Karmabombing explained and critiqued. Also: PvE servers when?

[Megakruemel[GER]]

So after this recent patch there has been a lot of complaining about PvP karma changes. I myself am not really in that field right now, since i just play a few classes up till 50 and then start a new one, while farming with auto fishing and gardening. I do hear a lot of complaining though. So i at least wanted to give my 2 cents after reading up about it a lot.

ANYWAY- With the recent change in the karma system people seem to complain about karmabombing a lot.
For those of you, who don't know what that actually is: If you enter a spot where someone else is grinding and you have positive karma and they kill you because they think you are after their spot: They loose karma and you are the bad person, since they loose karma. Fun right? Remember, you are the bad person. You made them kill you. You made them loose karma. You bad person.
Thing is, apparently this is something people actually do on purpose.

Seeing this from another perspective: The grinding person has been there, just activated his daily booster to effectifely grind. But along comes a completely new dude, who just strolls in and takes your mobs before you can kill them, effectively cutting down on your grind effiecency.
Well that sucks. But what can you do? You could actually kill him/her. Thing is: if you do you loose karma, since actually, this person has done nothing wrong, at least the game thinks so.

BUT: Karmabombing in actuallity means people, who repeatatly stroll into grinding spots with a guy who kills them, so the guy who kills them gets negative karma and eventually leaves the spot. I have no freaking idea why anyone would actually do this... except for getting the spot.
But getting killed repeatadly seems really unfun for me.

There is a lot of discussion going on, if the recent change to karma inflicts this situation (spoiler: it does).
While karma is a great system to keep PvE-ers from getting killed by higher level players for fun, it also restricts people who grind spots from defending these spots.
There were quite a few ways discussed before to actually change this.
One of them being, to just make the primary grinding zones free for all- basically making killing people without loosing karma a thing in these specific areas. This in itself sounds right, but again, if you try to see all perspectives this idea looses attratcivity fast.
For one: Newer players, who have to go past this area. If there is gear or EXP only earnable in THIS SPECIFIC region that has overprotective grinders in them... well you pretty much loose by default.
On another note, again, there are people who force themselves into grinding spots by simply "stealing" mobs. I should mention that no-one really "owns" mobs but i also get why someone would get angry if grind effiecency goes down because of people elbowing their way in. You can't really do much about these people, except killing them... or you know- talking to them but...let's be honest. No one does it and people don't listen.

So yeah. I get the whole discussion.
The main problem, simply put, is: A system, that was meant to disencourage PK griefers, namely players who kill others for fun since "it's an open world PvP git gud carebear scrub", is now used to pressure someone out of his grinding spot.

But what are the solutions?
Well, for starters: I was actually quite surprised when i bought this game and only later found out, that there is open-world PvP later on. I must say, i dispise PvP but that's really just my problem. And besides, i can just keep below level 50. I'll miss out on some content though and that's another problem.
I can also see why a lot of people aren't happy with PvP. In any case-

Why don't we have PvE servers?
Karmabombing in itself would not exist. Being killed for no reason, either, which is honestly what i, personally, am scared about.
The only problem will be, that some classes are just better for grinding quickly and taking muh spots.
However: Other games have succesfully implemented PvE servers with active grinding spots. And no-one is really complaining there. Soooo... why don't we have PvP AND PvE servers?

Another solution, which is quite horrible to implement, would be to instance grinding zones.
Basically what happens when you enter your residence. You host your own little world, to do whatever you want, with no-one interacting with you directly, except for the chat.

So yeah- leave your thoughts below.
Also try to not bring in these buzzwords like "carebear", just to discourage other people from actually discussing with you, if you don't have anything else besides your elitism to bring to this discussion.
We are trying to find a solution here, not proove who is better at PvP or killing undergeared players.

[Nothson]

I will say this, nothing, and I mean nothing, make you kill someone in this game. You make the choice to do so. Stop trying to shift blame from your choice. Instead you could invite them to your group, or out farm them. Nope you choose to kill them. It was you choice, not theirs.

[Shinigami]

The Korean version has apparently already went through the -120,000 karma patch when you PK, and it looks like they're doing fine in terms of still being able to have competition & growth. I'm sure this patch will discourage people from automatically trying to PK those who intrude on their area, but everything will most likely stay the same. People will still PK, karma bombing will still occur, etc. I know personally I ask people to group with them in grind spots before I intrude on their rotation, but that's just what I do personally. Not all players play the same way or have the same standards, and that's what makes an MMO so intriguing and exciting. You never know what type of player you'll run into.

In regards to my final thoughts, I belive the patch will bring forth more tactical ways of thinking about open world PvP in BDO. You'll have to keep in mind how much you PK, and the consequences of doing so. In my opinion, it'll definitely make the open world PvP of BDO a lot more strategic, and in-depth.

[Nothson]

Originally posted by Heliosk:

The Korean version has apparently already went through the -120,000 karma patch when you PK, and it looks like they're doing fine in terms of still being able to have competition & growth. I'm sure this patch will discourage people from automatically trying to PK those who intrude on their area, but everything will most likely stay the same. People will still PK, karma bombing will still occur, etc. I know personally I ask people to group with them in grind spots before I intrude on their rotation, but that's just what I do personally. Not all players play the same way or have the same standards, and that's what makes an MMO so intriguing and exciting. You never know what type of player you'll run into.

In regards to my final thoughts, I belive the patch will bring forth more tactical ways of thinking about open world PvP in BDO. You'll have to keep in mind how much you PK, and the consequences of doing so. In my opinion, it'll definitely make the open world PvP of BDO a lot more strategic, and in-depth.

KR has always had that karma penalty.

PA has gradually been making this version the exact same as the KR version despite early claims of the west version having meaningful differences.

[AlnilamE]

If you listen to the PvPers on the forums, we effectively got PvE servers today.

Originally posted by Phillip J. Fry:

Originally posted by Heliosk:

The Korean version has apparently already went through the -120,000 karma patch when you PK, and it looks like they're doing fine in terms of still being able to have competition & growth. I'm sure this patch will discourage people from automatically trying to PK those who intrude on their area, but everything will most likely stay the same. People will still PK, karma bombing will still occur, etc. I know personally I ask people to group with them in grind spots before I intrude on their rotation, but that's just what I do personally. Not all players play the same way or have the same standards, and that's what makes an MMO so intriguing and exciting. You never know what type of player you'll run into.

In regards to my final thoughts, I belive the patch will bring forth more tactical ways of thinking about open world PvP in BDO. You'll have to keep in mind how much you PK, and the consequences of doing so. In my opinion, it'll definitely make the open world PvP of BDO a lot more strategic, and in-depth.

KR has always had that karma penalty.

PA has gradually been making this version the exact same as the KR version despite early claims of the west version having meaningful differences.

Yeah, pretty much.

[Jeanne]

The salt from you pk greifers is absolutely ECSTATIC!!!!!!

[Pudding]

you all need to be enlighten, it is sucks for both side lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhinxWts3qs