Fantastic Ending (spoilers obviously)

[moekou]

I thought this was a fantastic ending for the series and did not just regurgitate the usual pattern of shouting optimistic words to win. While the SDR2 ending will likely remain my favorite due to pure emotional values as I loved Chiaki, I couldn't refute the critique some had that it was rather plot-armoresque with things just working out somehow, even though they established Hajime would disappear. And let's not get started on what happened in the DR3 anime at the end...

As advertised, this was not set in the same world as the previous games, though it made clever use of its lore to fake the audience out in Chapter 5 to make them think it'll be about Hope's Peak and Junko yet again. In terms of moral dilemma it probably made me question my views the most, with the fictional characters essentially being summoned into the world like oracles summoning gods, as Tsumugi put it. They may have originally been fictional, but their emotions and growth from their experiences are very much geniuine, and I cheer for the survivors to live on. It was very inspirational and made me value the power of fiction more. SDR2 affecting me so strongly is what made me fall in love with the series, after all.

In what ways has fiction affected your life?

Also, how do you feel about the concept in real life should technology ever allow you to completely change a person and turn them into someone else? Persona 5 did get into moral question about this kind of thing. If an awful killer/rapist on death row was through technolgy rewritten with the characterization of a kind upstanding person with a new fabricated memory and backstory, would that be morally wrong?

[Inkie]

Originally posted by t_town20:

I mean if you want to confirm that Shuichi and the gang are fictional characters then why not cosplay as one of them?

Well, what if they aren't fictional? Let's be fair, no amount of brainwashing can turn real person in completely fictional one. There's also a dead giveaway with standart phrase: "Any resemblance to real persons is purely coincidental" which obviously isn't the case for DRV3 cast, so by DR's own definition for fictional characters they aren't fictional in their universe.

Anyway, i personally believe entire reason for 4th wall breaking is because their real personalities were leaking into their characters For it is always the case with 4th wall breaking plots. . This goes in line with her comment on Shuichi too. With Kaede that would mean Tsumugi tried to imitate Kaede's personal take on Ultimate Pianist character and not the character itself and so she failed.

[Sepiablitz]

Originally posted by Inkie:

Well, what if they aren't fictional? Let's be fair, no amount of brainwashing can turn real person in completely fictional one.

If you are going to acknowlegde that they are brainwashed into thinking they are Ultimates they think and more importanlty dress as characters *invented* by Team Danganronpa. They are real people, yes. But they dress up as characters that were invented = cosplay.

See it like this: Within the DRV3 universe there are the producers of the DR-series (which went on for 53 seasons). Those wrote a script for season 53 and invented 14 Ultimates (not including K1-B0 and Tsumugi). Then they kidnapped 14 ordinary students and not only brainwashed them into thinking they are those characters but also made them wear cosplay of those characters. In fact these clothes are the only ones made accessible to them. The entire game they are wearing those cosplays.

There are only 2 possibilties that would imply those 14 are not cosplaying:
1. They actually were Ultimates before the prologue and were actually brainwashed twice. Once forgetting their talent, once for rembering them.
2. Somewhere in the universe of DRV3 there are 14 real Ultimates that the kidnapped students are dressed like.

If real people dress like someone who does not exist in reality but only in a fictional context such as a TV-show-script, that is cosplay. No way around it, even if they think they are those characters in real life.

[t_town20]

Originally posted by Sepiablitz:

if dressing up as real people causes her rash, she would have a rash all the time she dresses up as herself.

mmm well I figured she would be an exception to the rule since it would be pretty rough for her to be born in a cosplay costume :p just imagining a baby coming out of the womb in a Junko costume is pretty hilarious to me.

Regardless you do make a compelling argument; I hadn't really thought about where she got the videos of them being all excited about the killing game and I agree that they are probably fabricated. I mean why show us the prologue of them being normal students if it wasn't some clue about who they really were? It's possible but kind of a stretch to think they were brainwashed twice (once to think they were normal students and and again to think they were Ultimates). So anyways I was convinced that they were real due to Tsumugi not being able to cosplay as them but now you got me thinking that she really did lie about cospox and that the reverse is true ie V3=fiction and DR1/2= real

Another thing that may contribute to your theory is the motive they tried to use in Chapter 3. We could brush off the claims that Monokuma was lying and the Necromicon (no idea how to spell it sorry) really couldn't bring a dead classmate back to life but what if it was the truth? I mean he seemed pretty adamant about it being true and well if they were fictional characters then it would be pretty easy in theory. All you would have to do is just upload another copy of that character.

Originally posted by Sepiablitz:

Then they kidnapped 14 ordinary students and not only brainwashed them into thinking they are those characters but also made them wear cosplay of those characters. In fact these clothes are the only ones made accessible to them. The entire game they are wearing those cosplays.

Ah I see your theory is that they were real people forced to cosplay as fictional people. I can see that being true...it does make you kind of wonder how they would assimlate back into society then. I mean assuming they were real at one point in time and assuming in the epilogue they are returning to reality then they would have a pretty real conflict of idenities right? Before they played this killing game they had normal lives and families and friends that essentially got left behind when they were forced into this fictional world. Now that they are re-entering society did they accept their fictional Ultimate identities or try to reclaim the life and identity taken from them; in turn severing all ties they had to the killing game? Haha I know this is a random tangent but it's an interesting idea that popped into my head and would love to hear everyone's thought :)

[khermerker]

Originally posted by t_town20:

oh I meant she was allegic to impersonations...she couldn't transform into Kaede or Kaito or anyone from the V3 cast (without getting cospox) because they were real people while the people from the first two games were fiction. Her cospox could've been a lie too but thought it was interesting she never really f***** their minds by transforming into their dead classmates during the trial. I mean if you want to confirm that Shuichi and the gang are fictional characters then why not cosplay as one of them?

mmm actually that dont add up with the ending... she says "you are fictional" she accept them as ficitional... so the only real part... well is probably the blood they spit the rest is fictional and she accept it like that... unless... well they are not fictional.. and that means they were not so normal before...:P

[Inkie]

Originally posted by Sepiablitz:

If you are going to acknowlegde that they are brainwashed into thinking they are Ultimates they think and more importanlty dress as characters *invented* by Team Danganronpa. They are real people, yes. But they dress up as characters that were invented = cosplay.

Yea and i agree with you on that. My theory is, they failed at that. They aren't ultimate cosplayers, or actors, or whatever else - basically, they were failing to play their characters even with help of brainwashing. Also, that's probably the reason why flashlight dispenser even exist - it's expected of mastermind to adjust the characters and even entire plot to fit the cast.

Considering how really good at cosplay is Tsumugi, the fine line between a character and a real person imitating that character would be obvious for her, triggering cosplox. Maybe that's why she is doing all the legwork on stage too, instead of hiding somewhere - she has to interact with the cast to know how close they are to the character. At least, i'm pretty sure that's why Koichi went completely off the rails - lied so hard he made up his own character and then just went into hiding so it couldn't be "adjusted" easily.

Originally posted by khermerker:

mmm actually that dont add up with the ending... she says "you are fictional" she accept them as ficitional... so the only real part... well is probably the blood they spit the rest is fictional and she accept it like that... unless... well they are not fictional.. and that means they were not so normal before...:P

At this point she more tried to preserve the Danganronpa in it's curent form, than drop some truth bombs, so i wouldn't trust her there. Ironicaly, the best thing she could do to prove their fiction nature - is cosplay them. Kinda dissapointed Shuichi haven't mentioned that.

[Inkie]

Originally posted by Sepiablitz:

Also, if dressing up as real people causes her rash, she would have a rash all the time she dresses up as herself.

We don't actually know how she looks like while not being in character, though. She told in 1st FTE she is very plain when not cosplaying, but her attire is anything but that. Even her underwear is different to what she said.

[t_town20]

Originally posted by Inkie:

At this point she more tried to preserve the Danganronpa in it's curent form, than drop some truth bombs, so i wouldn't trust her there. Ironicaly, the best thing she could do to prove their fiction nature - is cosplay them. Kinda dissapointed Shuichi haven't mentioned that.

Agreed; it's already been proven that not everything she has said was the truth due to how it all contradicts with each other. It would've been easier to know if she had cosplayed as everybody or if Shuichi pointed out how she hadn't cosplayed as anyone from the new class. It at least gives us a hint that either she can't cosplay as the V3 class because they are real people OR she isn't really the Ultimate Cosplayer but the Ultimate Imitator and can only imitate real people. The other big hint is the beginning of the game and how they were just normal students with no Ultimate talents. This scene is never referred to again in-game which means we only saw it because the game developers WANTED us to see it. As has been speculated before that was probably them in their "real/true" forms before they were given these fictional "cosplay" identities.