Devil May Cry 5

Devil May Cry 5

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[SPOILERS] Issues with the Characters/Story
So I finished the game yesterday for the first time. There are a few things I didn't like about story/characters design here:

1) What happened to the Sons of Sparda being SUPER IDENTICAL TWINS?
Vergil no longer looks EXACTLY like Dante - as it always have been in DMC games and lore. They are supposed to be 100% identical twins. And that with the hair down - Vergil should look precisely like Dante. Just like in DMC3.

I don't care for different hairstyle/physical condition - but they should still look exactly the same. How can they be Sparda's identical twins without looking alike?
I absolutely love Dante's new look in this game. But I can't get the fact that suddenly they are not identical twins anymore. And Vergil well... he just look off.

I was really hoping for a throwback scene where they fight in the rain again or in a pool of blood - and both hairs get wet and then Vergil looks exactly like Dante (minus clothing).
Correct me if I'm wrong but I think they are not even the same height anymore? (with Vergil being taller).

I don't mind that Vergil is "older brother" now. Because twins aren't born at the same moment. But seriously - WHY CAPCOM?
You already have a great scan model.
You can practically save money - by not hiring another guy.
The scan models don't do the mo-cap and acting - so it's not like you need them both at the same time on-frame, in performance capture.
It makes no sense.

This is probably one of my biggest gripes in this game.
Last edited by Slayer Seraph; Mar 24, 2019 @ 7:03am
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Showing 1-15 of 64 comments
Slayer Seraph Mar 24, 2019 @ 7:03am 
2) Pointless profanities: especially Nero's forced, untimely and edgy F-Bombs! Like what the hell Nero?
"We are taking this F'ing thing down!" was dumb.
Later in Mission 20, you do an emotional serious speech about family and brotherhood - your father accept your challenge and you suddenly shout "F-YOU!".
You already showed them your DT form and have their attention - it's not like it's surprising anyone at this point.
You shouldn't swear at your father like that (not to mention he didn't even know Nero existed). It's sending a bad message that it's cool to curse your dad. He is trying to make peace with his father - then he curses him. WTH?

The stupid swears were a big turn-off in the horrible DmC.
So why Capcom started adding so many swears and language into their games? Former DMC games (and RE games) were perfectly fine without them. It was part of the charm.

Now, Nero even does F-bombs every time you activate DT - which is really obnoxious.
I can ignore some of the Shi*t and Bitc*h and As*s - even though they are also too frequent.
Slayer Seraph Mar 24, 2019 @ 7:03am 
3) Nico: The most annoying character by far! She isn't a team player. She's foul mouth and irritating. She always act like "I'm girl with tattoos - so I'm tough and cool".
The make things worse - she appears WAY TOO OFTEN! In fact she appears almost as much as Nero! And more than most other characters.
She even tainted the ending- making her appearance and dialogue annoying as hell.

4) Trish and Lady are totally sidelined here. They hardly have a role in the story.

5) Not continuation after mission 20. I think it would be better if you finish the game with Dante and Vergil and do a few more missions. Facing hordes of demons and new powerful enemies and bosses. Cutting the Tree. And eventually battling Mundus together - slaying him for good.
Heck even meeting Sparda somehow would have been so great...

6) Not enough Eva (and Sparda for that matter). Eva appears for merely a few seconds - and it was great. I was hoping for more memories.
It isn't fully explained how/why Vergil disappeared that day too. Or how he survived and lived during his absence until DMC3.
I also hoped to see Sparda either alive or in flashbacks or "in spirit". In the anime it's suggested he is alive.
easymoneysniper Mar 24, 2019 @ 7:52am 
Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
You shouldn't swear at your father like that (not to mention he didn't even know Nero existed). It's sending a bad message that it's cool to curse your dad. He is trying to make peace with his father
gotta be bait
Slayer Seraph Mar 24, 2019 @ 8:08am 
Originally posted by JacoTheNotSoGreat:
Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
You shouldn't swear at your father like that (not to mention he didn't even know Nero existed). It's sending a bad message that it's cool to curse your dad. He is trying to make peace with his father
gotta be bait
What?
MINUANO GAMING Mar 24, 2019 @ 8:53am 
Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
You shouldn't swear at your father like that (not to mention he didn't even know Nero existed). It's sending a bad message that it's cool to curse your dad. He is trying to make peace with his father - then he curses him. WTH?


Are you serious? It doesn't matter if he knew about Nero being his son or not, he just showed up out of nowhere and crippled the guy he could only assume was his nephew, because he was salty about losing a fight to his brother.

Not only that, but he was that much of a douchebag to still use Nero in order to achieve his goals.

Yelling "♥♥♥♥ you, ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥" and beating the crap out of Vergil is a very tame reaction on Nero's part.
george47mathew Mar 24, 2019 @ 9:03am 
Capcom was clearly in a hurry to get this over with and they baked up a half assed story. Vergil model seems hurriedly done. The others look detailed. I dont know why Dante even allowed a human like Lady to go on ahead to battle this new demon king. She is VERY lucky to be alive for a human. One lucky hit on the vitals is enough to end her. No sense here...

The story on Vergil on how he had Nero was promptly ignored...it warrants a DLC...but knowing Capcom, they probably wont. Nero suddenly throwing around profanities, guess they got some of their team from DmC reboot. So many plotholes...

We really need to know HOW Vergil even had Nero, did he fall for someone...but again its promptly ignored. If they had added Vergil they could have even MORE sales...but I guess they are not that good at marketing.


Its also clearly shown on how Vergil never knew he even had a son, so that makes that arm cut off a pure accident. I mean, he could have just killed, but just prodded on. All I see is just big case of misunderstanding. Still a lot of plotholes....too many to list.

Wish we get a DLC on Vergils side of the story. He has sooo much potential and is actually a much more badass character that does not use human weapons like guns. Pure supernatural. Wish Capcom banked on this as DLC at the very least.



Slayer Seraph Mar 24, 2019 @ 9:46am 
Originally posted by Smokin' Sexy Style:
Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
You shouldn't swear at your father like that (not to mention he didn't even know Nero existed). It's sending a bad message that it's cool to curse your dad. He is trying to make peace with his father - then he curses him. WTH?


Are you serious? It doesn't matter if he knew about Nero being his son or not, he just showed up out of nowhere and crippled the guy he could only assume was his nephew, because he was salty about losing a fight to his brother.

Not only that, but he was that much of a douchebag to still use Nero in order to achieve his goals.

Yelling "♥♥♥♥ you, ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥" and beating the crap out of Vergil is a very tame reaction on Nero's part.
No it's not. It's stupid. It was in an attempt to make Nero appear cool and edgy and it's annoying and distracting. Nero just had a nice talk with Kyrie, decides he doesn't want to kill he father, and instead want to make peace between the brothers and reunite with his family - that was a rather unique and strong plot twist.
Not only that but it was a character development moment - because Nero was always the wild hot headed rage guy. But suddenly he is composed. Determined and resolved to save BOTH his discovered family members. He was very calm and peaceful about it.
THAT was cool and inspiring.

But then, he approaches them. He challenges Vergil. And then the moment you use your DT he shouts "♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ YOU!" in super slow motion - it was just awkward. Vergil didn't even say anything insulting to him or disrespectful. Heck Vergil could have easily killed him a few times over but he didn't. And the "both you Fing A-hole" was also just silly.
If you wanted your dad to accept our existence - would you F-bomb your way to approval? Would cursing your father so badly it help make him respect you - or make things much worse?

The only people who find F-BOMBS cool are probably dumb teenagers.

Slayer Seraph Mar 24, 2019 @ 9:54am 
No one else is going to talk about the appearance thing?
#1 thing for me was the fact Vergil doesn't look like Dante. They are identical twins. Identical Sparda twins - that btw should look pretty much exactly like Sparda too.
How can they still be identical if they no longer look like the same person?
There's really no benefit in using a different model too - which is a bizarre choice by the devs.



Originally posted by george47mathew:
Capcom was clearly in a hurry to get this over with and they baked up a half assed story. Vergil model seems hurriedly done. The others look detailed. I dont know why Dante even allowed a human like Lady to go on ahead to battle this new demon king. She is VERY lucky to be alive for a human. One lucky hit on the vitals is enough to end her. No sense here...

The story on Vergil on how he had Nero was promptly ignored...it warrants a DLC...but knowing Capcom, they probably wont. Nero suddenly throwing around profanities, guess they got some of their team from DmC reboot. So many plotholes...

We really need to know HOW Vergil even had Nero, did he fall for someone...but again its promptly ignored. If they had added Vergil they could have even MORE sales...but I guess they are not that good at marketing.


Its also clearly shown on how Vergil never knew he even had a son, so that makes that arm cut off a pure accident. I mean, he could have just killed, but just prodded on. All I see is just big case of misunderstanding. Still a lot of plotholes....too many to list.

Wish we get a DLC on Vergils side of the story. He has sooo much potential and is actually a much more badass character that does not use human weapons like guns. Pure supernatural. Wish Capcom banked on this as DLC at the very least.
Yeah the definitely could have done more with the game and story. I really wanted Vergil to help Dante and Nero defeat a great demonic menace. I refused to believe Urizen is Vergil - even though he is only part of him - and hoped that it's a different demon using him as a conduit or something.

I think the game could continue for at least 5-10 more missions after 20. It shouldn't have ended like this.Even add playable Vergil. And let you play as Dante and/or Vergil together in Hell battling demons and destroying Mundus.
I wanted them to talk more about their childhood. More Eva flashbacks and maybe even meet Sparda.

With all the changes to Nero and especially Nico being the most annoying sidekick ever - I wouldn't mind playing a full game as Dante. I'm glad that the major story & final parts are played by him and not Nero.

Last edited by Slayer Seraph; Mar 24, 2019 @ 9:55am
BigLol Mar 24, 2019 @ 10:03am 
The problem with DmC was that they used swearing because edge.
Here it's very mixed well with the dialogue and doesn't stand out too much.
Are we really in a day and age where swearing in an 18+ game is too much?
Slayer Seraph Mar 24, 2019 @ 10:25am 
Originally posted by EyalolGadol:
The problem with DmC was that they used swearing because edge.
Here it's very mixed well with the dialogue and doesn't stand out too much.
Are we really in a day and age where swearing in an 18+ game is too much?
Swearing so much and so distastefully doesn't make people adults. It doesn't make games mature.
Would F-bombs make games like RE4, RE5, RE6, DMC3 and DMC4 better and more enjoyable?
They were all perfectly mature and fun and charming in their own way.

I mean MAYBE if the game had Mundus again -which I was disappointed it didn't - then a little bit of swearing was on point because - he freaking killed their parents. But sadly, that didn't happen.

Another interesting point, I just realized - they marketed Dante as a man bent on revenge:
"The supernatural family drama also continues as Dante, the Son of Sparda, seeks revenge for his brother’s corruption and mother’s murder."

Source:
https://comicbook.com/gaming/2018/08/13/devil-may-cry-5-playable-demo/

Was this cut from the game perhaps?
Because we have scenes like Dante's mothers final moments.
And the fact Red Grave is Dante's home town.
And Dante reaching his childhood home for the very first time ever (I wish we could enter the house itself and explore their childhood). Even a photo of Sparda.
And reference to Mundus.

Maybe they did intended to get Mundus and Dante's revenge arc inside the game? I genuinely thought Vergil is being controlled and manipulated as Urizen - by a greater entity and that Dante will eventually discover that and set out to free him. Then the brothers would fight together and end the source of evil. I truly thought this game will redeem Vergil. In a way they did. But I thought it would be different.
No other villain beside Vergil is just.... strange. (I know Urizen isn't exactly Vergil)
george47mathew Mar 24, 2019 @ 10:39am 
Technically...Vergil was not the villain per se...he seems more like a confused person with a lot of pride issues and its clearly shown and hinted he thought his mother left him behind for Dante and most of the hate is part that and became a habit coz deep down Vergil still loves his mom and Dante, as V he still thinks of her at least its shown that his sentimental human side does...when Griffon questions if he was thinking of mother.

So, in DMC3 we see Vergil at first defeats Dante but never goes for the kill, he never beheads him, just a lousy stab. Seems to me Vergil cant bring himself to outright kill his bro. He could even have killed Lady.

At the end we see Vergil as someone who wants power partly also due to defeat against his little bro and still....He really has no Idea why he even truly needs power and what he is going to do with it. Yeah...its shown Vergil mostly fights Dante out of pure habit this time. Nero got lucky, he got emotional boost...and Vergil's mind isn't clear...too much confusion and revelations.


What we need to know is who is that lucky women to snag Vergil?. Well, we'd like to know. Hoping Capcom does make at least a short DLC like the Reboot DmC did. Vergil is a marketable character....surely Capcom knows this...right?
Bstel Mar 24, 2019 @ 10:55am 
The members of the Order in DMC4 actually described Nero as foul-mouthed. So I think him not swearing a lot in DMC4 is a bit of an inconsistency for the sake of toning the game down, as far as I know. That, and Nero doesn't like cursing in front of Kyrie.

In this game, he's pretty much alone, and is allowed to let loose both physically and emotionally. Plus, Nero likes to bait and rile people/demons up, and since he grew up among members of The Order of Fortuna (very reserved group of people), I imagine cursing willy nilly is the easiest way to rile people around him up without harming anyone. No one ever said Nero is a mature dude.

Plus, I think Nero's confrontation with Vergil kind of went over your head. He's not there for Vergil's approval. He's there to be acknowledged and that he has a say in the family matter, even if Dante and Vergil disagree. And the easiest way to be acknowledged? Shout loud enough until everyone can hear you. He doesn't give a flying ♥♥♥♥ about anyone's approval. He's sick of Dante patronizing him and V leading him on all the while knowing the truth of his heritage.
IlluminaZero Mar 24, 2019 @ 11:01am 
Yeah Nero was a punk from the beginning. Back when Nero thought the Order of the Sword was legit he had headphones on and was ignoring the pope's sermons and almost left in the middle of the procession. Not only was Nero's ♥♥♥♥ YOU towards Vergil in-character but it was much deserved. I mean even if you ignore the fact that Nero may have at one point had abandonment issues or that Vergil RIPPED OFF HIS ARM by that point Vergil had essentially been responsible for the annihilation of TWO CITIES.
Sixtyfivekills Mar 24, 2019 @ 11:06am 
Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
1) What happened to the Sons of Sparda being SUPER IDENTICAL TWINS?
Vergil no longer looks EXACTLY like Dante - as it always have been in DMC games and lore. They are supposed to be 100% identical twins. And that with the hair down - Vergil should look precisely like Dante. Just like in DMC3.
Because Vergil is too handsome, and i know some twins that are nothing like each other.


Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
2) Pointless profanities: especially Nero's forced, untimely and edgy F-Bombs! Like what the hell Nero?
You've never heard or seen anyone angry in your life? He had all rights to swear during the Vergil fight.


Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
3) Nico: The most annoying character by far! She isn't a team player. She's foul mouth and irritating. She always act like "I'm girl with tattoos - so I'm tough and cool".
Because everyone has to be super serious and deep huh? Nico is easily the best sidekick in the series.


Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
4) Trish and Lady are totally sidelined here. They hardly have a role in the story.
Agree.


Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
Not continuation after mission 20.
What, you wanted to fight Mundus after the end of DMC 3 as well, despite knowing Vergil's fate? They're fighting and having a blast, what more could you ask for?




Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
6) Not enough Eva (and Sparda for that matter).
That one memory is the whole reason for Vergil being what he was, no need for fillers. And if you're really desperate for more, you'll get a picture of Eva and Dante outside of old house if you're good enough.
Last edited by Sixtyfivekills; Mar 24, 2019 @ 11:06am
AnalogFlame Mar 24, 2019 @ 11:24am 
Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:
2) Pointless profanities: especially Nero's forced, untimely and edgy F-Bombs! Like what the hell Nero?
"We are taking this F'ing thing down!" was dumb.
Later in Mission 20, you do an emotional serious speech about family and brotherhood - your father accept your challenge and you suddenly shout "F-YOU!".
You already showed them your DT form and have their attention - it's not like it's surprising anyone at this point.
You shouldn't swear at your father like that (not to mention he didn't even know Nero existed). It's sending a bad message that it's cool to curse your dad. He is trying to make peace with his father - then he curses him. WTH?

The stupid swears were a big turn-off in the horrible DmC.
So why Capcom started adding so many swears and language into their games? Former DMC games (and RE games) were perfectly fine without them. It was part of the charm.

Now, Nero even does F-bombs every time you activate DT - which is really obnoxious.
I can ignore some of the Shi*t and Bitc*h and As*s - even though they are also too frequent.
Well cause it actually works for Nero and in that situation it was called for. It's not like he's yelling it at some random succubus. He's yelling it at his dad who 1. took his arm. 2. beat the ♥♥♥♥ out of him. 3. Is trying to kill Dante. 4. Refusing to acknowledge him. It actually fits
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Date Posted: Mar 24, 2019 @ 7:00am
Posts: 64