How good is the combat actually?

[Terrarius]

How good is it in your opinion?
I just finished sekiro and i realy got tons of joy fighting the lategame bosses but i don"t think im willing to spent 2-3hours per run just walking past all opposition just to get to the bosses again.Exploration is fun the first time through but it realy harms replay value in my opinion.
That is why i am looking for something combat orientated that has tons of replay value simply by having less downtime between challenging fights.

What i found best about sekiro"s combat was how much attention you had to pay to your enemys, how varied their movesets are and how different moves of them require different responses .
My main concern is that DMC5 isn"t as much about learning enemy patterns and the correct responses to them as it is about just pulling off cool combos

[Ding]

Just watch sakaki1224's last vids about dmc5. Guess sekiro stands away when sees this madness.

[supperdiamondo]

there are enemies where you have to learn the pattern. one specific enemy can be defeated really easily when you manage to land a hit at a specific moment. there are enemies with hyper armour, teleports, and the ability to directly counter certain key abilities of your characters. you can deflect certain enemies attack if they properly clash with your attack so you can counter them.

the game also features parries (which differ in rewards depending on how well you time them), dodges are also sensitive to how close you time them. one character has the ability to increase his sword's damage by pressing a button at a proper time and its rewards are either a tiny bit of charge, 1/3, or full charge. and it is not a simple power increase.

on human or devil hunter difficulty, it is rather easy (if you are used to action games, go straight to devil hunter) but it is so, that you can enjoy the story. on higher difficulties, enemy layout is changed and they are much stronger where you cannot just style without thought.

there is also bloody palace mode, which is just combat. this game is all about combat mechanics.

[Bstel]

Pulling off cool combos that are actually cool is actually pretty hard. Don't let the premise of over the top action fool you. On higher difficulties, even the basic enemies will kick your ass. Getting to A rank in a combat is good and all, but getting to SSS rank requires an understanding of the characters' movesets and enemy attacks. Knowing when to dodge at the last second for extra score or even parrying attacks or even when to taunt effectively.

I find myself developing specific strategies for specific enemies, and also a different set of strategies when multiple enemy variants gang up on you. The game gives you a practice mode so that you can familiarize yourself with enemy attacks and patterns if you want to. Timing and multitasking is the key to DMC5, especially when you find yourself holding down buttons while doing combos while also looking out for enemies as they gang up on you.

The three available characters also have very different movesets and strategies for using them. Nero is a hard-hitter. He goes in fast and hard. V is more of a mage-like character. Sticks in the back while his familiars deal with enemies, but you have to manage your DT (magic meter) and also protect your familiars so they don't die at the worst of times. Dante is all about strategizing your moves, planning out attacks ahead of time before going in hard. He deals less damage than Nero, but in contrast, has waaay more moves in his arsenal than the other two characters.

[Supa]

if you like 1on1 focused difficult combat I dont think you like DMC. I've seen so many people who likes Souls dislike DMC... In DMC you do not fight against any hard enemies until the later difficulties and getting there is a chore if you do not enjoy the early gameplay. Exploration and maps scale is also kept on minimum.

Instead of focusing on a 1on1 challenge DMC is about throwing enemies into the air and thinking which of the 100+ attacks you will use next to play with your pray. Many people find this sort of gameplay hard to find challenging because the game isnt directly challenging you but instead you have to challenge yourself. Many people never even touch mechanics such as buffering, enemy step, animation canceling or experimenting with their grip.

Like you can watch a new player play and it looks pretty boring smash 1 button game but then you watch some combo video from youtube and youre like hold on that game looks completely different now. :/

[Terrarius]

Originally posted by Supa:

if you like 1on1 focused difficult combat I dont think you like DMC. I've seen so many people who likes Souls dislike DMC... In DMC you do not fight against any hard enemies until the later difficulties and getting there is a chore if you do not enjoy the early gameplay. Exploration and maps scale is also kept on minimum.

Instead of focusing on a 1on1 challenge DMC is about throwing enemies into the air and thinking which of the 100+ attacks you will use next to play with your pray. Many people find this sort of gameplay hard to find challenging because the game isnt directly challenging you but instead you have to challenge yourself. Many people never even touch mechanics such as buffering, enemy step, animation canceling or experimenting with their grip.

Like you can watch a new player play and it looks pretty boring smash 1 button game but then you watch some combo video from youtube and youre like hold on that game looks completely different now. :/

Do you know action games that focus on 1vs1 combat without much exploration and story inbetween?(would go for fighters if they were not totaly unfun to get into(and it taking forever to do so))

[Supa]

If you like parrying did you play Metal Gear Rising? Not much exploration but long cinematics. Furi is a bossrush game and gives you a good challenge on hard difficulty but it is from a different perspective.

[Bstel]

Originally posted by Terrarius:

Originally posted by Supa:

if you like 1on1 focused difficult combat I dont think you like DMC. I've seen so many people who likes Souls dislike DMC... In DMC you do not fight against any hard enemies until the later difficulties and getting there is a chore if you do not enjoy the early gameplay. Exploration and maps scale is also kept on minimum.

Instead of focusing on a 1on1 challenge DMC is about throwing enemies into the air and thinking which of the 100+ attacks you will use next to play with your pray. Many people find this sort of gameplay hard to find challenging because the game isnt directly challenging you but instead you have to challenge yourself. Many people never even touch mechanics such as buffering, enemy step, animation canceling or experimenting with their grip.

Like you can watch a new player play and it looks pretty boring smash 1 button game but then you watch some combo video from youtube and youre like hold on that game looks completely different now. :/

Do you know action games that focus on 1vs1 combat without much exploration and story inbetween?(would go for fighters if they were not totaly unfun to get into(and it taking forever to do so))

Hellblade: Senua's Sacrifice?

Tbh, it's pretty hard to find something specific like that. Most action games pit you against hordes of enemies. Even SoulsBorne games are heavily focused on explorations. It's why the game can afford to give you 1v1 fights, because the explorations are like the break between encounters. Most linear games that forgoes exploration rarely give you 1v1 unless it's a boss fight.

[Slayer Seraph]

Is Sekiro any good? Am I the only finding it a bit *meh seem that before* looking?

[One Stoned Bastard]

Originally posted by Terrarius:

How good is it in your opinion?

DMC5 combat's pretty good 9/10.

Some good ol' easy-to-learn, hard-to-master bullsh*t.

[BassChamber]

Sekiro combat gameplay is trash.

[Terrarius]

Originally posted by Ransom Seraph:

Is Sekiro any good? Am I the only finding it a bit *meh seem that before* looking?

It has in my opinion the best fromsoft-combat. But it is also alot harder than the souls-series
You have to learn when to parry,jump over and sidestep and overall have to play alot more aggresive

[DarkJuda On Deck]

I rarely see people coming from Sekiro /.FromSoft grasping the essence of DMC if they never played it before.
It doesn't work the same way at all. The game mecanics are vastly different.
It's like going from Arma to Call of Duty expecting them to be the same because they are both war oriented. You'll get truly disapointed. Not because it's bad, DMC5 is great, but because everything works differently.

Sekiro is a action rpg with an "heavy" and slow combat mechanic that focuses on the world around you and its dangers, and if the enemy attacks are different depending on the enemy, the process stays the same, parry, dodge and wait for an oppening to strike.
DMC5 is a character action game with an high paced and highly versatile combat mechanic that focuses on the characters you play. Every enemy is different and the strategy you use from one to another can vastly differs depending the attack he is doing, the other ennemies around, your character, the weapon he is using and the way you want to do it.

If I have to sum them both in a word, I'd say that sekiro is "rewarding"/"satisfying" when you manage to kill a difficult enemy without getting hit, and DMC5 is "pure fun" when you kill hard enemies with style.

Not only the process, but the fellings you get and the goal are different.

That said, considering you are looking for a combat oriented game with high replay value, DMC5 might be interesting for you.
You said that DMC5 is more about comboing than learning your enemies patterns, an that is mostly true, yet to survive in DMD/HaH you have to not only master your characters, but master your ennemies too.

First run in Devil Hunter mode (normal) is to teach you your characters basic moves and discover your ennemies. You can consider it as a tutorial.
Second run in Sons of Spara mode (hard) is to teach you to master your characters and their weapons.
Third run in Dante Must Die (very hard) is to teach you to master your enemies. Because they are not joking around here.
Fourth run is Hell an Hell (masochist?) is to teach you to not get hit. At all.

Don't bothr with human (disabled), it's for people who can't handle a gamepad properly.

I hope my poor english helps.

[Terrarius]

Originally posted by DarkJuda:

I rarely see people coming from Sekiro /.FromSoft grasping the essence of DMC if they never played it before.
It doesn't work the same way at all. The game mecanics are vastly different.
It's like going from Arma to Call of Duty expecting them to be the same because they are both war oriented. You'll get truly disapointed. Not because it's bad, DMC5 is great, but because everything works differently.

Sekiro is a action rpg with an "heavy" and slow combat mechanic that focuses on the world around you and its dangers, and if the enemy attacks are different depending on the enemy, the process stays the same, parry, dodge and wait for an oppening to strike.
DMC5 is a character action game with an high paced and highly versatile combat mechanic that focuses on the characters you play. Every enemy is different and the strategy you use from one to another can vastly differs depending the attack he is doing, the other ennemies around, your character, the weapon he is using and the way you want to do it.

If I have to sum them both in a word, I'd say that sekiro is "rewarding"/"satisfying" when you manage to kill a difficult enemy without getting hit, and DMC5 is "pure fun" when you kill hard enemies with style.

Not only the process, but the fellings you get and the goal are different.

That said, considering you are looking for a combat oriented game with high replay value, DMC5 might be interesting for you.
You said that DMC5 is more about comboing than learning your enemies patterns, an that is mostly true, yet to survive in DMD/HaH you have to not only master your characters, but master your ennemies too.

First run in Devil Hunter mode (normal) is to teach you your characters basic moves and discover your ennemies. You can consider it as a tutorial.
Second run in Sons of Spara mode (hard) is to teach you to master your characters and their weapons.
Third run in Dante Must Die (very hard) is to teach you to master your enemies. Because they are not joking around here.
Fourth run is Hell an Hell (masochist?) is to teach you to not get hit. At all.

Don't bothr with human (disabled), it's for people who can't handle a gamepad properly.

I hope my poor english helps.

How tough are the controls and combos?
*(I am not looking for fighting game controls where even bread and butter moves require precise dpad-movement and where full combos take multiple hours of practise until you can even pull them off once)

[DarkJuda On Deck]

Originally posted by Terrarius:

How tough are the controls and combos?
*(I am not looking for fighting game controls where even bread and butter moves require precise dpad-movement and where full combos take multiple hours of practise until you can even pull them off once)

Tough question.

Basic controls are easy to learn, and the combos comes along as you get better and as you get a better understanding of your character. I wouldn't say precise dpad movement since dpad is not used to move in this game (by default at least) , but if you meant precise stick movement in addition to sword button, id say kinda. Not "precise" actually. But it definitely requires more stick movement than Sekiro considering the attacks depend on it.

Moves as is are not hard to pull off (it's not a street fighter game with special moves), some are just like [Backward to forward, sword] or even [backward +sword] or jump, [Forward+sword]. It's the ability to chain those combos together that is hard, but that comes with mastering your character.

But if are looking for a game were you just have to block then strike without touching the sticks (like Sekiro), DMC5 clearly isn't what your are looking for. You don't even block in DMC. You can parry if your blade clashes on an enemy attack, but you don't block attacks. Well, a little bit with Dante, but it doesn't work like Sekiro at all. So let's say you don't, it's easier.

So an exemple, for Nero.
At first your combos will be like: grapple, [sword, sword, sword], gun
Then you will learn a few moves and will be like: grapple, [sword, sword, pause, sword, sword, sword], gun, grapple, [backward to forward, sword], gun, [forward + sword]
Then you will manage to do combos mid air: jump, grapple, [sword, sword, pause, sword sword,sword], [backward to foward, sword], grapple, [backward to forward,sword], grapple, [backward + sword]
Then you will learn how to jump cancel (a move that resets your double jump, allowing to jump once more in mid air each time you to it), and you will be juggling enemies in the air like they are nothing.

A little like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f6r27rrkY44
Minor spoilers here, as half comes DMC4 and the other half comes from DMC5 demo.

Oh and I forgot, the lock on and dodging system is often what trully pulls off FromSoft fans. In DMC you have to (pretty much) constantly push the lock on button (by default it's R1/RB) as most moves depends on it, unlike in Sekiro where you just have to click R3/Right Joystick once to lock.
In DMC, there is no "dedicated" dodge button (and even less a magic "evade all damage" button". To dodge, you can jump, double jump,. You can also roll by pressing the lock on button, left stick to left of right and jump button. That's for the basics. This is not a flow. It's just different. Now, each characters has there own specifities and can "avoid from getting hit" in a multitude of ways.

Like I said, both games are hugely different.

You see, one the biggest difference between Sekiro and DMC is that in Sekiro, you get most of the gameplay from the very beggining, and the sole purpose of the game is to master it perfectly so you can discover its world, while in DMC you start with very few moves and as you progress though the game and get better, you unlock new moves to play with so you can make even longer combos.

While Sekiro is like "This is ancient japan. Full of mysteries to discover and treasures to harvest. Enemies are way stronger than you. You will have to be veeery careful and wait for them to commit mistakes if you want to stay alive."
DMC is more like: "hey, here's your character. He's truly a badass. This game will teach you how to master him so you can have tons of fun while smacking demons around and look badass too".

I've saw a lot of people coming from the FromSoft games saying that DMC combat system is archaïc, unefficient, or frustrating compared to souls. They couldn't be more wrong.
DMC5 is meant to be played for it's gameplay and it has been designed with that in mind. DMC5 one of the deepest and tightest action games ever made when it comes to its gameplay and it is considered by many as the king of hack'n'slash games.

Don't play it if you expect a Sekiro game with replayablility. You'll hate it for being so much different from what you are used to.

[Vi]

Originally posted by Bisul Bernanah:

Originally posted by Terrarius:

Do you know action games that focus on 1vs1 combat without much exploration and story inbetween?(would go for fighters if they were not totaly unfun to get into(and it taking forever to do so))

Hellblade: Senua's Sacrifice?

Tbh, it's pretty hard to find something specific like that. Most action games pit you against hordes of enemies. Even SoulsBorne games are heavily focused on explorations. It's why the game can afford to give you 1v1 fights, because the explorations are like the break between encounters. Most linear games that forgoes exploration rarely give you 1v1 unless it's a boss fight.

Senua's Sacrifice is 99% exploration and story in between the combat, the game's focus is on the story, characters, presentation, pretty much everything but combat