Why is Chloes hair brown?

[HY417 / ar558]

In the first game, Chloes hair is red like her father's hair (in all scenes where it is not dyed blue). There is a only a single photo early in episode 1 which shows her hair as brown, but both Max and Chloe look notable different on it compared to later episodes which actually take place in the past, and that photo is probably a mistake.
In the bonus episode of BtS Max and Chloe look as they did in the first game in the episode when Max was several years in the past, and Chloes hair is correctly red there.
But in the main episodes of BtS, Chloes hair is always brown and there is no hint that she has dyed it. Is it a stupid mistake, or is there any hint anywhere that she dyed her hair?

[Deusuum]

I think that hair changes its color with age, doesn't it? I was practically blonde as a boy, but now my hair is dark brown.

[HY417 / ar558]

But now within 3 years from 13 to 16.
When I was 13 my hair was roughly the same color as Chloes, and now at 30+ its notable darker, but still RED and not brown with no sign of red left.

[Meri]

Your memory must play tricks on you or you cannot differentiate the color light brown from red.

Chloe's natural hair color was never red, it had more of a light brown to if anything slightly strawberry blond touch to it.

Maybe you confuse it somehow because of the lightning ?

Deck Nine Games probably worked very closely with Dontnod together and such a big "mistake" would not go unnoticed.

[nihilistninja]

I had red hair as a kid and both my brothers were shades of blonde. All of us look like we have differet shades of brown hair now. If it weren't for my beard (or other less exposed hair) then anyone would think I was a brunette rather than a ginger. So hair definitely darkens over the years.

Except for Max who's hair seems to have lightened dramatically since she was 13.

Have a look through this Chloe image gallery from the wiki: Link [life-is-strange.wikia.com]

Choe has either pale brown or dark blonde hair in most of her pre-dye pictures. I'm not sure how you picked red out of that.

Originally posted by zerja:

Deck Nine Games probably worked very closely with Dontnod together and such a big "mistake" would not go unnoticed.

Nitpicky I know, but they didn't work together. There's articles quoting a Deck9 dev lead stating that they had no communication with DONTNOD during development, they just received the assets and files of the original game and some SquareEnix staff who helped with the original. Apparently the only feedback the got from DONTNOD was when a couple of Deck9 devs took the game over to Europe and let them play it for a day during testing - the only source I found for that was the wiki though.

All press releases state that SquareEnix worked hard with Deck9 to maintain consistency between the games but DONTNOD had nothing to do with it.

[HY417 / ar558]

I started the game to make screenshots to prove you wrong, but the opposite happened and Chloe really has brown hair in the alternate reality. I am not sure why I thought she had red hair there. Maybe because I mostly recalled the scene on the beach, which happens close to sunset though and bathes everything in a reddish light.

[Meri]

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

I had red hair as a kid and both my brothers were shades of blonde. All of us look like we have differet shades of brown hair now. If it weren't for my beard (or other less exposed hair) then anyone would think I was a brunette rather than a ginger. So hair definitely darkens over the years.

Except for Max who's hair seems to have lightened dramatically since she was 13.

Have a look through this Chloe image gallery from the wiki: Link [life-is-strange.wikia.com]

Choe has either pale brown or dark blonde hair in most of her pre-dye pictures. I'm not sure how you picked red out of that.

At least, we can agree that it is definitely not red.

Originally posted by zerja:

Deck Nine Games probably worked very closely with Dontnod together and such a big "mistake" would not go unnoticed.

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Nitpicky I know, but they didn't work together. There's articles quoting a Deck9 dev lead stating that they had no communication with DONTNOD during development, they just received the assets and files of the original game and some SquareEnix staff who helped with the original. Apparently the only feedback the got from DONTNOD was when a couple of Deck9 devs took the game over to Europe and let them play it for a day during testing - the only source I found for that was the wiki though.

All press releases state that SquareEnix worked hard with Deck9 to maintain consistency between the games but DONTNOD had nothing to do with it.

That is the reason why I said "probably", however if what you say is true about "the assets and files of the original game and some SquareEnix staff who helped with the original." and "Apparently the only feedback the got from DONTNOD was when a couple of Deck9 devs took the game over to Europe and let them play it for a day during testing", then it is save to assume that Dontnod would have mentioned the inconsistency in regard to Chloe's haircolor while testing the game. Apparently, they did not have a problem with that.

[nihilistninja]

Originally posted by zerja:

That is the reason why I said "probably", however if what you say is true about "the assets and files of the original game and some SquareEnix staff who helped with the original." and "Apparently the only feedback the got from DONTNOD was when a couple of Deck9 devs took the game over to Europe and let them play it for a day during testing", then it is save to assume that Dontnod would have mentioned the inconsistency in regard to Chloe's haircolor while testing the game. Apparently, they did not have a problem with that.

Yeah it was less a response to you than all the people who like to pretend that there's no inconsistencies between LiS and BtS due to DONTNOD driving shotgun, whereas in reality there are inconsitencies and DONTNOD had nothing to do with development of the new game.

Let's take 2 changes:

Chloe's hair - in LiS we can see a shot of Chloe's 16th birthday and she already has the blue streak in her hair. BtS starts 3 months after Chloe turned 16 and she doesn't have the streak but gets it during her 'gearing up' sequence in the last episode. Was this a mistake or artistic license?

Whatever the case I like this change, Chloe taking her mum's boots, her dad's suspenders and using the blue dye she brought with Max to start building her icon look from the first game and then go help Rachel is some pretty awesome symbolism.

However it is an inconsistency.

Joyce and David - in LiS these two were married prior to Chloe turning 16. In BtS they haven't even moved in together, that happens in episode 2. Was this a mistake or artistic license?

I'm less accepting here and think it's more likely to be a mistake due to the possibility of creating more tension in the Price-Madsen household by having Joyce and David be newlyweds which would have suited Deck9's purposes more.

So no, while some may be silly, there are a number of inconsistencies proving neither whatever files and support staff they recieved nor the few hours DONTNOD got to play a test build prevented these issues.

[Chris]

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Originally posted by zerja:

That is the reason why I said "probably", however if what you say is true about "the assets and files of the original game and some SquareEnix staff who helped with the original." and "Apparently the only feedback the got from DONTNOD was when a couple of Deck9 devs took the game over to Europe and let them play it for a day during testing", then it is save to assume that Dontnod would have mentioned the inconsistency in regard to Chloe's haircolor while testing the game. Apparently, they did not have a problem with that.

Yeah it was less a response to you than all the people who like to pretend that there's no inconsistencies between LiS and BtS due to DONTNOD driving shotgun, whereas in reality there are inconsitencies and DONTNOD had nothing to do with development of the new game.

Let's take 2 changes:

Chloe's hair - in LiS we can see a shot of Chloe's 16th birthday and she already has the blue streak in her hair. BtS starts 3 months after Chloe turned 16 and she doesn't have the streak but gets it during her 'gearing up' sequence in the last episode. Was this a mistake or artistic license?

Whatever the case I like this change, Chloe taking her mum's boots, her dad's suspenders and using the blue dye she brought with Max to start building her icon look from the first game and then go help Rachel is some pretty awesome symbolism.

However it is an inconsistency.

Joyce and David - in LiS these two were married prior to Chloe turning 16. In BtS they haven't even moved in together, that happens in episode 2. Was this a mistake or artistic license?

I'm less accepting here and think it's more likely to be a mistake due to the possibility of creating more tension in the Price-Madsen household by having Joyce and David be newlyweds which would have suited Deck9's purposes more.

So no, while some may be silly, there are a number of inconsistencies proving neither whatever files and support staff they recieved nor the few hours DONTNOD got to play a test build prevented these issues.

yep

[Meri]

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Originally posted by zerja:

That is the reason why I said "probably", however if what you say is true about "the assets and files of the original game and some SquareEnix staff who helped with the original." and "Apparently the only feedback the got from DONTNOD was when a couple of Deck9 devs took the game over to Europe and let them play it for a day during testing", then it is save to assume that Dontnod would have mentioned the inconsistency in regard to Chloe's haircolor while testing the game. Apparently, they did not have a problem with that.

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Yeah it was less a response to you than all the people who like to pretend that there's no inconsistencies between LiS and BtS due to DONTNOD driving shotgun, whereas in reality there are inconsitencies and DONTNOD had nothing to do with development of the new game.

Well, I am not one of these people and I am not going to pretend that there are no inconsistencies at all.

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Let's take 2 changes:

Chloe's hair - in LiS we can see a shot of Chloe's 16th birthday and she already has the blue streak in her hair. BtS starts 3 months after Chloe turned 16 and she doesn't have the streak but gets it during her 'gearing up' sequence in the last episode. Was this a mistake or artistic license?

Whatever the case I like this change, Chloe taking her mum's boots, her dad's suspenders and using the blue dye she brought with Max to start building her icon look from the first game and then go help Rachel is some pretty awesome symbolism.

However it is an inconsistency.

I believe that this one is intentional for the very reason you are describing. In my opinion it is pretty much neglectable.

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Joyce and David - in LiS these two were married prior to Chloe turning 16. In BtS they haven't even moved in together, that happens in episode 2. Was this a mistake or artistic license?

I'm less accepting here and think it's more likely to be a mistake due to the possibility of creating more tension in the Price-Madsen household by having Joyce and David be newlyweds which would have suited Deck9's purposes more.

Definitely a more harder break than the hair color, but again an understandable one. As you mentioned, it probably suited Deck Nine more, because the immediate "danger" of David moving in, as fast as he does, makes Chloe's anger, pain and frustration more relatable. They could have handled it otherwise of course, so I can see how you could be unsatisfied with this decision.

I think I am just more forgiving all in all when it comes to things like that. As long as the established story so far is not completely vandalized, I am willing to look past little inconsistencies here and there for the sake of artistic freedom, especially regarding prequels, since they are so much more difficult to get right.

[nihilistninja]

Originally posted by zerja:

I think I am just more forgiving all in all when it comes to things like that. As long as the established story so far is not completely vandalized, I am willing to look past little inconsistencies here and there for the sake of artistic freedom, especially regarding prequels, since they are so much more difficult to get right.

There is my least favourite inconsistency that I think does do real damage without any return on investment - Pompidou.

In LiS this mutt is a mistreated fighting dog, the first real sign that Frank isn't quite the sh*thead he's made out to be up to that point. The backstory is that Frank was a fan of dog fighting but grew a conscience, broke up the fighting ring by informing the police, freed the dogs and kept Pompidou.

In BtS this backstory is entirely destroyed just to have Damon Merrick give the puppy to Frank as a sign of their friendship. Throwing Frank's character development under the bus just to reinforce his relationship with a new character I couldn't give less of a sh*t about is well beyond little inconsistencies and artistic license.

[Meri]

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Originally posted by zerja:

I think I am just more forgiving all in all when it comes to things like that. As long as the established story so far is not completely vandalized, I am willing to look past little inconsistencies here and there for the sake of artistic freedom, especially regarding prequels, since they are so much more difficult to get right.

There is my least favourite inconsistency that I think does do real damage without any return on investment - Pompidou.

In LiS this mutt is a mistreated fighting dog, the first real sign that Frank isn't quite the sh*thead he's made out to be up to that point. The backstory is that Frank was a fan of dog fighting but grew a conscience, broke up the fighting ring by informing the police, freed the dogs and kept Pompidou.

In BtS this backstory is entirely destroyed just to have Damon Merrick give the puppy to Frank as a sign of their friendship. Throwing Frank's character development under the bus just to reinforce his relationship with a new character I couldn't give less of a sh*t about is well beyond little inconsistencies and artistic license.

That is quite difficult to comment for me now, because I have not played LiS S1 for awhile and therefore do not exactly remember the voice lines etc.

In regards to BtS, I think it was more than just underlining their friendship, but moreover to display Frank's caring side, that he has a good heart, even though he does bad things. They were definitely aiming to present a more likeable version of Frank, not that Frank in LiS is an unlikeable character by any means, I was quite fond of him in LiS as well.

There is a three year gap between BtS and LiS, so Frank could have trained Pampidou and bet on him in these dog fights, initially this is exactly what Damon wanted to do I guess, drill Pompidou.

Moreover, I believe that the dog fighting ring was present and hinted at in BtS already. I think Frank knew about it. In episode one we can see dog kennels at the old mill, a dog inside the mill with the name Delia and a note which showed that someone owed Damon Merrick 1k $, most likely related to the bets on these dog fights. Furthermore, in episode two Frank said that Damon was recently doing things which he did not like, but that he had not as much leverage on him as he once had. This could be another indicator, but I believe that he rather meant Damon's ruthlessness behaviour which led to murder.

Edit: I think Damon also mentioned something about losing all the dogs due to the forest fire / burnt mill.

However, if I recall it right, then Frank mentioned in LiS that Pompidou's previous owner was a bad guy who was responsible for Pompidou's aggressive behaviour and that therefore he trained Pompidou to be good to people when he took care of him or something alike, like I said do not quote me on it, I have not played LiS for awhile.

This could indeed be an inconsistency, because it would mean that Frank gave Pompidou away during these three years time gap which I just cannot really see happening, considering that the little puppy was the last remembrance of his former bff.

Sorry if my rambling got out of hand, it happens sometimes :)

[nihilistninja]

Originally posted by zerja:

That is quite difficult to comment for me now, because I have not play LiS S1 for awhile and therefore do not exactly remember the voice lines etc.

In regards to BtS, I think it was more than just underlining their friendship, but moreover to display Frank's caring side, that he has a good heart, even though he does bad things. They were definitely aiming to present a more likeable version of Frank, not that Frank in LiS is an unlikeable character by any means, I was quite fond of him in LiS as well.

There is a three year gap between BtS and LiS, so Frank could have trained Pampidou and bet on him in these dog fights, initially this is exactly what Damon wanted to do I guess, drill Pompidou.

Moreover, I believe that the dog fighting ring was present and hinted at in BtS already. I think Frank knew about it. In episode one we can see dog kennels at the old mill, a dog inside the mill with the name Delia and a note which showed that someone owed Damon Merrick 1k $, most likely related to the bets on these dog fights. Furthermore, in episode two Frank said that Damon was recently doing things which he did not like, but that he had not as much leverage on him as he once had. This could be another indicator, but I believe that he rather meant Damon's ruthlessness behaviour which led to murder.

Edit: I think Damon also mentioned something about losing all the dogs due to the forest fire / burnt mill.

However, if I recall it right, then Frank mentioned in LiS that Pompidou's previous owner was a bad guy who was responsible for Pompidou's aggressive behaviour and that therefore he trained Pompidou to be good to people when he took care of him or something alike, like I said do not quote me on it, I have not played LiS for awhile.

This could indeed be an inconsistency, because it would mean that Frank gave Pompidou away during these three years time gap which I just cannot really see happening, considering that the little puppy was the last remembrance of his former bff.

Sorry if my rambling got out of hand, it happens sometimes :)

It's more than what you're making out though.

I could speculate an entire story to join BtS and LiS versions of Pompidou and Frank's stories together. Maybe something similar to John Wick where Pompidou get dognapped by some vaguely Eastern-European types and Frank has to revisit his past as an assassin to fight a massive underground dog ring. Freezeframe the final scene of Frank limping off into the sunset wearing a black suit with Pompidou at his side. Cue violins.

Just as legitimate as anything else someone might come up with, and it might make an awesome graphic novel. The problem is that we even have to do it, not that it's impossible to contort our own personal headcanons to create a plausible version of events.

My issue is that Pompidou and Frank's relationship is of massive import to LiS. The day before Frank had pulled a knife on Chloe and this is the reveal that Frank isn't such a garbage human being. It's the first signs of something more under his exterior, possibly whatever Rachel saw in him.

The fact that it's thrown out merely to help flesh out Damon Merrick is a super f*cking sh*tty thing to have done in my eyes. I also hadn't missed the hints of Damon's involvement in dog fighting but there's a big leap from Pompidou being a blooded fighting dog to being the pup of a fighting dog given away as a gift for Frank's loyalty.

There were other ways of showing Frank's better nature in BtS. Pompidou could have still been involved as a timeframe wasn't given for when Frank broke up the ring. And for the majority of fans of the series Frank's better nature isn't a mystery that is needed to be revealed.

Like I said, it was a mess of a revision of LiS that diminished a character by taking an important defining moment away just to flesh out one of Deck9's original characters.

Normally I really try to do my best to meet halfway or see the other side of disagreements but this is definitely one issue I have to chalk up to Deck9 not resepecting the original game enough or prioritising their characters and story over the previous game.

PS - As you can see I have no problem with rambling.

[Meri]

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Originally posted by zerja:

That is quite difficult to comment for me now, because I have not play LiS S1 for awhile and therefore do not exactly remember the voice lines etc.

In regards to BtS, I think it was more than just underlining their friendship, but moreover to display Frank's caring side, that he has a good heart, even though he does bad things. They were definitely aiming to present a more likeable version of Frank, not that Frank in LiS is an unlikeable character by any means, I was quite fond of him in LiS as well.

There is a three year gap between BtS and LiS, so Frank could have trained Pampidou and bet on him in these dog fights, initially this is exactly what Damon wanted to do I guess, drill Pompidou.

Moreover, I believe that the dog fighting ring was present and hinted at in BtS already. I think Frank knew about it. In episode one we can see dog kennels at the old mill, a dog inside the mill with the name Delia and a note which showed that someone owed Damon Merrick 1k $, most likely related to the bets on these dog fights. Furthermore, in episode two Frank said that Damon was recently doing things which he did not like, but that he had not as much leverage on him as he once had. This could be another indicator, but I believe that he rather meant Damon's ruthlessness behaviour which led to murder.

Edit: I think Damon also mentioned something about losing all the dogs due to the forest fire / burnt mill.

However, if I recall it right, then Frank mentioned in LiS that Pompidou's previous owner was a bad guy who was responsible for Pompidou's aggressive behaviour and that therefore he trained Pompidou to be good to people when he took care of him or something alike, like I said do not quote me on it, I have not played LiS for awhile.

This could indeed be an inconsistency, because it would mean that Frank gave Pompidou away during these three years time gap which I just cannot really see happening, considering that the little puppy was the last remembrance of his former bff.

Sorry if my rambling got out of hand, it happens sometimes :)

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

It's more than what you're making out though.

You can add anything if you want, I just mentioned a few things which I had in memory.

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

I could speculate an entire story to join BtS and LiS versions of Pompidou and Frank's stories together. Maybe something similar to John Wick where Pompidou get dognapped by some vaguely Eastern-European types and Frank has to revisit his past as an assassin to fight a massive underground dog ring. Freezeframe the final scene of Frank limping off into the sunset wearing a black suit with Pompidou at his side. Cue violins.

Yours is a little bit drifted away though, but it does not matter since both are just theories, just as you have said.

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Just as legitimate as anything else someone might come up with, and it might make an awesome graphic novel. The problem is that we even have to do it, not that it's impossible to contort our own personal headcanons to create a plausible version of events.

Would not be the first time in the LiS franchise though, would it ? People are still desperately discussing theories concerning what happened between Rachel and Chloe, some in denial even stil bring up theories/fairy tales about Rachel being alive :D

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

My issue is that Pompidou and Frank's relationship is of massive import to LiS. The day before Frank had pulled a knife on Chloe and this is the reveal that Frank isn't such a garbage human being. It's the first signs of something more under his exterior, possibly whatever Rachel saw in him.

The fact that it's thrown out merely to help flesh out Damon Merrick is a super f*cking sh*tty thing to have done in my eyes. I also hadn't missed the hints of Damon's involvement in dog fighting but there's a big leap from Pompidou being a blooded fighting dog to being the pup of a fighting dog given away as a gift for Frank's loyalty.

There were other ways of showing Frank's better nature in BtS. Pompidou could have still been involved as a timeframe wasn't given for when Frank broke up the ring. And for the majority of fans of the series Frank's better nature isn't a mystery that is needed to be revealed.

Like I said, it was a mess of a revision of LiS that diminished a character by taking an important defining moment away just to flesh out one of Deck9's original characters.

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

Normally I really try to do my best to meet halfway or see the other side of disagreements but this is definitely one issue I have to chalk up to Deck9 not resepecting the original game enough or prioritising their characters and story over the previous game.

I believe it was the latter if anything, I do believe that Deck Nine respects the original game, but who knows maybe the writer/-s messed up in this point.

Originally posted by nihilistninja:

PS - As you can see I have no problem with rambling.

I can definitely see where you are coming from.

I can respect your opinion, especially because you are explaining it in opposite to some other people who stubbornly stick to theirs without supporting it in any way.

[NIAD3ADF4CE]

I had a similar haircolor (natural strawberry blonde) until the age of 13/14. My hair grew a lot darker then. At the age of 16 my hair was completely dark without a sting of red anymore. (I had them cut short, so every lighter tone was gone)
It might behave the same way with Chloes hair, because I don't think that the game producers wouldn't have noticed the mistake.
Also Max has got dark brown hair when she was young but hers turned some shades lighter into medium brown. Human hair is often changing color and structure during puberty, which is making the game a bit more authentic.