[SPOILERS] Sue's Arc and Explanations???

[cynthistic]

Oh boy first post on steam and it's gonna be a long one. To start off, I'd really like to thank to creative team for making such a beautiful and emotionally intense story it truly is a masterpiece. But as always, I can't help but be extra and seek answers that most of the time don't even really matter. Maybe the game is just meant to be enjoyed but yea.

Anyways, spoilers ahead so you've been warned twice.

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Most of the game is easily understandable and nothing too hard to grasp. If you wanted to know the characters' illness a simple google search of the medical sheets will suffice. However, after replaying this game 3 times (yes 3 times because it's beautiful), the end parts of the game always confused me and especially Sue's arc.

Her chart indicates that she needs respiratory therapy, hinting breathing problems so I assume she has sever asthma. Hence, why she had to move to Sendai for treatment. Tokyo to Sendai is approx. 304 km so we know she had to move far away. What throws off is how after Uma delivers dream Puchi to dream Sue, we appear back in the cave and upon entering Sue's hospital room, Puchi is seen at the foot of her bed. Sue claims Puchi has been waiting all this time by the tree they used to meet at (nice Hachiko reference earlier). So my question really is, how is Puchi in the hospital? Is Puchi even realistically there? It can't really be simply a symbol that Sue remembers/gains closure cause it occurs in the real world.

Uma is also constantly shown to be this mysterious character drifting in and out of both worlds which he also states in the arc, acknowledging his vice and the slipping in part. He's shown to be on the boat to Rakuen in the end and so I assume he died. Possibly from overdose (slipping between both worlds, subconscious and reality). But I'm confused as to why he fades as Sue becomes opaque in the bridge scene. Why was Sue translucent to begin with. If Uma fading symbolizes his goal is done, fading into afterlife, why is Sue solidified? Or maybe giving Puchi over was transfering love?

The final part of the game that really confused me was Yami as a whole. We understand he's a manifestation of the dark side of the boy through the way he talks to mom later and so on. However, why does he look that way? Is it just a design choice to resemble a crow/raven with ominous colors ro more? Why is he bandaged on his right eye, does that mean anything?

Tbh if none of these get answered I'd still be fine with it. The game as a whole was just absolutely fantastic.

[nopw]

I think most of us under estimate Sue's state. In hindsight a lot of things suggest her condition to be pretty bad. It might not be any singular thing but a combination of ailments.
Memory loss is a symptom as well as plot device.
She appears to be mostly bed bound.
She appears to be low in energy and strength. Even compared to Boy who often seems uncertain or a little afraid even, Sue seems subdued and almost relaxed possibly from medication. For a child who should be full of energy this is definitely odd. Her energy and enthusiasm is shown in short bursts when you return her lost marbles.

I think Uma retrieved Puchi from the tree. Sue has no memories but perhaps with Boy's help there was enough of a hint for Uma to understand.

I can't remember the fading very well. I'll have to replay it but I assume that Uma didn't go in to meet Sue because he couldn't face her after what he has done and perhaps who he has become. Her image of her father is possibly still better than the beggar/thief that he appears to be. It is very likely that Uma knows the severity of Sue's illness as well.

For Yami, I'm not sure on his dress but I assumed if the Boy was grumpy facing and had his hair back they would look similar. Some people do wear bandages for warmth and other reasons when they begin hair loss from treatment.

[Nyerguds]

The respiratory therapy wasn't Sue's, it was Gemma's. It mentions the patient in question being in a coma, and having "anoxic brain injury"; damage from oxygen shortage. Because, you know, Gemma almost drowned. In fact you see the machine used for her therapy at the end of the Winston/Gemma puzzle part.

Puchi was delivered there by Uma. Winston tells you that if you talk to him.

Nothing is ever revealed about what Sue has, as far as I know. And the story never says if Sue dies or just goes home. She's on the boat to Rakuen, as is the Boy's father, but so is Uma, who didn't look like he'd keel over any time soon, and so is the Boy himself, and the end of the game shows he pulled through and went home. So it's perfectly possible she just went home too, but was so touched by his visits (and that sweet little dream moment? I ship it!) that she left him her 'worlds', thinking he'd need them more than she would. The game seems to deliberately keep her fate vague, but it plays into the boy's fears of people leaving him, so I'd rather assume she went home.

As for the fading... well, I suppose that reflected real life; he delivered the dog but didn't feel up to actually being seen by his daughter. For all we know, the fading is something perfectly normal for Forest-side Sue and her father.

[nopw]

Originally posted by Nyerguds:

and so is the Boy himself, and the end of the game shows he pulled through and went home.

Nah, the boy at the end is the younger brother whom grandma came to look after as mentioned in the beginning by Mom. Brother has hair.

[Estragon]

Originally posted by nopw:

Originally posted by Nyerguds:

and so is the Boy himself, and the end of the game shows he pulled through and went home.

Nah, the boy at the end is the younger brother whom grandma came to look after as mentioned in the beginning by Mom. Brother has hair.

I revisited the last part of the story and I think I can see where it ends up possible to get confused about this. In Mom's arc just after the school calls to tell her the Boy fainted in class, the hospital segment shows him with hair. The implied reason for the origami hat is that he's undergone chemotherapy and has lost his hair, as shown at the end scene by the boat where he removes the hat.

So far all I could make of Yami (闇, "darkness"), aside from the literal interpretation that he's the boy's negative emotions, is that maybe the bandage was intended to obscure his face, so the Boy doesn't easily recognize that he's really talking to his own reflection. I'm curious about a more official explanation to this.

It's probably helpful to note that the meaning of Rakuen (楽園) is "paradise", meaning that boat is departing for the afterlife, and those on board aren't returning. There was one detail I noticed from the end scene that I never quite put together until watching it again just now. While most of the passengers are on the main deck, there's one person up in the crow's nest. My first thought was it was someone lost in the tsunami (the cause of the damage throughout the hospital and heavily suggested through the many notes found during the story). I just realized that's Kisaburo, holding a mug of tea. The color tint threw me off.

The young boy in the final scenes after the credits start (in the grandmother's yard, then launching origami boats into the river) definitely seems to be the younger brother.

[cynthistic]

Originally posted by Nyerguds:

The respiratory therapy wasn't Sue's, it was Gemma's. It mentions the patient in question being in a coma, and having "anoxic brain injury"; damage from oxygen shortage. Because, you know, Gemma almost drowned. In fact you see the machine used for her therapy at the end of the Winston/Gemma puzzle part.

I figured that much, kind of weird having one sheet for 2 patients but felt like Sue really needed an explanation. As for the fading part, I can't help but feel like there's something more than just species quirks but there's always this element of uncertainty. Rakuen was most indefinitely the afterlife and that's the only part I'm certain of. Though it would be so nice to think Sue just left but ;.;

It's also really sweet how the Boy spends most of his time with her so they have a stronger bond. Also nice little detail how her projection says "Thank-you, my friend" instead of just simply thank you (so much more shippable).

[cynthistic]

Originally posted by Estragon:

Originally posted by nopw:

So far all I could make of Yami (闇, "darkness"), aside from the literal interpretation that he's the boy's negative emotions, is that maybe the bandage was intended to obscure his face, so the Boy doesn't easily recognize that he's really talking to his own reflection. I'm curious about a more official explanation to this.

Me too, an official explanation would be really nice. Even some concept art would be nice to see how the concept of Yami came to be. Like, why would the boy have an inner uchiha with a very specific right eye bandage. In the end, it's the boy who claims that they are both halves of each other while not being aware in the beginning so the boy definitely learned of his other half. However if the goal was to conceal a face, a mask/facemask would suffice, I feel.

It's also interesting how Yami cries about being left alone in the end. Does that behavior simply reflect the hidden emotions of the boy towards his father leaving their family? Or did he mean it more of a "succumb to passing" by staying asleep? I've constantly had trouble categorizing Yami cause on one hand, it's not hard to associate him with darkness and 'evil', but he really is just the embodiment of the boy's hidden more angsty feelings.

[nopw]

I consider the outburst at the end to be the Boy's emotions and concerns. He is afraid, lonely and he feels a little resentment towards his father but that is also pretty understandable for a child. I took it to be that Uma and Sue's passing was the final straw that breaks his emotional barriers.

The comment about everyone leaving points to many things such as Sue and the others who recently passed away. It also refers to the fact that everyone will pass eventually. Also that Mother will need to leave him and return to work sooner or later.

Yami could also simply be a the Boy's dream. At night before bed in hospital is easily one of the darkest and loneliest times. It is easy for axiety and fears to creep into your mind and fall asleep with such thoughts.

[BrightSoul]

I'm wondering why the boy wished to ride in Morizora's boat to Rakuen. I expected him to fight the illness and wish for his recovery, so he could stay with his mother. Perhaps he realized he wouldn't make it, after all?

[Danilego]

Originally posted by BrightSoul:

I'm wondering why the boy wished to ride in Morizora's boat to Rakuen. I expected him to fight the illness and wish for his recovery, so he could stay with his mother. Perhaps he realized he wouldn't make it, after all?

Sincerely, I was expecting the boy to wish Sue back to reality, or at least say something about that(maybe Morizora wouldn't allow it). I mean, with the dreams it became clear that the boy really cared for Sue, so I expected a twist at the end

[cynthistic]

Originally posted by dan.c.garcia:

Originally posted by BrightSoul:

I'm wondering why the boy wished to ride in Morizora's boat to Rakuen. I expected him to fight the illness and wish for his recovery, so he could stay with his mother. Perhaps he realized he wouldn't make it, after all?

Sincerely, I was expecting the boy to wish Sue back to reality, or at least say something about that(maybe Morizora wouldn't allow it). I mean, with the dreams it became clear that the boy really cared for Sue, so I expected a twist at the end

I actually thought the ending was well made. The story feels more complete with his departure. I felt like the message that passing on when the time is right shouldn't be seen as weakness/giving up is really nice. I felt that Sue's purpose in this game is to establish a friendship that was more significant to the boy than any other characters, hence triggering memories of his dad leaving. He definitely knew he couldn't stay alive anymore (I avoided singing to Yami so many times just to make sure), his departure was aceptable now that he didn't feel that he needed to be there for his mother (guilt and burden free).

[stanek4wsu]

I think judging by how the people in the hospital reacted to Sue, I would have to believe she passed away. Their reactions were far too somber for just being released.

As for the ending, it's been pretty well stated already, but it's a pretty obvious metaphor that Rakuen is the afterlife. My one question about it was why Uma was on the boat. It didn't appear that he had anything in particular that would have made him pass away. I also found his character mysterious because I couldn't figure out why he was such a profound and interactive character in Morizora's forest. That's the one thing I couldn't really grasp from the story.

[Harith]

Originally posted by BrightSoul:

I'm wondering why the boy wished to ride in Morizora's boat to Rakuen. I expected him to fight the illness and wish for his recovery, so he could stay with his mother. Perhaps he realized he wouldn't make it, after all?

Because he can't. Morizora isn't real, Morizora forest isn't real, they are just fairytale from his book "Rakuen". Everything they do in Morizora forest is just imagination or metaphor for things that actually happen in real world.

[Free Wall-E]

Originally posted by stanek4wsu:

My one question about it was why Uma was on the boat. It didn't appear that he had anything in particular that would have made him pass away. I also found his character mysterious because I couldn't figure out why he was such a profound and interactive character in Morizora's forest. That's the one thing I couldn't really grasp from the story.

I believe that Uma was on the boat because, until he could do at least some good for his daughter - bringing her the best friend she's ever had - he just couldn't move on to the afterlife. That could also be why he tried to help so many people. He knew he had to do something but maybe he wasn't aware that it was actually helping his daughter instead of just helping anybody.

[Canard_de_Bain]

Originally posted by Nine-S:

Originally posted by BrightSoul:

I'm wondering why the boy wished to ride in Morizora's boat to Rakuen. I expected him to fight the illness and wish for his recovery, so he could stay with his mother. Perhaps he realized he wouldn't make it, after all?

Because he can't. Morizora isn't real, Morizora forest isn't real, they are just fairytale from his book "Rakuen". Everything they do in Morizora forest is just imagination or metaphor for things that actually happen in real world.

Oh I am pretty sure Morizora was real. Mom had Sue's marbles on her work desk. The subject matter was way too mature for a child to dream. Also the newspaper clippings were probably things he would not have been exposed to because of how his father died.

[204863]

[SPOILERS] Sue left her marbles for Boy on his bedside, so it makes sense that Mom would take them home. I interpret the book as a vehicle for the mom to lead Boy through difficult ideas like why all his hospital neighbors need patience and empathy, and the things that might be making life difficult for them. Each time you complete a story, you're given the last bit of insight that makes it all click for Boy and gives him a little hope. The problem is that Yami is all the feelings that Boy doesn't show Mom- the fear that he's been left behind right as he got sick by his dad, the fear and pain that surrounded him during the tsunami and the uncertainty as place to place flooded, water slowly creeping around the edges of his thoughts. Yami is the darkness that gives Boy doubt and fear, which Mom can't see- though she knows it must be there, like when she tries to get him to laugh during treatment. Up until that point, Boy traverses some of the darkest moments of the stories alone- that's where Yami's influence is. But then he loses Sue without a chance to say goodbye, and that's the moment that Mom finally senses how deep those feelings run- when he gives in to those feelings, that he's unwanted and the world is cruel and he's better off giving up and no longer caring. That's why the final person you have to reach is Boy himself. Mom can't save him from himself, she can only be there and try to convince him to hold onto hope. He has to accept that Yami is part of him, but not the part that he should give control to. Yami's color scheme is pretty apparent- Boy is wrestling with whether he'd be better off dead or not, and Yami in some ways symbolizes giving up hope and embracing death- so the dark colors literally represent darkness, the bandage represents the pain he feels, etc.

The appearance of the characters on the boat at the end is not something I think necessarily indicates death- I think these are the stories he took with him to the very end and relied on for support. They're why he chose to live for as long as he could. That's why he has that final conversation with Yami, tells him they're always going to be together to the end. Mom managed to reach him, but he accepted that he'll always have those feelings and it's ok to acknowledge them. The boat, more importantly the wish itself, is part of him choosing to have hope again.

As for Uma... he reveals his connection to Sue within the story/dream, and so he might not actually be the same character in reality- but he, like Boy, presumably had to fight a lot of dark feelings to get to the point that he might see his daughter again. His crossing between the worlds may represent that to Boy, another character who had to struggle to find hope, and who struggles with whether he's wanted or deserved. We see him fade when he brings Puchi to Sue's bedside because his role in that world is over, and Sue has that anchor in her life again. Uma's accepting that he never could be that support before for her, but Puchi was and that if he can at least return Puchi to her side, she'll be able to find comfort and hope in someone. The feelings he struggled with for so long had to do with not being there for her, and he doesn't want her to have the same feelings about Puchi.

This might all be wrong though, it's just how I'm interpreting it.