DM. Donskoi... the ship is a joke, right?

[MetaliCator]

So... The Chapayev is way better than the DM. Donskoi.

Chapayev (Left) VS DM. Donskoi (Right)

Default firing range: 15.8 Km VS 16.2 Km
Default detectability range: 12.8 Km VS 17.9 Km

- The Chapayev is easier to maneuver.
- The Chapayev is faster to start from idle.
- The Chapayev is better at hiding.
- The Chapayev can handle more punishment.
- The Chapayev does not receive so many citadel hits.
- The Chapayev can land citadel hits.

- The DM. Donskoi does not like to maneuver easily.
- The DM. Donskoi takes forever to start from idle.
- The DM. Donskoi cannot hide for the life of it.
- The DM. Donskoi cannot handle heat.
- The DM. Donskoi receives citadel hits no matter how you are facing the enemy.
- The DM. Donskoi cannot land citadel hits. (It can only citadel hit Tiers VII or lower)

I just want to sell this crap, but I won't, I really want the A. Nevsky.
No wonder everyone that sees me playing a DM. Donskoi is telling me I chose the wrong line to follow, the Petropavlovsk line is much tankier and harder to hit

In all honesty, I can understand that Cruisers are not Battleships, therefor they can't take much punishment, thus avoid taking damage at all costs IF possible.

What I can't understand though is this.

17.9 Detectability range?!

Here are some ships which are much, much larger than the DM. Donskoi and their detectability range by default (No upgrades or Captain skills).

Montana: 15.6 Km
Yamato: 17.5 Km
Preussen: 17.6 Km
Conqueror: 15.2 Km
Republique: 17.5 Km
Kremlin: 16.5 Km
C. Colombo: 17.3 Km

And you mean to tell me that DM. Donskoi is MUCH larger and thus easier to spot? ^_-

[Rasluka]

techline Tier 9 ships overall are just pretty meh in general, combined with the fact you get uptiered to superships too

[Jackson]

I'd never looked at stats, but I've played Donskoi a lot. it's one of my favorite cruisers! I did not care for Chappy

[MetaliCator]

Originally posted by Rasluka:

techline Tier 9 ships overall are just pretty meh in general, combined with the fact you get uptiered to superships too

Very true, but you have to climb the ladder somehow, unfortunately, for me to get the A. Nevsky I need to play this ship...

[MetaliCator]

Originally posted by Jackson:

I'd never looked at stats, but I've played Donskoi a lot. it's one of my favorite cruisers! I did not care for Chappy

Good for you mate.

[Jackson]

Originally posted by MetaliCator:

Originally posted by Jackson:

I'd never looked at stats, but I've played Donskoi a lot. it's one of my favorite cruisers! I did not care for Chappy

Good for you mate.

thanks!

[Dee-Jay]

Well, it's not really a direct comparison with the Chapayev. Chapy is a bona fide light cruiser, whereas Donskoi is pretty much a big lump of a cruiser. Nevsky is just as much as a big visible lump of a heavy cruiser, but with some considerable upgrades to gun performance
It's a nonsense of a term real-world but I like to think of Don as a "medium cruiser".

Those 180mm guns on Donskoi are very much dual ammo de-tuned on penetration and ricochet angle from Tallinn. The AP still outperforms some of the T9 203mm "heavy cruisers" and will smash light cruisers to pieces at short-medium range.

Originally posted by Rasluka:

techline Tier 9 ships overall are just pretty meh in general, combined with the fact you get uptiered to superships too

Don't agree at all! There's some great ships in the T9 tech tree group, although maybe not so much for the cruisers. Most of the DD's (including two of the best in the game, tier for tier in my opinion - Kitakaze and Jutland. Most of the BB's too.

[Jackson]

Yep, the T9's are mostly just fine. There are bad ones of course, but there are bad ones at all tiers. Just depends on the nation/tree!

For battleships, FDG and Izumo stand out quite a lot as being pretty un-fun even if, technically, they're not that bad.

Donskoi is definitely what of the best cruisers though. Starts fires very readily. AP is good. It's tanky for a cruiser.

With Donkey I averaged over 57k damage. With Chappy only 42k. That's huge considering it's only one tier difference. That's just my play style though. Undoubtedly Chappy will work better (and Donkey worse) for others.

[Dee-Jay]

Originally posted by Jackson:

Yep, the T9's are mostly just fine. There are bad ones of course, but there are bad ones at all tiers. Just depends on the nation/tree!

For battleships, FDG and Izumo stand out quite a lot as being pretty un-fun even if, technically, they're not that bad.

Donskoi is definitely what of the best cruisers though. Starts fires very readily. AP is good. It's tanky for a cruiser.

With Donkey I averaged over 57k damage. With Chappy only 42k. That's huge considering it's only one tier difference. That's just my play style though. Undoubtedly Chappy will work better (and Donkey worse) for others.

I actually like Izumo! Tough as a rock and those guns!

Not played Donskoi in ages, just having a game now. Only got a 10 pt commander though...

[Jackson]

Originally posted by Dee-Jay:

Originally posted by Jackson:

Yep, the T9's are mostly just fine. There are bad ones of course, but there are bad ones at all tiers. Just depends on the nation/tree!

For battleships, FDG and Izumo stand out quite a lot as being pretty un-fun even if, technically, they're not that bad.

Donskoi is definitely what of the best cruisers though. Starts fires very readily. AP is good. It's tanky for a cruiser.

With Donkey I averaged over 57k damage. With Chappy only 42k. That's huge considering it's only one tier difference. That's just my play style though. Undoubtedly Chappy will work better (and Donkey worse) for others.

I actually like Izumo! Tough as a rock and those guns!

Not played Donskoi in ages, just having a game now. Only got a 10 pt commander though...

WG kinda messed up on Izumo imo. They chose the least probable design for Izumo imo. There was one basically the same but with all turrets forward (similar to Nelson) that would have been much more useful and made more sense.

[Dee-Jay]

Solid game in Don. Faster than I remember, with the propulsion mod on (others might go for the rudder shift of course). Radar gunned a DD down and then a 2 salvo, quad citadel AP deletion of a Smolensk from 15km. OK not the toughest target but they lights die quickly when you catch them broadside with that AP!!!!



OP - just noticed, you got the firing range and detection range mixed up. Detection is 15km something. Still high but remember it'll come down to 12.5km or so with concealment mod and concealment expert on the commander. Which is perfectly good for the ships role and gives you a 5km window for firing guns then going dark if too much heat comes your way.

Have you done all the upgrades on Donskoi? Hull upgrade is (as ever) massively important and makes a big difference, particularly to ship handling. She feels zippy TBH.

Don't sit still in her though!

[Nepgear]

Runs Heavy HE.
"Why concealment so bad?"

Also Donskoi has a heal and a lot more AP pen than Chappy.

[MetaliCator]

Originally posted by Nepgear:

Runs Heavy HE.
"Why concealment so bad?"

Also Donskoi has a heal and a lot more AP pen than Chappy.

I was trying to find a good answer for your comment.

And despite coming up with 100's of answers, I keep deleting them all as I am positive you will lack the means to understand them, since your comment already says a lot about you, not that I mean to offend you, but certain people's minds are structured in certain ways, and certain people tend to not understand certain things.

Your logic can be expanded to literally every single ship on WoWs, thus I can't come up with a good answer for you.

An example would be:

The Yamato. It's a Battle Ship, a tanky ship as it has a lot of Health, very good armor, very big and powerful weapons, great firing range, yet it only has 17 Km concealment range. Shouldn't we raise it's concealment from 17 Km to... something like 20-22 Km, JUST because it has guns that can one shot almost anything?

Don't answer that, just think about it, because your words:
Runs Heavy HE.
"Why concealment so bad?"

They fall in that category.

[Jackson]

I know you weren't replying to me, but Yamato is one of the poorer performing battleships. It does have great guns, but the turrets are incredibly slow. It's got poor maneuverability, poor AA and actually weak armor if you know where to shoot.

All my point is, is that "most" ships are in balance and if they're strong in one area they're weak in something else. They require you to play to their strengths. If you can't or simply don't want to, they'll appear bad to you.

Case in point, a while back I was seeing on the official forums that this guy was going on about how great the California was. He didn't understand why no one liked it. It's actually genuinely bad, yet he had hundreds of battles with a 55% (or so) win rate. He just liked how it worked.

[Jackson]

Say what? I just looked at Donskoi (tech tree, no upgrades, no captain skills) and it's 15.5.

https://prnt.sc/XvfuzJrXSnof

[Jackson]

Oh! Hah, Nepgear is referring to your captain skill. It nerfs concealment. That's why he was poking fun. It's a bad perk in my opinion. It's good for HE spammers that use small guns.

Nepgear knows his ships. Probably knew immediately when you said 17.9 conceal that you had taken that skill.