Ranged Sneak Attack not working?

[NatureMage]

I've been able to make sneak attack work in melee, but when it comes to ranged I can't get it to trigger. I'll have the enemy flanked and my rogue within 3 squares of the fight but it still won't happen.

Do I need to be using a specific weapon? Or do ranged sneak attacks just not work?

[Low Magic Studios]

Must no cover for the target. So it's somewhat harder to trigger ranged sneak attacks.

[MrJane]

My rogue uses two-weapon fighting... I'll roll up a Cross bow rogue and see if I can get it to work. Or are you using a bow?

[MrJane]

Hmm. It seems really hard to activate. I haven't manged it in four battles. If I'm flanking a target with a melee rogue, I do Sneak Attack. Maybe if my allies are flanking, a ranged rogue should also get Sneak Attack? Right now, I don't see any reason for rogue to do anything other than go melee. Ranged is just too finnicky and they're lackluster without it.

[NatureMage]

Yeah I haven't been able to get it to activate yet. Using a bow (elf), but that shouldn't matter.

In tabletop you could get sneak attack if the enemy was flanked (not necessarily by you), or blinded, or flat footed, or just caught unaware. Flanking doesn't work for ranged and there doesn't seem to be any way of inflicting blind/flat footed

[Low Magic Studios]

> I'll have the enemy flanked and my rogue within 3 squares of the fight but it still won't happen.

> Maybe if my allies are flanking, a ranged rogue should also get Sneak Attack?...

>In tabletop you could get sneak attack if the enemy was flanked (not necessarily by you), or blinded, or flat footed, or just caught unaware. Flanking doesn't work for ranged and there doesn't seem to be any way of inflicting blind/flat footed

We made the Sneak Attack in strict accordance with the original dnd 3r rule:
When you flank a target or the target lost his Dex bonus to AC...

So an enemy who flanked by your allies is not an eligible sneak attack target, including ranged sneak attacks.

An asleep or stunned foe is an eligible ranged sneak attack target.

[Aarazak]

ranged the only way to trigger sneak attack is by loss of Dex alone (prone, immobile, etc). Positioning doesn't matter for ranged sneak (ie you can't ranged-flank). For melee sneak you only have to flank (although loss of dex still allows sneak for melee). Although I haven't tested point-blank ranged flank...

[charles leshrac]

There's a lot of erroneous info here.

First off, as Dev says, it's following 3E rules for Sneak Attack.

That means the following do not qualify for ranged Sneak Attack:

"f the enemy was flanked (not necessarily by you)" - this is incorrect. You need to be flanking the target to get sneak attack. In 4E, the enemy just needs to grant you Combat Advantage. In 5E, the enemy being flanked but not necessarily by you is true.

Prone does not deny Dexterity bonus, and instead gives melee attackers a +4 bonus to hit, and a -4 penalty to ranged attacks.

Immobile (speed zero?) does not deny Dexterity bonus either.

Statuses that deny Dexterity bonus includes: Blind, Flat-Footed, Grappled (against non-Grappling target), Stunned, Helpless/Unconscious.

See http://www.d20srd.org/srd/conditionSummary.htm for a list of conditions.

[NatureMage]

@Charles Leshrac -

Those are clearly the 3E rules, but it's worth pointing out that this game is NOT strictly 3E. The major/minor action thing is very 4E & 5E. The Knock Down feat(s) are an interpretation of a similar feat in 3E, though it uses trip rules which don't exist in this game. The Vital Strike series is from Pathfinder, not 3E. The Cleave feats function like they do in Pathfinder, not like their 3E counterparts. Clerics have feat progression unlike any of the tabletop games (though very similar to a Paizo cleric variant from 3.0, but that's 3rd party).

My point being that this game is drawing inspiration from many different DnD/Variant sources and it's not very well documented. It seems to be simplifying and streamlining certain processes to make a better game.

As it currently stands it doesn't look like a ranged rogue is viable at all. The game doesn't provide the player any access to blind/flat-footed/grapple. There's no stealth mechanic yet, so really the only things you can do to set up a ranged sneak attack are to proc a stunning critical or (potentially) use the sleep spell.

[charles leshrac]

I agree it needs better documentation (I have other issues including the porting of 4e player/monster progression for example), since it's a mix of rules, but your original comment had made assumptions (such as flanking counting for ranged sneak attack).

[MrJane]

I'm with NatureMage. I understand that the Devs took the 3e rule for this, mostly, but it leaves a ranged rogue feeling very underpowered. I made a comment somewhere else that I felt Archers overall were very lackluster overall. I'd hoped that ranged rogues would at least be viable, but when their sneak attack is so hard to activate, it makes them useless.

I think the rules need to be altered closer to 4e or 5e as they make Combat Advantage easier to obtain. And then rogues should instead get Sneak Attack on any creature granting CA.

In my opinion, anyways.

[charles leshrac]

For the record, my Archer in the game is doing a lot of DPS.

It's not a Rogue though and a Fighter, relying more on the ranged Power Attack (forgot the name right now) and Composite abilities.

[MrJane]

I forgot about the ranged Power Attack! Guess I know what I'm adding for my next feat...