

[AlphaSpectre]

I suppose my deeper, subconscious reason for feeling somewhat negative is that I was sold on this game being described as a cathartic action game where you can let loose and feel like a badass. While this is mostly true, it requires a level of skill I was not expecting. Even on human difficulty I struggled with every boss after and including King Cerberus. I was surprised to hear people had trouble with Goliath, I had no issues whatsoever and all I did was spam Blue Rose and Overture, that may be why. Back on topic, I expected this game to be an adrenaline pumping walk through the park with the option to play stylishly to earn more orbs to unlock more moves faster, and that's not what this game is. If you screw around with no regard for avoiding attacks, your balls will be eviscerated. Again, not a problem with the game, just with me and my expectations.

Things I thought were important to mention:

I have played DMC before. Based on my comparison you may have noticed, it was 4, a VERY long time ago. I didn't even take it seriously back then. All I did was what looked cool, which rarely got me a good rank, but I enjoyed the hell out of it. Maybe I should do that here.

Even though V's combat is somewhat simple (compared to Dante and Nero), that's why I like it. Not to mention S ranks are much easier to get.

I understand why Devil Breakers can't be a "pick whatever whenever" mechanic, but I still don't like it. If I had to make a change to of some sort, I would probably have the player choose which Breaker to use at the beginning of a mission and that would be it. I would also have their move-sets expanded by incorporating them into Nero's normal combos.

I've been relying on jumping to avoid damage for a while but it's also somewhat inconsistent with bosses, like Goliath, Urizen 3, and Vergil.

[ChurchGorilla]

Why the hell would you think that the game series whose third title is renowned for being one of the most ballbusting, brutal and merciless games of its time would be a walk through the park?

If I had to make a change to of some sort, I would probably have the player choose which Breaker to use at the beginning of a mission and that would it

You can do that, baka. Just equip a single breaker in all slots at mission start

it's also somewhat inconsistent

It isn't. You just suck at timing it.

[omed_86]

I agree on the camera bit, it makes some input difficult, at least for me. Actually I find V the least fun to use for that reason.

Devil Breakers were a bit confusing for me to deal with at first, but as I experimented with each of them, and as I started my second playthrough as well as spending some time in the void, I know which ones I like most and which is more effective against some bosses. I also learned to keep them longer.

Playing Dante can be intimidating, but having played DMC4, I found it easier to deal with style switching in 5, idk if the game is slower or what. Here is what I do:

I see what I am up against and pick a style accordingly, for example I use trickster against Knights, so I can get behind them quickly, and I use Balrog to land many hits quickly, during that or when they're down, I switch to SwordMaster so I can wail on them.
If I am being overwhelmed, I like to use a mix of trickster and gunslinger to weaken enemies and get rid of the smaller ones.
Aaaand I never use Royal Guard XD So that is one less style to worry about. maybe when I get better.

[AlphaSpectre]

In case someone didn't read far enough or understand my opinion regarding Devil Breakers, I'm not saying to pick one and leave the breakers themselves unchanged. I further explained by saying how I would incorporate them into Nero's normal move-set. As a perfect example, the Tomboy. This breaker already incorporates itself into Nero's moves by augmenting them. This is what I would have all the breakers do. For example, Overture would have it's normal attack it already has, but with a special move that enhances all normal attacks with lightning. Or take Gerbera and add extra stun to normal attacks while uppercuts launch you and the enemy higher and slams have a tornado-like effect. Or Rawhide changes Red Queen into a Castlevania style whip sword. This is what I said in my suggestion.

[drz30]

I've just finished the game(12 hours) and I have to say im very disappointed. I know this game is meant to be played multiple times but why would I?

- boring story
- anoying/unlikable characters
- generic boss fights
- terrible camera
- not enough mob variation

I have to say I wish I haden't spent 40 bucks on this game. It feels like a rip-off.

[ChurchGorilla]

Overture would have it's normal attack it already has, but with a special move that enhances all normal attacks with lightning

So it would just take the role of Tomboy then. Unless you just mean a minimal property modifiyer, not entire animation changes, in which case it would just take the function of Exceed or Buster punches.

Or take Gerbera and add extra stun to normal attacks while uppercuts launch you and the enemy higher and slams have a tornado-like effect

That's what Exceed is for, baka.

Or Rawhide changes Red Queen into a Castlevania style whip sword

Rawhide already has its own mini combos. And again, it would just take the role of Tomboy.

Christs sake, stop talking about things you don't understand. Hold your ideas and criticism for yourself until you mastered the combat system and realize how wrong you were.

[AlphaSpectre]

I don't understand why you're acting so antagonistic. I'm not trying to gank on the game and say it's bad. I explicitly stated in the beginning that I know I'm bad at this game and that it is not poorly made. I started this discussion so I could try to explain why I'm not enjoying it as much as those who say it's game of the year already.

What I did not start this discussion for is so you could say "git gud before you talk about it." If you think my opinion is completely invalid because I haven't beaten it on Hell and Hell difficulty, then pretend I and this discussion don't exist and leave.

[One Elf]

Originally posted by AlphaSpectre:

This is not a discussion where I hammer on the game for being bad, because I understand I'm not good at it. The reason I find myself more frustrated then entertained is due to a couple of reasons. Before that, I want to stress that I am BAD AT THIS GAME. This is where these complaints come from, not from the game being poorly made.


1. The camera. The camera is perfect for framing the action on screen, but it sucks balls when actually playing. I played through most of the story mode with tracking turned on, I turned it off in an attempt to keep the camera still during action. I eventually realized that it's nearly impossible for me to find the time during combat to adjust it. The reason I hate the camera so much is because all the moves that require directional inputs are tied to the camera, which wants to constantly move.

2. Controls. Dodging works maybe half the times I try, directional inputs require me to try 2 or 3 times before they register, and inputs that need forward and back movements simply never work.

3. Devil Breakers. Only because you can't swap between them without destroying the one you have equipped.

4. (Unrelated to enjoyment) Visuals. This game looks incredible in every department except color and level design. The entire is either grey or red, depending on where you are in the story, and the all levels in the Qliphoth(?) are an eye sore. I know, because it hurt my eyes.


While all of these complaints are completely subjective, I just wanted to get this off my chest. I hate not liking a game everyone else seems to love because I feel like I'm missing something. To balance out the negativity I did enjoy many things in the game anyway.


1. Dante. I absolutely suck playing as him due to his absurd number of weapons and combos, but his Balrog (which I'm convinced is Gilgamesh from 4) is my favorite weapon in the game. Plus his "special form" is incredibly satisfying.

2. The story. The story was one hell of a time, a mix of over-the-top action movie with just a hint of Michael Jackson.

3. V. V has probably my favorite combat system overall with Dante a close second. Nero's was fine too.

4. Music. What can I say? It was badass.


With that off my chest, I guess a discussion can be had or something.

Here's my opinion based off what you said.

1:I gotgud and I still agree. I wish there was a option to keep the camera behind you. it's one of the things I loved about DmC. The camera often stayed behind you even though the game lacked a lock-on(originally). However thanks to DmC: Devil May Cry we also got to see that the camera staying behind you can be a lethal mess in some aspects of the game. I'm on the fence on what they should do about it.

All I can say is practice situational awareness more for now. Helps alot to really understand the angle your at.

2: They always work, if they don't check to make sure your controller devices aren't faulty. Main issue with DMC is that they don't have Dodge types. Dodge is relative to the camera and the camera sometimes moves too much. Especially versus Emphusa Queen, the attack angle can be very strange for inputs.

3: Fair enough. They should be swappable like Dante's guns. However I also see the severe story inconsistency and balance issue with this.

4: This is the theme of the game. I'm not trying to be rude but this is a very childish complaint I keep hearing. It's no different than IGN's "too much water" for Gen3 pokemon, which was centered around a coast and islands not far off the coast. This is a must have theme in the game. They can't change the theme to be more appealing because it would:

A: Contradict the statement made about how the roots are everywhere
B: Ruin the immersion for the people playing for the story.

I wish BP got a change however. It could be more versatile in it's looks as it's not tied to story at all.

Part B

1: Balrog seems to be so or atleast a remaster of Gilgamesh with a Beriel touch. This weapon is alot of peoples favorite and believe it or not it can do everything. Parry, get SSS alot, Slaughter, juggles, evade, etc.

2-4: I agree. Though Nero got a massive rework rather people notice or not. Mix because launch height changes, ground bouncing, enemy down time and blowback speed/distances.
--------------
There are improvements that can be made to the game(mostly on nero, a fair amount on V as well). Feel free to let me know what you think about my response.

[AlphaSpectre]

After some though into why the normal (buildings, street, etc.) environments are very grey most of the time, I think it might be so the abnormal (Qliphoth roots, enemies, bosses, etc.) would stand out more as they are typically more colorful. This complaint mostly stems from my memory of DMC 4 which had loads of popping colors and looked incredible.

A little clarification on dodging, it goes hand in hand with my camera complaint. I would love to dodge to the right of an enemy, but the camera moves just enough that I end up jumping backwards instead. I do agree with your opinion of the camera that it's just something I have to get used to, it just makes the game less enjoyable for me until I do. This is where git gud has a solid foundation.

Everything else you've said I agree with or likely forgot to mention.

[One Elf]

Originally posted by AlphaSpectre:

After some though into why the normal (buildings, street, etc.) environments are very grey most of the time, I think it might be so the abnormal (Qliphoth roots, enemies, bosses, etc.) would stand out more as they are typically more colorful. This complaint mostly stems from my memory of DMC 4 which had loads of popping colors and looked incredible.

A little clarification on dodging, it goes hand in hand with my camera complaint. I would love to dodge to the right of an enemy, but the camera moves just enough that I end up jumping backwards instead. I do agree with your opinion of the camera that it's just something I have to get used to, it just makes the game less enjoyable for me until I do. This is where git gud has a solid foundation.

Everything else you've said I agree with or likely forgot to mention.

Fair enough. No worries everyone has abit of issues with the camera. It doesn't move/still consistently enough though it has reason to move. Sometimes it doesn't and it's wierd. Anyway hope you have fun. You'll get used to it in time.

[Mastatoe]

Originally posted by AlphaSpectre:

This is not a discussion where I hammer on the game for being bad, because I understand I'm not good at it. The reason I find myself more frustrated then entertained is due to a couple of reasons. Before that, I want to stress that I am BAD AT THIS GAME. This is where these complaints come from, not from the game being poorly made.


1. The camera. The camera is perfect for framing the action on screen, but it sucks balls when actually playing. I played through most of the story mode with tracking turned on, I turned it off in an attempt to keep the camera still during action. I eventually realized that it's nearly impossible for me to find the time during combat to adjust it. The reason I hate the camera so much is because all the moves that require directional inputs are tied to the camera, which wants to constantly move.

2. Controls. Dodging works maybe half the times I try, directional inputs require me to try 2 or 3 times before they register, and inputs that need forward and back movements simply never work.

3. Devil Breakers. Only because you can't swap between them without destroying the one you have equipped.

4. (Unrelated to enjoyment) Visuals. This game looks incredible in every department except color and level design. The entire is either grey or red, depending on where you are in the story, and the all levels in the Qliphoth(?) are an eye sore. I know, because it hurt my eyes.


While all of these complaints are completely subjective, I just wanted to get this off my chest. I hate not liking a game everyone else seems to love because I feel like I'm missing something. To balance out the negativity I did enjoy many things in the game anyway.


1. Dante. I absolutely suck playing as him due to his absurd number of weapons and combos, but his Balrog (which I'm convinced is Gilgamesh from 4) is my favorite weapon in the game. Plus his "special form" is incredibly satisfying.

2. The story. The story was one hell of a time, a mix of over-the-top action movie with just a hint of Michael Jackson.

3. V. V has probably my favorite combat system overall with Dante a close second. Nero's was fine too.

4. Music. What can I say? It was badass.


With that off my chest, I guess a discussion can be had or something.

git gud