Raiden V: Director's Cut

Raiden V: Director's Cut

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Why do these Devs think 1080p and 60FPS is next-gen
This game should support 4k and have no FPS limit.

At least this game isn't locked to 480p like Raiden III is (and not caring to fix it in a patch)

When Raiden VI is made is that only going to be 1080p@60fps too?
Last edited by Lone Wolfe (Hoover1979); May 16, 2018 @ 4:16am
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Showing 16-30 of 32 comments
Rygar Mar 7, 2018 @ 7:36am 
Originally posted by Anim8.r:
Originally posted by tenlinkedparts:
I have no idea why there is always a demand 4K and "no FPS limit"

1080p on a 1080p screen looks sharp.

The problem is 1080p on a 4k screen looks blurry not just due to the resolution but because it forces use of bilinear upscaling making it a blurry mess. Only way to get around it is play in a window but then you end up with a tiny play area.

As this is PC there is no good reason to not offer resolution options. While 1080p is the most used, with Steam Stats showing 57%, but that also means 43% don't use 1080p, which is huge number of people.

This is actually wrong, 1080p on a 4k monitor should scale perfectly because the resolution is exactly 4x 1080p, so I pixel now becomes 4 whole pixels and still looks sharp. You will find information about this all over the internet with people reporting 1080p looks very clear on a 4k.

The blurry mess you were referring to is found mostly on TV that will (depending on the tv) sometimes add a garbage filter in an attemp to make the image look better but actually doing the opposite. But not all TVs do this or at least allow you to turn that kind of crap off. Better brands (Sony and Samsung among others) will generally have these options.

As far as I know you shouldnt have these kinds of blurry filter problems on a proper computer monitor though and a 1080p image at 4k should look even better than on most TVs without any issues.
Last edited by Rygar; Mar 7, 2018 @ 7:47am
Anim8.r Mar 7, 2018 @ 11:11pm 
Originally posted by Rygar:
Originally posted by Anim8.r:

1080p on a 1080p screen looks sharp.

The problem is 1080p on a 4k screen looks blurry not just due to the resolution but because it forces use of bilinear upscaling making it a blurry mess. Only way to get around it is play in a window but then you end up with a tiny play area.

As this is PC there is no good reason to not offer resolution options. While 1080p is the most used, with Steam Stats showing 57%, but that also means 43% don't use 1080p, which is huge number of people.

This is actually wrong, 1080p on a 4k monitor should scale perfectly because the resolution is exactly 4x 1080p, so I pixel now becomes 4 whole pixels and still looks sharp. You will find information about this all over the internet with people reporting 1080p looks very clear on a 4k.

It should scale pixel perfect but it doesn't.

Your assuming 4k monitors use integer scaling which would scale pixel perfect but they don't.
As far as I'm aware only some Panasonic TVs can scale that way. I don't know of any computer monitors which have integer/nearest scaling.

People have been asking Nvidia and AMD for this scaling option for years.
For example see:
https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/844905/geforce-drivers/-feature-request-nonblurry-upscaling-at-integer-ratios/1/
Last edited by Anim8.r; Mar 7, 2018 @ 11:26pm
Daikatan Mar 10, 2018 @ 10:38am 
This is complex debate. I'm not a fan of technological racing, i only switched to 1080p about 2 years ago, and still consider that smaller resolutions are good enough for many things.

Raiden III should easily be forced to higher resolution because its 3d game anyway, and not 2d game where assets themselves are fixed rasters, "It was made for low res" argument is true though, but to each preference. Surely Quake 1 looks more organic in 240p than in 4k, but some will enjoy it in latter.

What bothers me more about Raiden III though, is how in fullscreen aspect ratio is wrong so i play in window at large size.

As for blur stuff etc, i also hate how all your images from the past that like 300 pixels etc look on 4k - supersmall or in awful blur when scaled. I mean photos, drawings, etc. Imo u have to own several displays unless u wanna trash ur past.
Last edited by Daikatan; Mar 10, 2018 @ 10:41am
The problem with that is people also "enjoy" doing things like playing games in totally wrong aspect ratios, and putting terrible filters on older games to make them look "higher res". So no, you should care very little about what people "enjoy".
Daikatan May 16, 2018 @ 12:03pm 
Oh, those "widescreen" Capcom CPS pictures...
Mimosa May 20, 2018 @ 10:30am 
I don't care for the frame rate but being able to have higher resolution for polygon based shmups helps a great deal. You get a lot more clarity of your surrounding due to less aliasing. 4K downsampling is a thing and is useable by people who don't have 4K monitors. It's a form of eliminating aliasing and works great. Shmups like this are NOT demanding at all so people with weaker systems could probably push 1440p and still have the game run smoothly while benefiting from a clearer picture. Games like Raiden III-V just look so grainy which is fine for sprite work but doesn't do 3D models any justice. Bullet Soul is another game that would benefit greatly from this.

If you're looking for some shmups that do support 4K, you've got Ikaruga and Eschatos. Anyone with a semi current GPU can activate downsampling and use resolution higher than what they're monitor is capable of.

Here's Ikaruga at it's original settings compared to all the extra the port on PC can do.

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/114029

It's not super drastic, but it does help the eyes out tremendously. And that's for people just playing at 1080p. While the textures are still low res, you can enjoy the intricacies of the 3D models better for the backgrounds and ships. While I do enjoy gameplay, I also enjoy being able to better see how awesome some of these designs were from back in the day without being muddled by limitations of the past.
Last edited by Mimosa; May 20, 2018 @ 10:33am
Dingo Sep 29, 2018 @ 3:57am 
No Tate is the one real disappointment I have with the game. I can appreciate the effort of them trying to weave the the story into the campaign, but it really would have been a great feature to put this game over the top into truly elite territory. As far as graohics I don't know what the complaints with the presentation other than the lack of display options are about.

I don't know what peoplle want this game to look like. If It was photorealistic ut would look strange, especially if you retained any type of colored enemy projectile. That in turn would result into not being able to see anything, in a game genre where losing sight of things is a constant concern.

I was down on the title a bit myself when it first released as it wasn't really thrilling me and I hadn't purchased the III and IV editions any more than a couple months earlier. So I initially went back to those titles for and extended time, but always on and off. When I picked back up Raiden V (after spending what seemed like an eternity to get a single credit clear on RefRain: Prism Memories which was pretty tought.

In my oppinion RDV is much tougher likely, I have been playing a bunch as the excitement of Normal difficult (easy slows bullet speeds down a good bit) with its super fast at times bullets whizzing by you narrowly or you just dodge in time, combined with the ocmbat which is bolstered by the flash shot/kill system started in IV and better refined here, I'm really liking it, and with 3 ships that I can guarantee you allmake a big difference on your play as well as 9 genuinely unique weapons. Not to mention the boatload of boss missions available to play and unlock as well.

Oh and the multiple paths through each level from 3 onward (there are 8 total if I'm not mistaken). As well as chasing the challenge of facing the true final boss, which requires not continuing in conjunction to getting each weapon to lvl 10. Also S rank branches throughout the game are necessary if i'm not mistaken

That is already plenty of content for STGs, let alone with the sharp gameplay legacy still intact thankfully. Yet feels modern thanks to the lightning fast camera work and speeds of the player and enemy/enemy bullets.
Dingo Oct 2, 2018 @ 10:08pm 
While I don't think you could see a dramatic change, particularly in a game like this. I mean, even at 60 I feel like i'm moving one hundred miles an hour.

In regards to the larger topic as a whole. It depends on the type of game, or just the quality of the graphics at X resolution in my oppinion. I have an Asus ROG laptop with 16 ggb ddr 4 and a GTX 10 series at 4 gb ddr5 so I can run 95% of games even now at 1080/60 on ultra or very high settings (whatever said game decides to call it). My monitor is 1080 cap (though I do always forget that I could technically hook up to a monitor of higher resolutions if I wanted to get higher resolutions in certain games), but I guess that almost somewhat makes my "argument" if you will for 1080 in MOST cases (of 1440p probably should be offered at least by now I suppose). I don't even think about the prospect of seeing them in higher fidelity as they look perfect to me on the great asus display at the current resolution.

I understand that doesn't mean there would not mean there wouldn't be an even greater improvement going up, that goes with out saying if you can retain the performance and detal at the same setting.

I guess I think of my friend who bought a PS4 pro and a 4k television. While games like Horizon and GTA look amazing (of course uncharted does but that is just naughty dog's magic, to make a game that even on regular ps4 looks better than almost 90 percent of pc games) even though I'm actually not into either of those series gameplay (gta v and UC, I think Horizon looks pretty interesting and was gorgeous) really. Sorry for the extremely roundabout text, but games that we have on both platforms thanks to the Ultra settings and other bells and whistles they put into pc versions, I feel look better on my pc at 1080/60 as opposed to his at 4k.

That all does kind of relie directly on comparing to inferior hardware which kind of makes my point moot haha. Oh well, I guess I just think 1080 60 with everything cranked is still a thing of beauty, but I get people with the ability to do so having a desire to.

Either way I think RDV kicks ass, and was cold to it at first thinking i was missing RDIV OK, but once I got into it and realized that if your trying to one cc for example the shield actually makes the game harder as opposed to easier. Plus the cool weapon systems. I dig it.
Khronikos Nov 17, 2018 @ 3:38pm 
Originally posted by tenlinkedparts:
I have no idea why there is always a demand 4K and "no FPS limit" when very few people get any benefit from 4K or unlimited FPS. Oh wait, it's those very few people that keep demanding it.

Raiden III has nothing to "fix". The game itself is 480p and there's nothing worth doing about it.

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. This game has horrible image quality and nothing fixes it. Game is not compatible with SMAA injection, and FXAA barely does anything either.

Even 4K resolution custom setting with Nvidia does nothing. Locked to 1080p. This is amateur hour. I honestly think I am just going to refund. It's ridiculous how incompetent Moss is.

I seem to remember Raiden IV looking much better than this.
Khronikos Nov 17, 2018 @ 3:39pm 
Originally posted by Dingo:
No Tate is the one real disappointment I have with the game. I can appreciate the effort of them trying to weave the the story into the campaign, but it really would have been a great feature to put this game over the top into truly elite territory. As far as graohics I don't know what the complaints with the presentation other than the lack of display options are about.

I don't know what peoplle want this game to look like. If It was photorealistic ut would look strange, especially if you retained any type of colored enemy projectile. That in turn would result into not being able to see anything, in a game genre where losing sight of things is a constant concern.

I was down on the title a bit myself when it first released as it wasn't really thrilling me and I hadn't purchased the III and IV editions any more than a couple months earlier. So I initially went back to those titles for and extended time, but always on and off. When I picked back up Raiden V (after spending what seemed like an eternity to get a single credit clear on RefRain: Prism Memories which was pretty tought.

In my oppinion RDV is much tougher likely, I have been playing a bunch as the excitement of Normal difficult (easy slows bullet speeds down a good bit) with its super fast at times bullets whizzing by you narrowly or you just dodge in time, combined with the ocmbat which is bolstered by the flash shot/kill system started in IV and better refined here, I'm really liking it, and with 3 ships that I can guarantee you allmake a big difference on your play as well as 9 genuinely unique weapons. Not to mention the boatload of boss missions available to play and unlock as well.

Oh and the multiple paths through each level from 3 onward (there are 8 total if I'm not mistaken). As well as chasing the challenge of facing the true final boss, which requires not continuing in conjunction to getting each weapon to lvl 10. Also S rank branches throughout the game are necessary if i'm not mistaken

That is already plenty of content for STGs, let alone with the sharp gameplay legacy still intact thankfully. Yet feels modern thanks to the lightning fast camera work and speeds of the player and enemy/enemy bullets.

Are you blind? Can you not see the terrible image quality in this game? There is aliasing and shimmering everywhere in this ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

While I think the game is fine, the developer here is purely low-budget amateur hour.
Dingo Nov 17, 2018 @ 10:53pm 
I will agree with the shimmering efffect especially if you like a high contrast look. While IV looks eyecatching its just a simpler visual game in certain regards. Looks like a super enhanced verysion of three. V while not mind blowing is certainly a cleaner and sharper looking game overall. I would like a little more "pop" somewhere but its hard to know exactly where even. Perhaps the ships being more intricate, though I think that is worsened by the forced perspective which is again my one major issue with the game. Ok actually two major issues now that I think about it..the game really seems to like integrated graphics. Thankfully I have a 2gb integrated card so the game runs perfectly fine, but there is not reason why it should have crashes or fail to open when trying to run it with the gtx 1050TI with 4GBDDR5 instead. I'd almost forgotten that I switched some time back as I experienced issues.
Daikatan Jan 17, 2019 @ 8:03am 
Originally posted by Midnight:
Nobody complained about graphics in the 8-BIT and 16-BIT years

Shmup releases in those times were "on par" with other genres or even "cutting edge" in regards to presentation/graphics. They only started lagging behind after early 00s (when arcades started dying worldwide AND when game industry shifted even more to "teh story telling experience" way, meaning that arcade-like games get less and less attention).

It's usually not problem of "weak graphics", more like of "but what the hell, people, you can do much more on current hardware, dammit".

Specifically with Raiden V, though, i'd mention again that some people felt discomfort by visual design, and not graphic quality. Like, colour combinations are harsh on their eyes, and also that annoying shining bloom/blur effect which you can't turn off in Raiden V.

Which, i guess, was more important than crying about "these gfx look like early ps3 game, i m so unhappy". It's 2019 and most "graphically advanced" stgs are Sine Mora (which plays awfully wrong) and Astebreed (did they finally port new modes back to pc?), which is ironic.

and i don't ever see people complaining when Taito use awful, low-budget assets in Dariusburst Chronicle

Lucky you. I see them getting hateful and angry for that. I'm not even sure if it's justified... i mean, DB was originally psp game (and for psp it had good production values, even though i wish backgrounds could have charm and variety of G-Darius), which later was expanded and improved in arcades and ps4/pc/whatever, yeah. What people forgot, there was like 6 people working on actual game in later versions, and as i understood by interviews, most of time they spent balancing missions etc. Anyway, surely if Taito..nah, what i really mean, Square-Enix would have been giving more $ to Taito, it could be different. But oh my, all those budget-keeping publishers fear shmups like fire. Even Yoko Taro cant convince anybody to let him do stg, so he inserts danmaku elements in his anti-rpg games.

awful pre-rendered rubbish

Imho, pre-render is hit or miss in stgs. I never was pixelart purist, and i love 3d gfx in stgs (be it from sega saturn or ps4), so i'm loyal to prerender too. If we talk Cave, i'd say it looked nice enough in Ketsui or Mushi, but looks borderlines awful in Deathsmiles (almost like they made it from plasticine.)

The only thing that annoys me in Raiden V, is the endless chatter and stupid story... I bought a ♥♥♥♥ing SHMUP, not a visual novel.

They thought it could help them boost sales? Probably failure :(
At least, you can switch off voice volume and hide on-screen chat.

What really makes me sad again, it's all those people who say "ah, new shmup.. what, more than 15$? no way i'm getting that" mentality. It's even more hypocrisy when they say smth like "i go back to ikaruga" when they dont even realise that Ika was same 60$ at initial release (and i dont even know how much pcb was). They also seem to underappreciate / misunderstand how it's hard to game-design shmups. Assets are assets, but creating gameplay/mechanics/ruleset/patterns, balancing everything... creating something that people will play for years and years. Huge respect to those who can.
Last edited by Daikatan; Jan 17, 2019 @ 8:09am
Dingo Jan 20, 2019 @ 6:20pm 
It is true every time you play Ikaruga its hard to believe it still looks better than pretty much any 3d engine stg. You could make a case for edeilwess Astebreed I suppose but that is only one of two that come to mind. ROLLING GUNNER was released not too long ago and the visuals are very impressive I think. They have a demo on their website (japanese but translate via edge or google will get you throuh) its quite excellent and the visuals are fantastic. Its only available for PC via physical copy which you have to order from one of two or three places. I thankfully ordered about a week and a half ago so I hope it is not too much longer.
Daikatan Jan 21, 2019 @ 12:12am 
They gonna port Rolling Gunner on Switch soon, or so i heard (no words on Steam release yet)
Dingo Jan 21, 2019 @ 2:51am 
Yeah, I heard the same news. Definitely good to see some form of NA release at least. I'm happy to have grabbed a physical copy of a PC game for a change, but obviously its better for the game if it can release on steam or a similar platform.
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