The ending is not what it seems. Spoiling spoilers.

[KevinKC]

The much discussed ending is not what it seems.
It's not a metatextual joke. It's a normal ending disguised as a metatextual joke.
The characters are not videogame characters the way Chuck says they are.
The ending is even more tragic than it seems. Delores doesn't reset a videogame, she "resets" the city and its inhabitants.

[Bloom]

Originally posted by KevinKC:

The much discussed ending is not what it seems.
It's not a metatextual joke. It's a normal ending disguised as a metatextual joke.
The characters are not videogame characters the way Chuck says they are.
The ending is even more tragic than it seems. Delores doesn't reset the game, she "resets" the city and its inhabitants.

I like the idea it's all a trick and Delores goes insane and kills a bunch of people.

[KevinKC]

There are a lot of elements that go in that direction.

[Bloom]

Originally posted by KevinKC:

There are a lot of elements that go in that direction.

Yeah. I think it's like in the tv show "The prisoner". A fake town. Filled with actors. Just to drive Delores mad.

[KevinKC]

Ah ok. Again, it's true that there are a lot of elements which go in your direction. Any character can be an actor, a robot, or mind-controlled (A few of them seem to be and Chuck has the means to do that). Also the uncle clearly set up puzzles and events in order to make Delores do stuff and believe things, explore specific places etc...

But I need to contradict you on the "just to drive Delores mad." That's the trap of this ending. the word "just." The final twist of the game makes everything that happens before meaningless and artificial. You don't feel like reflecting on the character arcs, on the strange events, on the murders, on the delicious mysteries anymore because everything was artificially built up. It feels like there's nothing to discover. If Delores can't even remember her mother, it shows how much there is no coherence, no logic to be expected from the virtual world of Thimbleweed Park.

What I mean by "the ending is not what you think it is" is that, everything that happens in Thimbleweed Park is meaningful. There is a big manipulation going on like you say, but it's only a part of the plot, the city isn't fake and the characters aren't either. The murders are real. It is relevent to reflect upon them. Ray, Reyes, Ransom and Franklin are not lying about their stories and their goals. And they could very well have been developped in order to incarnate the sole people who could have prevented Delores from becoming mad/believing Chuck's BS. So, a big part of the plot is a manipulation, but there's also a whole lot of other elements around this manipulation. And there's also a reason for this manipulation.

About Delores' mother, I think the reason why the young woman can't remember her is at the center of everything. Chuck knows why she can't remember her mother or even think about her, or even simply think about the fact that it is strange that she has no mother. When he asks Delores about her mother, he knows that he is going to put her in a serious state of confusion and anxiety.
So, I believe there is some horrible truth to be discovered here... like for example Franklin went crazy and killed his wife because she was cheating on him with Chuck (in the special room of the penthouse of the Edmond hotel) and Delores saw everything. So Delores suppressed everything about her mother and grew up to become a very fragile person who lives her life in a virtual world in order not to face reality.
Chuck very cruelly uses her trauma in order to make her destroy herself and the city. Because by using her trauma as a proof that she is in a videogame, he makes her incapable of contradicting him. If she says "But we're not in a videogame !" she has to search why she can't think of her own mother, and horrible images might surface in her memory and destroy her. It's not a coincidence that being a videogame character should mean having no mother. She is either artificially engeneered or naturally. And the truth about her mother being unbearable, she choses the sci-fi scenario.

I don't pretend to understand everything about the plot or to be right about this, but I'm convinced that the "we're in a videogame" twist is a simple manipulation that shouldn't make us overlook the rest of the story.

[Bloom]

Originally posted by KevinKC:

Ah ok. Again, it's true that there are a lot of elements which go in your direction. Any character can be an actor, a robot, or mind-controlled (A few of them seem to be and Chuck has the means to do that). Also the uncle clearly set up puzzles and events in order to make Delores do stuff and believe things, explore specific places etc...

But I need to contradict you on the "just to drive Delores mad." That's the trap of this ending. the word "just." The final twist of the game makes everything that happens before meaningless and artificial. You don't feel like reflecting on the character arcs, on the strange events, on the murders, on the delicious mysteries because everything was artificially built up. It feels like there's nothing to discover. If Delores can't even remember her mother, it shows how much there is no coherence, no logic to be expected from the virtual world of Thimbleweed Park.

What I mean by "the ending is not what you think it is" is that, everything that happens in Thimbleweed Park is meaningful. There is a big manipulation going on like you say, but it's only a part of the plot, the city isn't fake and the characters aren't either. The murders are real. It is relevent to reflect upon them. Ray, Reyes, Ransom and Franklin are not lying about their stories and their goals. And they could very well have been developped in order to incarnate the sole people who could have prevented Delores from becoming mad/believing Chuck's BS. So, a big part of the plot is a manipulation, but there's also a whole lot of other elements around this manipulation. And there's also a reason for this manipulation.

About Delores' mother, I think the reason why the young woman can't remember her is at the center of everything. Chuck knows why she can't remember her mother or even think about her, or even simply think about the fact that it is strange that she has no mother. When he asks Delores about her mother, he knows that he is going to put her in a serious state of confusion and anxiety.
So, I believe there is some horrible truth to be discovered here... like for example Franklin went crazy and killed his wife because she was cheating on him with Chuck (in the special room of the penthouse of the Edmond hotel) and Delores saw everything. So Delores suppressed everything about her mother and grew up to become a very fragile person who lives her life in a virtual world in order not to face reality.
Chuck very cruelly uses her trauma in order to make her destroy herself and the city. Because by using her trauma as a proof that she is in a videogame, he makes her incapable of contradicting him. If she says "But we're not in a videogame !" she has to search why she can't think of her own mother, and horrible images might surface in her memory and destroy her. It's not a coincidence that being a videogame character should mean having no mother. She is either artificially engeneered or naturally. And the truth about her mother being unbearable, she choses the sci-fi scenario.

I don't pretend to understand everything about the plot or to be right about this, but I'm convinced that the "we're in a videogame" twist is a simple manipulation that shouldn't make us overlook the rest of the story.

The to drive her mad bit probably isn't all there is too it as you say. But I do like to believe it's a fake town. That would explain the sheriff, hotel manager and the coroner are the same person. Chuck is clearly the main villain here in the fact he puts down the puzzles and murders everybody. I feel as though Ray, Reyes and Ransom (Wow all R's) don't play a part in this. I feel like they have been brought here by Chuck for some reason like Delores. I could extend this and say he was trying to drive Franklin mad and this failed so he killed him but that's a stretch. The main question here is "What was the purpose?". Chuck drove Delores, Ray, Reyes and Ransom mad. Was he just trying to get rid of them? Or is there some other reason? Also, Chuck gave Reyes a signed confession saying he burned down the factory. I feel like when Delores "resets" everything she destroys the town. That way, Chuck can gain all there trust by handing over the confession while still being safe because everything gets destroyed later.

[KevinKC]

I also noticed all the Rs, but I can't think of a reason for this.

In his journal Chuck talks about "having an idea to replace the coroner." So, I believe that the coroner, the sheriff and the hotel manager are yes, a part of Chuck's manipulation. But to me, they are clones or robots, or one paid accomplice. It doesn't necessarily point at Thimbleweed Park being entirely fake. I believe in the "ghost town since the factory burnt" scenario. And the people who are left are either accomplices (Sheriff, Coroner, Hotel Manager, Safely First Savings), idiots (Leonard, digging man, Postman), people who have a very specific reason to be here (Morena, Ransom, Natalie, the radio DJ, Safely First Savings) or people whose role is useful to Chuck and are mindcontrolled (Ricky, the postman, Safely First Savings too).

Ransom, Ray, Reyes all come to Thimbleweed Park because Chuck has officially died. Now that he is dead a foreign government sends an agent to steal the AI; the boy who wasn't allowed to come back to the city comes back to prove that his dad was innocent (the Reyes family was paid to disappear). And Ransom dares leave his circus to find his doll. I think that all their motivations are real and that everything is triggered by Chuck's death. However, if Chuck faked his death (heart attack + the coroner of the city is under his command), then you can consider that he did this to reunite these characters in order to eliminate them... through the manipulation of Delores.

Franklin, Willie, Ransom, Reyes, Ray and Delores represent the sole real problematic witnesses to Chuck's madness.

I too am convinced that when she resets the game, Delores is actually destroying the town.
- It's the same pattern as the red button that destroys the Mansion. (Which would then be there only to give the player the idea of a triggered explosion)
- There are paintings of Thimbleweed County everywhere in the city as if Chuck fantasied that the city didn't exist anymore.
- A group of idiots who are terrified of being mind-controlled are given blocks of C4 to walk around with for no reason whatsoever.
- The will stipulates that Thimbleweed Park is to be plowed under in two days. It's in Chuck's will that the town should be destroyed.

You're indirectly told the way it's going to be done, who is going to do it, what explosive will be used and who wants it to be done and why. That's a big amount of information which serve no purpose if Delores simply reset a videogame.

[Bloom]

Originally posted by KevinKC:

I also noticed all the Rs, but I can't think of a reason for this.

In his journal Chuck talks about "having an idea to replace the coroner." So, I believe that the coroner, the sheriff and the hotel manager are yes, a part of Chuck's manipulation. But to me, they are clones or robots, or one paid accomplice. It doesn't necessarily point at Thimbleweed Park being entirely fake. I believe in the "ghost town since the factory burnt" scenario. And the people who are left are either accomplices (Sheriff, Coroner, Hotel Manager), idiots (Leonard, digging man), people who have a very specific reason to be here (Morena, Ransom, Natalie, the radio DJ, safely first savings) or people whose role is useful to Chuck and are mindcontrolled (Ricky, the postman, safely first savings too).

Ransom, Ray, Reyes all come to Thimbleweed Park because Chuck has officially died. Now that he is dead a foreign government sends an agent to steal the AI; the boy who wasn't allowed to come back to the city comes back to prove that his dad was innocent (the Reyes family was paid to disappear). And Ransom dares leave his circus to find his doll. I think that all their motivations are real and that everything is triggered by Chuck's death. However, if Chuck faked his death (heart attack + the coroner of the city is under his command), then you can consider that he did this to reunite these characters in order to eliminate them... through the manipulation of Delores.

Franklin, Willie, Ransom, Reyes, Ray and Delores represent the sole real problematic witnesses to Chuck's madness.

I too am convinced that when she resets the game, Delores is actually destroying the town.
- It's the same pattern as the red button that detroys the Mansion. (Which would then be there only to give the player the idea of a triggered explosion)
- There are paintings of Thimbleweed County everywhere in the city as if Chuck fantasied that the city didn't exist anymore.
- A group of idiots who are terrified of being mind-controlled are given blocks of C4 to walk around with for no reason whatsoever.
- The will stipulates that Thimbleweed Park is to be plowed under in two days.

You're indirectly told the way it's going to be done, who is going to do it, what explosive will be used and who wants it to be done and why. That's a big amount of information which serve no purpose if Delores simply reset a videogame.

You make some very good points. So, now we have to find out why Chuck wants the town destroyed. I believe that the land holds some greater purpose. There could be some kind of mineral under the town. He could just want the land. The only real clue we have is that we know he said he wanted to build a server farm. We assume this is the A.I. making him write this. But if Chuck was in control the whole time it could actually be what he wanted todo.

[KevinKC]

OMG I've just checked what a server farm was ! It's terrifying ! And genius. What a f***ing nightmarish ending.

Chuck is going to create exactly what he pretends to want to destroy at the end of the game.

To me, his desire to control is an extension of an alienated need no be loved. Chuck is desperately lonely. TP's story is also the story of his failure to be loved by Delores. Sure, she believes in his BS but never accept to join him in his madness. She always love Franklin more.
Also, I think Franklin and Chuck loved the same woman but she preferred Franklin or something like that. So, for some reason, Franklin or Chuck murdered Delores' mother (in the penthouse room ? With the chainsaw ?). Chuck remains the eternally unloved. And he destroys Willie's life over a woman too.

Anyway... in his journal, Chuck talks about a "world simulator." To put it simply, he is creating The Matrix. At the end of the game, he sends Delores in his "test version." So we have a proof that he can send Delores in a virtual version of Thimbleweed Park.

The thing is, the optional endings of Ransom, Ray, Reyes and Franklin already take place in a virtual simulation of TP. The virtual TP starts when Delores enters the final room of the factory.
That's why the endings are so rushed, weird and suspiciously underwhelming. Reyes wants to clean his father's reputation with an article in the local newspaper ? Before the end of the world ? Ray was looking for a revolutionary AI and gets a puzzle dependancy chart ? Ransom wanted a doll, he gets to say sorry in a flashback ?

All these endings are written by Chuck and they are optional because he doesn't give a s**t. And that's also why the town buildings are closed and Morena and Leonard are absent. Delores is in an unfinished version of the simulation. (Not enough servers maybe...)

I thought so when I started this thread. But I couldn't explain myself the reboot at the end of the credits.

Now I can. Thimbleweed Park has been destroyed and is now a server farm owned by Chuck and which is used to create a virtual simulation of Thimbleweed Park. So when you restart the game, the metatextual ending becomes real. They have become videogame characters. And Delores triggered exactly what she wanted to put an end to.