Install Steam
login
|
language
简体中文 (Simplified Chinese)
繁體中文 (Traditional Chinese)
日本語 (Japanese)
한국어 (Korean)
ไทย (Thai)
Български (Bulgarian)
Čeština (Czech)
Dansk (Danish)
Deutsch (German)
Español - España (Spanish - Spain)
Español - Latinoamérica (Spanish - Latin America)
Ελληνικά (Greek)
Français (French)
Italiano (Italian)
Bahasa Indonesia (Indonesian)
Magyar (Hungarian)
Nederlands (Dutch)
Norsk (Norwegian)
Polski (Polish)
Português (Portuguese - Portugal)
Português - Brasil (Portuguese - Brazil)
Română (Romanian)
Русский (Russian)
Suomi (Finnish)
Svenska (Swedish)
Türkçe (Turkish)
Tiếng Việt (Vietnamese)
Українська (Ukrainian)
Report a translation problem
Discussions Rules and Guidelines
4 
Report this post
As for guilt... I get what you mean, but honestly the most guilty part for me came to be betraying him with a kiss, seeing him locked up in the torture device, silent and curled up behind his wings because he's either used to torture or doesn't want to show weakness. And then being very unimpressed with brainwashed kid!Raze raving about the demon messiah and being not all that overtly grateful to me for the rescue. The regret I felt then... even as it was cute to watch Ari and Bright try to plan how they would look out for the kid. I think what gets to me is that to do it you have to kiss him and get him to drop his guard, for maybe the first time in his life...
I know there was talk in the previous Raze thread if he loved Bright or not, and while he never says the words this chapter does make his feelings more clear. He's visibly sad if he catches you trying to paralyze him for eternal torture, will throw Ari into the fire if you say you love her and then says something along the lines of "Now you're free to love another," admits his misbehavior was out of fear of being hated by Bright or replaced by her... and I think in the end, letting Bright go back to the human world, or even break their alliance, is about as close to an act of selfless love as he's come. Bright doesn't even have to ask for him to offer it.
When it comes to the sequel, I'm kind of curious about what Raze's part in it will be because you can leave him in so many different places at the end of the game. There's the mentioned torture chamber, and if he's freed next game he could be a powerful enemy for Bright. Then there's breaking the alliance if you don't betray him, but do tell him you're only being nice to him because you realize that's the only way out. He asks if you want to keep the amulet, and you can tell him no and he'll willingly remove it. He's not happy about it, and can't quite bring himself to wish you well in your new life, but explicitly says he never expects to see you again. Then there's staying allies and returning to the human world, or choosing him and staying in Inferno.
Also, I really love the character detail of the statue of a demonspawn and a presumed demonheart in his living space, because it hints that he's been a bit obsessed by the idea of what it represents (friendship, love, trust, an unquestioned ally) for a while now.
And credit to Rolling Crown for blindsiding me with the revelation that He killed Orchid early. I'd jumped onto the "Imposter Raze" theory after reading it, but I don't think any of us predicted that part.
... this became a long post, because I love this demon man so. Despite the many reasons I know I should not.
I think one of my last save files is named something like 'Aaaaaaa' because I knew either way it was going to be a tough decision for me, playing the goodie-goodie. I am fairly sure there's no way to save both the kid!Raze and the adult!Raze, so either pathway felt kind of bittersweet to me. Rescuing kid!Raze killed me because of the sheer betrayal you had to pull, I think, to get to it- no matter what awful things he'd done, it's basically sending adult!Raze back to his awful beginnings and I -really- didn't feel any sympathy towards the skeletal witches or anything. I'm willing to give kid!Raze the benefit of the doubt to some of his end-of-the-world talk because it's not like he's been in the greatest life situation to say the least... he seemed to calm down a bit after he's had some time to rest. It kinda felt like if I was going to give adult!Raze some slack because his backstory was awful, I should give the kiddo the same grace... but it was painful.
...I did not have Ari with me because adult!Raze killed her 'cuz she tried to kill me- so I was great at driving people away!
Leaving child!Raze to the torture device didn't sit quite right with my goodie-goodie Bright either, mind... not because of Orchid because heaven knows I didn't trust Orchid anymore by the end of things if I ever did- just because she didn't think any kid deserved that. But, weighing that between switching adult!Raze into the trap- well, she made her 'canon' choice for me and stayed with adult!Raze. I was really satisfying to finally have his backstory out in the open and he seemed... bizarrely very sweet and soft to Bright after she made the choice to throw away the dagger and kiss him? I'm team 'he really cares about her,' but I -am- kind of a sap. And being a sap, well... adult!Raze's backstory kinda makes me forgive him for some of the bad crud he put Bright through. Like he's no saint (clearly), but the backstory makes it all make sense to me. If that makes sense to anyone. Not being able to trust anyone, desperately craving a positive connection- I just really felt bad for him.
Yeah, I warmed up to real!Raze after he cooled down a bit and started acting a bit more like I'm the adult in the situation, and I understand why he's acting as he is just as I understand why adult!Raze is acting as he is. But I can't deny the imposter had a point about his sanity and how that might affect his loyalty and actions... guess we'll have to wait for that sequel.
I'm still not happy with leaving the kid though - I felt incredibly guilty the first time playing it, when I choose adult!Raze and listened to the kid's screams. Wasn't until the second playthrough of betraying Raze with a kiss and I met the kid and he acted like a cultist that I held back a 'darn you for being right, Raze.' I'm not even convinced adult!Raze is all that happy about keeping the kid there... I don't think he's sorry persay, but he does say he's "bound to hear his screams for the rest of eternity" and he and Bright just... avoid that room if she chooses to stay with him.
I can at least say I didn't betray him for the skele-witches. They tortured a young child and aren't sorry or have adult!Raze's formative backstory... so yeah, no sympathy from me.
And no, I do get loving that moment when you choose not to betray him and he uncertainly asks if you're still allies... especially if you chose the dialogue option that has him then confess he was basically scared of Bright hating and abandoning him. He's so angry and upset all this chapter until that moment, and then we see what's driving that...
And back to Raze- I imagine if the Razes have things to do with the sequel, either way you're kind of screwed over. real!Raze has nothing to temper the whole 'bring about the end of the world' thing even if it's possible if you just leave him in the trap. Leaving imposter!Raze in the trap is probably enough to shatter any feelings he had for Bright and leaves him as a potential threat even if there's a way to turn real!Raze away from his darker thoughts.
It's not bad writing or anything, but realistically I think there's no firmly-good resolution to the situation for the two Razes. If I'm charitable, imposter!Raze doesn't even know -how- to get real!Raze out of the trap... but I'm not -entirely- sure he'd let him go even if he knew. Part of his unease seems to be with how Bright takes the situation, I think- given how he'll lie and try to convince her that real!Raze isn't even sentient anymore, which he'll admit is a blatant lie if you pick at it.
Yeah, no sympathy really for the skele-witches whatsoever. I kind of blame them a lot for this whole situation.
I really am very fond of imposter!Raze- he even seemed sort of open in the ending where my good!Bright stayed with him about learning about -why- she does nice things for people without expecting a reward and whatnot. Maybe I'm overly-optimistic, but it seemed that once I didn't betray him he seemed more willing to consider Bright an equal. I do like that with Raze's backstory revealed, well- his kind of out-of-the-blue meltdown to even a Bright that's been nothing but on his side makes perfect sense in hindsight.
I think part of the choice and the effects of guilt comes down to the fact that we spend more time getting to know the imposter than we do the real Raze, so logically we're more attached to the imposter. Yes, there's plenty of lies to that bond as it develops, but there's truths slipped in there as well. Plus, I find Raze pretty funny and that wins me over like nothing else does.
And yeah, I'm pretty sure the choice is ultimately just me deciding which Raze is going to be my enemy in the sequel. And the situation is so messed up that either way, I have it coming.
Aside from the lie of kid!Raze not being aware, which I quickly called him out on, he also tells Bright if you ask about freeing Raze before adult!Raze takes her back that he doesn't want an immortal enemy after him. His immediate "I AM Raze" when she asks for that is also not the best indicator of a good mental state.
And I loved that adult!Raze wanted good!Bright to explain the why of her actions to him... he does care for her regardless of alignment afterall.
At best, the skele-witches have me going "Wow, that's cruel. Can anyone really deserve this?" on basic principles. Then I remember the horn goblets that they cut off a likely very young demonspawn and go, "They could suffer for five, ten more years and I'd be fine with it."
And no, it's very good writing that no matter the outcome, I am emotionally destroyed. Well done Rolling Crown. *claps hands in a circle for a round of applause*
Back to Big Red and Broody though, At first, being the naive person that I am, I sent the skeletons away and tried to talk to adult!Raze making my official run the one where I break my promise to Orchid. Leaving the child in eternal torture hurt my feelings cause...he was my baby (or I considered him as such). But then when I played the kid!Raze path....Something just didn't sit right with letting the kid loose. The Apocalypse talk, his mannerisms, I dunno, I felt that, even though it was the right thing to do , as it was our duty, freeing kid!Raze would bite me more in the behind than saving him, and I don't mean my death at the hands of Adult!Raze. Still, it hurt knowing he was in pain.
I'm not even gonna touch on the curled up and trapped Adult!Raze, that instantly broke my heart and upped my spite for the little guy. I have a few choice words for the skeleton witches, and none of them are pretty!
Glad to see though I'm not the only one who though with their (demon)heart instead of their head in this situation (cause I spend an awful lot of time analyzing this decision afterwards)
!!! Even Ari , our biggest shipper out there apparently, gasped at his "I never thought anyone could love me" admision! But he remains my overgrown baby, the term "meltdown" just cemented that fact!
Also....I can't believe he threw Mr. Edgardo at Bright!!! So rude!! Haha
As for the reveal... let me just say, there is somewhat immensely satisfying about seeing one's fan theory proven correct (a fan theory that dates back to 2013, no less). ;)
What's got me thinking is Raze's order that the skele-witches speak to him now only in Bright's language...
This part made me assume that he gave that order so Bright could communicate with them once she arrived to Inferno.
Narratively speaking, yeah, it's a way for Bright to understand them. But that doesn't make sense to me as Raze's motive.
So there's some other explanation... I like to think he just didn't want to slip up around Bright by speaking another language, so he just started sticking to talking in her language even when he wasn't talking to her.
At the end of chapter 4 Raze said: "I thiink i owe you a little clarification before wie take our relationship to the next level." Bright: "Are we going married?" And Raze answered "much better".
So I really hope he finds a way to live forever with Bright.
Umm, I think he did want Bright to come to Inferno, but he wanted her to come in his terms, once the heart was secured, the child properly hid, etc etc. With the skeletons just to add to "look how nice I am to you Bright, I make sure everyone here speaks your language, I am magnanimous, I know".
He could have wanted her to come there much later... I won't eliminate it as a possibility.