Fully Upgrading Rooms Too Early..

[Drayton Sawyer]

Wondering if I really screwed up or my first run of the game is still salvageable as I started having space and power issues and ended up fully upgrading a two block storage room as well as a three block power room to max and my population is about 23 with everyone around level 20(with weapons and armor). Will incidents in those two rooms end my run?

Really don't want to start over, spent way too much time on this and Mysterious Stranger kept giving me thousands so had the caps to spend and kinda regret spending them but kinda paranoid now.

[JoshSA]

From what I can tell, it's fine to upgrade rooms to level 3 IF you have 6 dwellers in those rooms permanently. Probably even 4 dwellers would be fine, but I prefer 6 so that incidents in those rooms can be dealt with quickly.

Having high level rooms which are empty makes the game more difficult, not sure if its impossible, but I avoided upgrading most rooms unless I had the dwellers to occupy the rooms.

Rooms like storage and training rooms I never, ever upgrade as they will not usually have dwellers in them permanently to handle the risk.

[Mardoin69]

Upgrading rooms to tier 3 has the disadvantage of enabling higher level creatures to invade your vault. It's most noticeable with the dreaded scorpions. It's not to bad of an issue as long as all your dwellers have pretty decent weapons, you keep plenty of rad-away's and stimpaks on hand, the dwellers have high endurance armor and you've been upgrading their endurance points prior to leveling them much. Otherwise, it can start getting pretty tough after a while.

[torqueblue]

Unless something changed, and it hasn't on my end, A High Level Threat in a High Level Room Is Just a Threat in THAT ROOM. If the threat Jumps to Another Room it Just becomes that Room's Level Threat.

Threat Level 3 Rad Scorpion That Spawns in the Level 3 Storage Room Is Level 3, If it Jumps to a Level 1 Room It becomes a Level one Threat.

On my Survival Vault I never upgraded any Production rooms because of the High Risk of Threats easily wiping out Rooms with Super Dwellers. Fires, Molerats, and Rad Scorpions are just plain ugly.

If you separate Non Productions rooms, such as Storage, Living Space, from Production rooms then the Threat that Happens in those areas are isolated in those rooms, Creating a Layer between Said rooms means Fires, Molerat outbreaks just take care of themselves with no Risk of Dweller Deaths. So you're free to Upgrade those Rooms to the Max.

I Usually Place Living Space on the Very bottom and Storage on the Very Top with the First Layer having Guards at the door, 3 wide Medic Room and 2 Wide Science Room. If Fires happen a Mister Handy will take care of it and I just move those Working Dwellers to Rooms that the Fire already spread and Died out.

If you really wanted to, You can Create a Layer Isolated from other Productions rooms and Make a Maxed out Production layer with nothing but Pregnant Dwellers. The Run away and can't die, so No worries about losing anything other time wasted for the Threat to Die out.

Just Remember the Threat is Much Higher based on the Upgrade of the room, how wide it is matters to some Degree, but it's Way more manageable to deal with. If you have a 3 wide fully upgraded Room, then It's gonna be much harder to deal with.

[Drayton Sawyer]

Originally posted by JoshSA:

From what I can tell, it's fine to upgrade rooms to level 3 IF you have 6 dwellers in those rooms permanently. Probably even 4 dwellers would be fine, but I prefer 6 so that incidents in those rooms can be dealt with quickly.

Having high level rooms which are empty makes the game more difficult, not sure if its impossible, but I avoided upgrading most rooms unless I had the dwellers to occupy the rooms.

Rooms like storage and training rooms I never, ever upgrade as they will not usually have dwellers in them permanently to handle the risk.

I should have stated that I'm playing on Normal and not Survival, so I guess I might be fine if it's just these two rooms for now as I do have 6 dwellers in the power room at all times and even though no one is usually in the storage room even when there is a fire there I've been able to just send the power room guys over to put it out without much issue. Part of me wants to destroy the storage room and remake it (and I have the caps to do so) but rather spend them on other things at the moment.

Originally posted by Mardoin69:

Upgrading rooms to tier 3 has the disadvantage of enabling higher level creatures to invade your vault. It's most noticeable with the dreaded scorpions. It's not to bad of an issue as long as all your dwellers have pretty decent weapons, you keep plenty of rad-away's and stimpaks on hand, the dwellers have high endurance armor and you've been upgrading their endurance points prior to leveling them much. Otherwise, it can start getting pretty tough after a while.

This is something I've yet to encounter, Radscorpions. Not even had Mole Rats show up yet, just roaches, so while I seem to be fine when a fire breaks out, I haven't really been tested with invasions. What do you consider decent weapons/gear? All my dwellers have weapons and armor but it's pretty basic, raider/football armor and low level shotguns/rifles. Guess I should focus on gearing them up and keeping population low enough not to trigger the scorpions for a while longer, got stalled at around 30 dwellers there for awhile because didn't feel like waiting on pregnancies anymore as it seems to take forever lol.

Just glad I started on Normal first to get some of these mistakes out of the way early!

[Drayton Sawyer]

Originally posted by torqueblue:

Unless something changed, and it hasn't on my end, A High Level Threat in a High Level Room Is Just a Threat in THAT ROOM. If the threat Jumps to Another Room it Just becomes that Room's Level Threat.

Threat Level 3 Rad Scorpion That Spawns in the Level 3 Storage Room Is Level 3, If it Jumps to a Level 1 Room It becomes a Level one Threat.

On my Survival Vault I never upgraded any Production rooms because of the High Risk of Threats easily wiping out Rooms with Super Dwellers. Fires, Molerats, and Rad Scorpions are just plain ugly.

If you separate Non Productions rooms, such as Storage, Living Space, from Production rooms then the Threat that Happens in those areas are isolated in those rooms, Creating a Layer between Said rooms means Fires, Molerat outbreaks just take care of themselves with no Risk of Dweller Deaths. So you're free to Upgrade those Rooms to the Max.

I Usually Place Living Space on the Very bottom and Storage on the Very Top with the First Layer having Guards at the door, 3 wide Medic Room and 2 Wide Science Room. If Fires happen a Mister Handy will take care of it and I just move those Working Dwellers to Rooms that the Fire already spread and Died out.

If you really wanted to, You can Create a Layer Isolated from other Productions rooms and Make a Maxed out Production layer with nothing but Pregnant Dwellers. The Run away and can't die, so No worries about losing anything other time wasted for the Threat to Die out.

Just Remember the Threat is Much Higher based on the Upgrade of the room, how wide it is matters to some Degree, but it's Way more manageable to deal with. If you have a 3 wide fully upgraded Room, then It's gonna be much harder to deal with.

Good to know! I'll have to take a look at base layout configurations in more depth when I do Survival, current run is based off a Youtuber and it seems pretty solid but it doesn't take into consideration those issues you mentioned.

Does dweller level matter much on Normal? I know you shouldn't level them up on Survival until you can train stats but it's hard not to when I tend to just drag people where I need them and even just collecting resources can have them accidentally clicked. Needs an option to turn click to level up off or something..

[torqueblue]

Originally posted by Drayton Sawyer:

Originally posted by torqueblue:

SNIP

Good to know! I'll have to take a look at base layout configurations in more depth when I do Survival, current run is based off a Youtuber and it seems pretty solid but it doesn't take into consideration those issues you mentioned.

Does dweller level matter much on Normal? I know you shouldn't level them up on Survival until you can train stats but it's hard not to when I tend to just drag people where I need them and even just collecting resources can have them accidentally clicked. Needs an option to turn click to level up off or something..

So on Normal Mode you don't really have to worry to much about losing Dwellers, You have the option, If i'm remembering correctly, to revive Dwellers that have died to Whatever for a few caps.

Dweller level Does Matter. Aside from training super dwellers, it also affects the level of Outside raids you get invading your Vault. It only Matters as a Vault Average Dweller Level. Meaning If all your Dwellers are level 20 your going to get Level 20 encounters. Yes, Misclicking is an issue, and Surprised it was never addressed, You can just Kick them out but Personally I just Stick those Dwellers that Have been with me from the Beginning in a Low Risk Production Building. You want a Level 1 Dweller with Maxed out Endurance Before anything else. Give them a +7 Endurance Suit and send out with the best Weapon and max stimpacks with a Few Radaway and you'll have a Super Dweller with Max HP

You Stated in your other post you haven't Encountered Radscorpions yet, It's most Likely because you have Met the Conditions yet. More Dwellers = New Threats. On normal mode the conditions are Higher so you don't have to worry about getting your Vault Destroyed by Deathclaws early, I wanna say around 60 or so Dwellers and you'll have hit the Threshold for All Threats.

Bear in mind that in Survival the Threats are Harder, Conditions for Threats are easier and quicker to meet, and Everything Hits hard, and Dwellers Die Permanently with no Option to revive, including Legendary Dwellers.

[Mardoin69]

Ideally, for weapons...... you want everyone to have the shotgun that does 6 - 8 damage as a minimum. That's not going to be the case in the early game obviously but, with a bit of time and crafting, you should be able to get them all upgraded to that minimum while scrapping the stupid pea shooter wpns.
For gear, whatever has endurance gains is best cuz the higher their endurance, the more hit points they gain when they level. This means in the late game....when you have harder enemies like Radscorpions and Deathclaws,.... they should be able to withstand an attack. Granted you might still need to be dosing them each with a stimpak during the fight.

For the other stuff, the other posts have pretty much covered it. But, if you want to know more about the mechanics of the game, search the wiki. Agility and Perception will be a little helpful in battles too, with Endurance being the main focus. Pretty much all other stats are just specific to production rooms......except Luck....which helps in finding better loot on wasteland explorations. But, I've never really noticed much benefit in 'Luck.'

[torqueblue]

Originally posted by Mardoin69:

Ideally, for weapons...... you want everyone to have the shotgun that does 6 - 8 damage as a minimum. That's not going to be the case in the early game obviously but, with a bit of time and crafting, you should be able to get them all upgraded to that minimum while scrapping the stupid pea shooter wpns.
For gear, whatever has endurance gains is best cuz the higher their endurance, the more hit points they gain when they level. This means in the late game....when you have harder enemies like Radscorpions and Deathclaws,.... they should be able to withstand an attack. Granted you might still need to be dosing them each with a stimpak during the fight.

For the other stuff, the other posts have pretty much covered it. But, if you want to know more about the mechanics of the game, search the wiki. Agility and Perception will be a little helpful in battles too, with Endurance being the main focus. Pretty much all other stats are just specific to production rooms......except Luck....which helps in finding better loot on wasteland explorations. But, I've never really noticed much benefit in 'Luck.'

Luck increases the Crit gauge in quest battles, increases the amount of Caps you gain while exploring the wasteland. It doesn't have that much influence when exploring the wasteland.

Other Stats help with finding loot. Strength, Perception, Intelligence, and Endurance Have way more influence in finding loot then luck. The Travel logs tell you how much those stats help.

High Main Stat in the Production rooms reduce the time it takes for Resources to be gathered, Luck increases your chance for getting Caps as a Bonus when you or the Mr. Handy Collects the Resources in the Vault.

[gareeth]

Originally posted by Mardoin69:

Id Pretty much all other stats are just specific to production rooms......except Luck....which helps in finding better loot on wasteland explorations. But, I've never really noticed much benefit in 'Luck.'

Think perception is the helpful wasteland stat. Other than the critical hit multiplier that has been mentioned if you rush a room where you have dwellers with higher luck the chances of success go up.

[gareeth]

Originally posted by Drayton Sawyer:

[
Good to know! I'll have to take a look at base layout configurations in more depth when I do Survival, current run is based off a Youtuber and it seems pretty solid but it doesn't take into consideration those issues you mentioned.

Does dweller level matter much on Normal? I know you shouldn't level them up on Survival until you can train stats but it's hard not to when I tend to just drag people where I need them and even just collecting resources can have them accidentally clicked. Needs an option to turn click to level up off or something..

Dweller level matters on normal as far as health goes up by level. How much help is mitigated by how much endurance and your early regular dwellers won't have much.

One thing I'd recommend when it comes to a game like this is experience with the game is going to give you the best understanding so as you've seen going by Youtube may leave something quite key out potentially because people who make how to guides tend to understand the game but many forget what they didn't know in their first few hours of play.

As you can restart a vault there's not much harm to finding some things out the hard way although I play in spurts with months in between so bulldozing one or even all three on return is how I play.

I like the end stage but the early and middle -period are more challenging as even though threats grow they actually grow fairly fast and once your dwellers are going to be successful all the time a lot of challenge also exits

I have my doubts that the one change I would like is having to double click a dweller to select them but I am pretty sure turning leveling off won't happen as keeping it down while staying viable until you can train endurance is a pretty major mechanic

Balancing the needs of the vault with your desire for better dwellers is the challenge eventually as the need for power, food and water will grow and however much you want all you born in the vault dwellers to train stats before they see action the fact this goal can't be met when it begins to seem possible is a fairly key decision point.

There's something to be said to the learn by hitting incredible failure points method of playing a game . It really makes the knowledge deeply yours.