[Spoiler] Why Rachel Amber is stupidly dangerous

[Silver]

- unarmed, confronts two grown men (one armed with a broken bottle) just to save Chloe without having the strength to actually take them down or anything
- skips school with Chloe, endangering them both just cause she felt bored (at that point she didnt even know about her real mom to catch a day of fresh air away from arcadia bay)
- steals wine from strangers
- starts a forest fire because her dad kissed her mom (hindsight i know but still)
- gets Chloe expelled from school
- drugs other students (optional)
- causes more pain to Joyce by keeping Chloe from returning home
- tries to convince Chloe from abandoning Joyce forever by leaving Arcadia Bay
- destroys an expensive table costing more money than what Chloe was trying to save for them to escape
- assaults a psycho brandishing a knife and gets stabbed, pretty much killing herself from blood loss if it werent for others who took her to hospital in time
- and bringing Frank Bower's own life in danger (as he has to fight the Merrick psycho to allow for Chloe to escape with Rachel, only counting on their friendship to survive the encounter)
- after all is said and done, cheats on Chloe by hooking up with her only other friend in Arcadia Bay, Frank and becoming an addict like her mother
- continues to hang with Nathan and eventually falls for Nathan/Jefferson's overdose

Honestly? The best trait about Rachel is her captivating personality. You feel enthralled when around her and do almost anything she wants, but she isnt good at doing stuff in the first place and can lead you both downhill really fast and you wont even realize it.

[Stigma]

You nailed it!
The game (in the guise of William) flat out tells you (Chloe) that hanging out with Rachel is playing with fire.
EDIT
I seriously doubt Rachel crushed on Jefferson. I bet she just used him, like she used all the others..

[Dethlane]

Few not justified points (like causing pain for Joyce, since it was Joyce's own behaviour that antagonized Chloe and caused her to ditch "home"), but other than that nailed it.

[Stigma]

Originally posted by Dethlane:

Few not justified points (like causing pain for Joyce, since it was Joyce's own behaviour that antagonized Chloe and caused her to ditch "home"), but other than that nailed it.

I'm curios. How exactly did Joyce "antagonize" Chloe?

Except for Chloe being a rebellious teenager that you may recognise yourself in, which has no bearing on the truth of course. Playing as Chloe does wake up your inner teen punk rocker after all..

[Dethlane]

Originally posted by Stigma:

Originally posted by Dethlane:

Few not justified points (like causing pain for Joyce, since it was Joyce's own behaviour that antagonized Chloe and caused her to ditch "home"), but other than that nailed it.

I'm curios. How exactly did Joyce "antagonize" Chloe?

She didn't even try to listen to Chloe and instead not only tried to force her views on Chloe and lashed at her when she didn't comply, but also kept letting Madsen get to her. Hell, she's even fine witnessing Madsen straight up insulting Chloe, almost yelling at her and going physical on her (e.g. him grabbing her in ep3 after calling her "disrespectful little ♥♥♥♥"). If Bill saw even half of ♥♥♥♥ Joyce put Chloe through, he'd be forever rolling in his grave (or come back from the dead to stop this nonsense and take proper care of his daughter).

[Stigma]

Originally posted by Dethlane:

Originally posted by Stigma:

I'm curios. How exactly did Joyce "antagonize" Chloe?

She didn't even try to listen to Chloe and instead not only tried to force her views on Chloe and lashed at her when she didn't comply, but also kept letting Madsen get to her. Hell, she's even fine witnessing Madsen straight up insulting Chloe, almost yelling at her and going physical on her (e.g. him grabbing her in ep3 after calling her "disrespectful little ♥♥♥♥"). If Bill saw even half of ♥♥♥♥ Joyce put Chloe through, he'd be forever rolling in his grave (or come back from the dead to stop this nonsense and take proper care of his daughter).

I can tell you're not a parent.. Which I actually am.

Would you be fine with your kid ditching school, smoking pot, indulging in underage drinking, lying about that, having zero respect for your opinions and your authority as a parent, starting stupid fights about literally everything, stealing guns/money, breaking curfew, snooping through your private stuff and hanging out with people like Frank Bowers?
Joyce was at her wits' end regarding her daughter's behavior. I bet you're looking forward to having a rebellious teenager and be happy about it yourself, huh? I was worried sick when I had a teenage daughter like that.. Thankfully, my kid cleaned up her act and sought help.

David was no saint, but he actually sought help for his combat PTSD. He also tries to reach her halfway only to be met by "F**k off, nazi pr*ck." Chloe on the other hand seems to revel in her PTSD and use it as a "get out of jail card"; woe is me.. Chloe's behavior is in fact highly narcissistic.

Playing as Chloe does indeed awaken the player's inner punk rocker, no argument here. And it's way too easy to side with a characer you're playing.. But in real life there are in fact two sides to every coin.

[Dethlane]

Originally posted by Stigma:

Would you be fine with your kid ditching school, smoking pot, indulging in underage drinking, lying about that, having zero respect for your opinions and your authority as a parent, starting stupid fights about literally everything, stealing guns/money, breaking curfew, snooping through your private stuff and hanging out with people like Frank Bowers?
Joyce was at her wits' end regarding her daughter's behavior. I bet you're looking forward to having a rebellious teenager and be happy about it yourself, huh? I was worried sick when I had a teenage daughter like that.. Thankfully, my kid cleaned up her act and sought help.

David was no saint, but he actually sought help for his combat PTSD. He also tries to reach her halfway only to be met by "F**k off, nazi pr*ck." Chloe on the other hand seems to revel in her PTSD and use it as a "get out of jail card"; woe is me.. Chloe's behavior is in fact highly narcissistic.

Playing as Chloe does indeed awaken the player's inner punk rocker, no argument here. And it's way too easy to side with a characer you're playing.. But in real life there are in fact two sides to every coin.

You're missing the point and obviously not even trying to look at things from Chloe's perspective. She had two most important persons in her life - her dad and Max - taken away from her (dad died and Max moved away and dropped out of contact) when she was just a kid. She desperately needed support. And what does she get? Joyce bumps into David, gets some happiness, moves on and expects Chloe to follow through just like that. David for some reason treats Chloe like new recruit whom he was tasked to put into shape, giving literally zero respect or love to her. And Blackhell is Blackhell, we get a slice of how Chloe was treated there in Farewell (and in original we get its overall image). So instead of needed and deserved care and support Chloe was pushed around instead. What choice did she have but to rebel? And with "home" being that only in name, it's natural that she kept hanging out outside and ditching curfew in order to minimize interactions which would be unpleasant for both sides.

And no, David neither sought help. He only agreed to go to the counselor in the end of LiS - several years after he got with Joyce and even more after he returned from service. He only got some sense into his thick head when ♥♥♥♥ really hit the fan and Joyce kicked him out. In LiS we clearly see that he treats everyone like a threat and harasses them instead of talking with them. And in BtS we get full extent of how he mistreated Chloe. For example in garage, first he makes Chloe fistbump with him, giving lamest line possible. Then he laughs at her dead dad's toolbox. And finally, my favourite: "We don't have to like each other, but you will respect me! You've enjoyed enough of a vacation from having a father figure!". Saying smth like that not only shows that you give a ratsarse about this person, but is a definite call for beatdown. No one is saint, we're talking about being a decent human being. Which David obviously isn't. And what's worse, Joyce treats it like no big deal, just 'cause stability in her house is far more important to her than her own daughter.

It isn't about picking a side of someone you're playing as, it's about seeing a whole picture and picking a deserving side. Even back in LiS, where at first we're given a not-so-positive image of Chloe, but as story progresses and we're given more bits of her persona and her and Max's history, it becomes clear that not only her behaviour is in overall understandable, but also that under all these layers of defense there is a very good person. And don't forget "Max-wins-contest" timeline - all it took for David to understand his wrongdoings, start behaving decently and apologize to Chloe for her to accept him, despite years of him mistreating her. And with that ♥♥♥♥ fixed and someone who genuinely cares about her - Max - appearing and staying in her life, Chloe moves on with it.

[Maviba]

She' a genuine femme fatal. Poor chloe.

D9 did a good job in giving her a personality that also fits to the original game.

[Vic 2.0]

I think approaching this game's story from a "Are these people being smart?" standpoint isn't the way to go. The question is, Is it BELIEVABLE, the kinds of things they're doing? And IMO people that age who go through trauma without a resolution, do indeed act in ways similar to what we see in the game.

I like this story primarily because it's about feelings, not logic. I'm all about logic in every other aspect of my life; so for me, it's nice to break away from it in a fictional world!

[Maviba]

i think it's also logical. (despite of max's superpower of course.
but I think most people who experience real grief and sorrow can relate to this.
no matter if Chloe, Rachel or even Nathan:
they're all damaged goods and behave in a way you would expect from someone who got traumatised.

[King Robert Baratheon]

Originally posted by Silver:

- unarmed, confronts two grown men (one armed with a broken bottle) just to save Chloe without having the strength to actually take them down or anything
- skips school with Chloe, endangering them both just cause she felt bored (at that point she didn't even know about her real mom to catch a day of fresh air away from Arcadia Bay)
- steals wine from strangers
- starts a forest fire because her dad kissed her mom (hindsight i know but still)
- gets Chloe expelled from school
- drugs other students (optional)
- causes more pain to Joyce by keeping Chloe from returning home
- tries to convince Chloe from abandoning Joyce forever by leaving Arcadia Bay
- destroys an expensive table costing more money than what Chloe was trying to save for them to escape
- assaults a psycho brandishing a knife and gets stabbed, pretty much killing herself from blood loss if it weren't for others who took her to hospital in time
- and bringing Frank Bower's own life in danger (as he has to fight the Merrick psycho to allow for Chloe to escape with Rachel, only counting on their friendship to survive the encounter)
- after all is said and done, cheats on Chloe by hooking up with her only other friend in Arcadia Bay, Frank and becoming an addict like her mother
- continues to hang with Nathan and eventually falls for Nathan/Jefferson's overdose

Honestly? The best trait about Rachel is her captivating personality. You feel enthralled when around her and do almost anything she wants, but she isn't good at doing stuff in the first place and can lead you both downhill really fast and you wont even realize it.

I wholeheartedly agree. And she's extremely manipulative (in general, but especially manipulative to Chloe).