How to make fail stacks?

[Shaun]

I know you can use advice from valks and start off with lets say 50 fail stacks. How to you get them to 90 and beyond? I will probably do the nadder quest for season also and would prefer not to use an alt if possible

[Karna5]

I've gotten way into the 230+ or even 240+ a few times starting from 100 FS. The key is to only use large FS on super difficult items, and if you fail (mmeaning the item drops a level) move off the big FS and use smaller FS on the failed item.

For instance, let's say you're tring to make PEN blackstar helm.

Initially:
Use 30 FS on PRI to DUO
Use 40tto 50 FS on DUO to TRI
Use 80 + FS on TRI to TET

If PRI to DUO fails enough times to hit 40+, don't use that 40+ on the PRI to DUO. Save it for DUO to TRI

If DUO to TRI hits 80, don'tuse it on DUO to TRI. Save it for either TRI to TET or for other hard items you want to make

Eventually you can build up several large FS by alternating betweeen (sorry for typos I can't see my worsd) big FS on hard attempts.

For instance, when I made my TET BS gloves, I ended with a 238 FS and a 258 FS, one of which finally succeeded on the gloves and which left me with a spare 238 FS which I'm now using on PEN BS helm attempts

Basically, don't overkill your FS on anything less than TET because that's how you start getting bigger FS. Wehn your TET+ attempts fail, start building multiple stacks.

p.s. If you're working Boss instead of Blackstar, remember that TET boss is TRI BS, so shift what I said down a lebvel for boss FS decisions, more or less. For instance, you should be able to nail PEN boss with low 100s, but you''re less likely to hit PEN BS in low 100s.

p.p.s. I know it's hard to resist, and it's up to you, but if you can, try to resist using cron stones on anything less than PEN attempts. I tell you this knowing you'll cave in and use them, but know that you'll end up burning all your cron stones and not have them for the PEN attempts if you do. Building up big FS icomes from failure unless you use cron stones, and if you use cron stones and fail you lose the cron stones without getting a better FS.

This said, if you ever use cron stones on a boss gear attempt, go to the blacksmith and remove the cap;hras from the failed attempt before trying again. Boss gear gets caphras as small consolation from failing cron attempts, but it really is better inlong run to save your crons for PEN attempts (or dream horse awakening).

[Karna5]

Here's a side comment with regard to decisions on what you upgrade. I generally think in terms of blackstar, but I realize that when you're starting the game it's better to think in terms of boss gear (yellow armor and weapons--I think i have typos sorry).

Here are advantages of boss vs blackstar:

Boss:
- easier to get when you're starting off. You can get drops from doing boss monsters with boss alts (characters who don't mind death penalty) or can buy it fairly cheap on central market

- when you hit TET boss armor or weapon, instead of shooting for PEN you can add four caphra levels to the item to make it almost as good as PEN, and that goes a long way for making your character(s) strong wh ile you build up your account to higher tiers of difficulty.

Blackstar:
- at TET and PEN levels doesn't need caphras to be super good

- the BS quests are kinda fun and give a good feeling of achievement. I've done the BS quests at least four times and will probably do a fifth one in the next few months. This said, a new account will find the BS quests hard to do because of the rarity of materials. Look into what materials you need for them and start saving now so that someday when you decide to do BS quests you'll have what you need ready. You never have too many materials.

- nice PVM bonuses (extra damage or resistance against monsters)

Personally I love BS more than Boss, but BS is a huge investment in time, so it's bettter to start with Boss and eventually replace it with BS if you like BS.

I find BS too expensive to buy on CM for TRI+ levels, though. Central market you can buy boss all the way up to PEN level, but BS it's better to either make from scratch using the BS questline or to buy a cheap PRI or less BS and enhance up to TET yourself.

p.s. And h ere's a side comment on jewelry. You may have noticed I did not mention jewelry enhancement. This is because (not counting Season gear) jewelry enhancement is by far the worst game mechanic in all of Black Desert. You lose all your progress completely if you fail an enhancement attempt,and if you use cronstones on an attempt, you can still lose an enhancement level which is at high levels just as bad as losing everything.

A year or two ago I made my own TET Ring of Crescent guardian by scratch, and it cost me about 2 1/2 billion to make. Yes, that was about half th eprice of buying it outright on centra market at the time, but the sheer quantity of complete failures in which I destroyed PRI, DUO and TRI rings is absurd. I don' teven think about jewelry enhancement when discussing enhancement in BDO because it'll just make you crazy with fury if you try to make all your own jewelry instead of buying it safely off the central market.

[Shaun]

ok thanks.. real helpful.. wasnt real sure about force failing? think i saw that somewhere that you use up durability to add a fail....... not sure

[Karna5]

Originally posted by Shaun:

ok thanks.. real helpful.. wasnt real sure about force failing? think i saw that somewhere that you use up durability to add a fail....... not sure

Yes, when enhancing boss or blackstar items, memory fragments are an essential part of the enhancement process. Memory fragments is what you use to restore durability in those items.

If you're enhancing blue or green armor and weapoons, however, don't waste memory fragments on those unless you have no other choice. For those it's cheaper to use unenhanced armor and weapons of the same type to restore the durability.

A few weeks ago I was trying to enhance a blackstar helm, and I ran out of memorry fragments. So each attempt was delayed while I accumulated enough memory fragments to get the durability high enough to try again.

Don't worry if you ever run out of an enhancement material (I suppose that's part of what you calll face falling, if I read your comment correctly). That happens to everyone who makes their own gear instead of buying it off central market. Waiting while you restock is normal.

p.s. I don't buy memory fragments or caphras off the central market. I just accumulate them myself through normal gameplay and loot, and when I have enough memory fragments to try again I try again.

The only stuff I ever buy off the central market for enhancing is blackstones as I burn through countless thousands of those, more than I could ever get as loot drops.

[Shaun]

you just use blacksmith memory or what it was called. so for example with my failstacks get to 40, isnt there a blacksmith item i can buy to save it instead of using another toon. ALso, im still not overly certain on how to get stacks so high. is it just by failing only, or can you use the force fail or something like that. thought there was a force fail

[Karna5]

Originally posted by Shaun:

you just use blacksmith memory or what it was called. so for example with my failstacks get to 40, isnt there a blacksmith item i can buy to save it instead of using another toon. ALso, im still not overly certain on how to get stacks so high. is it just by failing only, or can you use the force fail or something like that. thought there was a force fail

I can't be exact in descriptions because I can't currently see the GUI, but:

1. FS up to 30 you can just use blackstones directly (it's part of the enhancement menu now)

2. Yes, the blacksmith sells scrolls where you can store unused FS (I think up to 50 if I recall correctly), but I don't use that anymore

3. There's a new feature called Naderr's Parchment (sp?) which adds slots you can store unused FS or swap them back and forth with what you're using. There's also a quest you can take to get at least one slot (I forgot how many), and I think they gave away a slot a while back, so in theory you can get at least one or two slots to store and swap failstacks.

The shop sells slot expansions, but they're expensive (ten or eleven bucks a slot, possibly on sail now for $9). I did buy a couple of expansions because I enhance a lot. I think I currently have six slots, but I don't remember buying more than two.

The Naderr's slots are handy because, unlike Blacksmith scrolls, they have no cap on FS level. If you build up to 258 FS, for instance, the Naderr slot can hold it (though any FS over 100 in size has a delay before you can swap it--don't ask me why as I think it's one of the silliest decisions BDO ever made, haha).

Failstacks only increase on failures and only if you were not using cron stones.

Some people enhance cheap armor and use an option during enhancement to make it harder to succeed, and they do +14 to +15 or do TET to PEN on junky armor to make success super hard. While I experimente with that, I don't do it. I simply use th emethod I described above in which I use stuff I want to enhance to bujild my failstacks.

[Shaun]

Thanks. i guess whats confusing me is how to get failstacks higher up. so does that mean I would grab a TET weapon fail on it, then it goes to TRI.. So would I then store that stack, get closer another weapon up to TET, and then just keep swapping those stacks?

[Karna5]

Hi, Shaun. Hitting TET is too hard to waste (in my opinion--I'm sure some on YouTube will disagree).

I believe in using cron stones for TET to PEN.

Where I build my failstacks is on failed attempts of TRI to TET.

In fact, I get my biggest failstacks on blackstar TRI to TET (i've gotten at least two or three FS well past 200 that way, and tons up in the 180+ range).

So whether you're doing boss TRI to TET or BS TRI to TET, keep an eye on your FS, and if it starts getting too big start a new FS and save the big failstacks for TET to PEN attempts.

P.S. Also don't worry about messing up. If you're not sure, then experiment. The best learning comes from your own experimentation, and no loss is too big to recover with time.

[Maconijnr]

just to chip in on this a little as karna has pretty much answered your question :)
I personally use my manos riding crop for building fail stacks, as it is something I have but don't need as much as my other gear, so i don't mind when it breaks or goes down levels :)

[Nhika]

Shaun seems super new.
For now try making full tet weapons on Seasonal.
At Tri Seasonal guy gives you a 40 FS to use to make a Tet.
Then he gives you another FS for getting tet to use to Pen a seasonal.

So burn all of your mats EXCEPT for refined stones until you are out of timeless.
Then refine them back to Tri so you can grind.

Later on when you are working on armor; use those failstacks he gives you for pen on accessories (hint; seasonal reward you get a necklace, leveling to 60 and 61 gives you an earring and a ring already at pen).

[Shaun]

thanks all for the detailed explanations. much appreciated