radar crap

[fumungus]

3 things: unless planes have radar then they should need to have LOS to spot ships. not sure how a plane can see a ship through a mountain otherwise.
can you possilbly explore the option to give DDs a counter option against radar. like maybe a jammer option that lowers the range of radars by a percentage. or a camo that reduces radar detectability range but in increases visual detectability. high tier DD combat seems to be that the only option is to avoid radar altogether. not fun at all when you have 3 or 4 radar ships on enemy team just sitting behind mountains to become radar stations.
how about making radar detected ships 'ping' , like being visible for one second then invisible for 2 secs etc. to give some chance of survivability.

[mystikmind2005]

What your talking about is cloaking technology, which as far as i am aware does not exist even to this day.... although quite often in the game it appears that it does exist!! (i wish they would fix that)

But on the other hand having a fixed and arbitrary radar detection range is not realistic either since some larger things will obviously stand out on radar at a longer range range than some smaller things.

Also it is a known fact that the earlier radars of ww2 were exceedingly innefective in untrained hands.... so captain skills should have a massive impact on radar.

[Ryuu]

Devs told they're thinking about some radar-countering consumables, no exact plans yet.

Which exactly high tier? For tier 10 destroyers in good hands it feels fine.

[OBXandos]

Originally posted by Ryuu:

Devs told they're thinking about some radar-countering consumables, no exact plans yet.

Which exactly high tier? For tier 10 destroyers in good hands it feels fine.

I really hope not. We do not need counters to counters in this game.

[kingjames488]

well planes fly, so they can see over mountains...

[fumungus]

have a browse about RAM, apparently it was used as early as ww2.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiation-absorbent_material

im not talking about a cloaking device, im talking about anythin that may have been in the era of the ships that are being used.

if a cruiser is behind an island and it is completely hidden and it launches a plane, you will be instantly spotted if u are within air detection range. even though the plane will not physically see u for another 5 seconds or so. to me, it just seems to wreck any sneaky chance u have especially as BB if u havent been spotted for a while.

for people complaining about my ideas, please consider that radar in this game is basically showing the perfect image of a ship that is most likely invisible to the eye. not sure how many ships in ww2 had powerful thermal imaging systems

[imrahil2]

Originally posted by king(strange)james488:

well planes fly, so they can see over mountains...

Shh, don't bring 3 dimensions into it as it is too logical.

[Ryuu]

Originally posted by OBXandos:

Originally posted by Ryuu:

Devs told they're thinking about some radar-countering consumables, no exact plans yet.

Which exactly high tier? For tier 10 destroyers in good hands it feels fine.

I really hope not. We do not need counters to counters in this game.

I wouldn't mind if they add some alternative gameplay by adding a DD upgrade or consumable like OP mentions. I think it's indeed kinda OP that some radar ships have radar range exceeding or very close to their spotting range(with upgrades+perks) AND long duration as well.
Chapayev with 11.7 km radar and ~10 km concealment is fine, because his radar duration is pretty low.
Des Moines with 9.9 km radar, 10.6 km concealment and 48 s duration is pretty dangerous.
Minotaur is at least balanced by its squishiness and absence of HE shells.
But now we have Worchester which is a hybrid between Des Moines and Minotaur and it's really painful T_T Well, maybe i haven't got accustomed yet, but seriously, how DDs are gonna perform one of their primary roles: spotting if even in the open they can't overspot radar ships?

Radar ships don't need all those qualities to still be effective counters - torpedo attacks from 9-10 km distances are not sufficiently effective anyway, so they keep destroyers at bay.

I'm a long-time good player and for me it's not such a critical problem, especially at random T10 battles. In ranked and clan battles the DD life becomes even more dreadful.
But i still admit something should be adjusted, like already suggested:
1) showing radar-spotted targets in pulses, not all the time throughout duration
2) showing generic outline, not a clear ship model
3) other adjustments to radar ships
4) or instead giving DDs some option to counter this at expense of other qualities

The main point: DDs should still be able to perform the role of spotters. Why had cruisers became the main spotting class with all those planes, hydro, radar, etc?

[fumungus]

yes planes can see over mountains. im talking about LOS. unless the plane can directly see the ship it shouldnt be able to detect. unless biplanes had radar

[StormhawkV]

In my opinion the radar in WoWs would be fine if it only spots ships with a direct line of sight to the player using it instead of going through the terrain. There is no risk involved for the radar ship when it parks behind an island close to the cap. When the counter starts ticking he only has to push a button and the DD is in trouble.

This is not so much about making life easier for DDs but more about increasing the pace of tier 10 games which were never fast but became exceptionally stale after the release of the american CLs. I remember WG saying that radar will have the opposite effect because it protects BBs from DDs but everyone who has played WoWs knows that BBs are more likely to push when a DD scouts in front of them.

I also noticed a decrease in the viability of stealth-based gameplay. For the last two months I mostly played russian DDs because they deal well with the radar threat and realised that I cap around the same time as if I used a stealth-based DD but the russian DDs are better at dislodging radar cruisers from their island positions or farming damage by kiting away after the enemy took the cap while I would have tried to bait out their radars when playing a stealth-based DD.

I'm pretty sure WG will eventually make changes to radar as DD numbers in hightier are already dropping and they are about to release a DD techtree that is weaker to radar than usual because of their low speed.

Btw, does someone know why last activity in this thread is shown as 18 hours ago when the last post is in fact from 14th July?

[Chopsaw]

Do you like passive play from your DD's? Because radar is how you get super-passive play. I re-equipped my Gearing and retrained my captain to use the available 16.5Km torps and high reload long-range HE shells. Now I'll sit back with Cruisers and send long-range torps out and start fires. I get complaints about not spotting but I'm more valuable alive and doing damage than briefly spotting until the radar circle-jerk sinks me.

Magic terrain-ignoring radar is a cancer to good gameplay.

[Flashshark]

We have discussed changes to radar over 1 year ago and still there is no real conclusion...

Originally posted by StormhawkV:

In my opinion the radar in WoWs would be fine if it only spots ships with a direct line of sight to the player using it instead of going through the terrain.

Yeah 100% with you!

Originally posted by Chopsaw:

Do you like passive play from your DD's? Because radar is how you get super-passive play. I re-equipped my Gearing and retrained my captain to use the available 16.5Km torps and high reload long-range HE shells. Now I'll sit back with Cruisers and send long-range torps out and start fires.

This is the sad consequence and reality!


But actually it represents the developement of naval battle in the present.
CVs getting more and more important for spotting (like AWACs and F16 do in reality)
While Destroyers are only used for coast guarding or picking up refugees...

The next step is to add anti ship rockets (on bombers and on cruisers) and delete DDs from the game.

[Donegali]

Realistically, I still don't feel there was too much of an issue and what issue there was, was over shadowed by the CV rework. CV's suddenly became the worst issue by far. Did they ever implement the spotting delay for the ships not acutally radaring?

I think DD's are more viable now than they have been since the CV rework, however as I moved over to cruisers I'm not sure anymore.

[Lavian]

As far as I know, radar delay is a thing. When playing a DD CVs don't actually scare me, but getting spotted by radar through a mountain does suck a lot. I can see and avoid incoming planes, but I can't see the cruiser on the other side of the island, and before the radar, none of the allies of that cruiser could see me. Being focused down because of this is painful.

That said, this is rare. Also I'm exceptionally bad at DDs, so my problems are those of a person that knows not what they're doing. I still think they're a good time though, even with all of the challenges.

[imrahil2]

Originally posted by Donegali:

. Did they ever implement the spotting delay for the ships not acutally radaring?.

Yes IIRC its a 6 second delay now.

[Formous]

Given DDs have received non stop buffs across the board, not just against CVs with their magic stealth fields, but also against Radar if you actually read the patch notes, among other things, I am not in favor of giving DDs any further strengths.