July 2021 class Tierlist?

[Victory Skeleton]

Curious as to your thoughts.

S-
Grail Knight
Ranger Veteran
Handmaiden
Sister of The Thorn
Witch Hunter Captain
Battle Wizard

A -
Mercenary
Footknight
Iron Breaker
Shade
Zealot
Unchained

B -
Huntsman
Slayer
Waystalker
Bounty Hunter

Sad -
Outcast Engineer
Pyromancer

[J.P.]

I just won two cata games as Outcast Engineer & Pyromancer LOL

:feelsgoodman:

[Wandering Flare]

I'm just here to watch the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ that is about to happen.

[GгімTћіs]

Pretty good list, but waystalker should be A, and i feel like BH is more of B+. He's pretty good.

Slayer needs a rework for sure. I don't know ♥♥♥♥ about sienna except unchained; which i'd move to B-

[Victory Skeleton]

Originally posted by GrimThis:

Pretty good list, but waystalker should be A, and i feel like BH is more of B+. He's pretty good.

Slayer needs a rework for sure. I don't know ♥♥♥♥ about sienna except unchained; which i'd move to B-

I agree that Waystalker is probably A. It's just hard to rate her again Shade. Shade was solid S for me before SotT and Kerilian has only strong careers. BH for me is more gimmicky, and suffers from a lack of personal defense.

[cstkl1]

its like a drunk dude started this thread must be pcgamer fan.

GK doesnt belong in class A.
class A = can handle everything

GK will die to 3 skave shield+armoured skaven +monk which is common

irombreaker same reasoning. and a tier down to C

partyknife has a excellent video on tier.

zealot also C, bounty stronger.

huntsman and bounty clearly class B

[puzzlefox]

The class being played hardly matters, really. Even the "worst" class in the hands of a good player can carry a team. I'll just go ahead and set the record straight here.

S class
Exceptional player

A class
Competent player

B class
Player who is improving and willing to learn

Sad class
Players who actually care about green circles, trail off on their own, are toxic

[Malthar]

Originally posted by puzzlefox:

The class being played hardly matters, really. Even the "worst" class in the hands of a good player can carry a team. I'll just go ahead and set the record straight here.

S class
Exceptional player

A class
Competent player

B class
Player who is improving and willing to learn

Sad class
Players who actually care about green circles, trail off on their own, are toxic

I understand where you're coming from. Though I have to point out that in scenarios like this, where we're comparing the classes, you have to exclude player skill and take them at face value.

[Calculus]

Ok i will do my own:

S++
SoTT

S
Merc, Handmaiden, WHC, RV, Battle Wizard

A
Unchained, Huntsman, Iron Breaker, Zealot, Shade, GN

B
Footnight, WayStalker, Bounty Hunter, Outcast Engi, slayer

Sad
Pyromancer


Problem with tierlist is that its bad, imo you can't create universal tierlist. Specialists are penalized (like BH or GN (lack of ranged potential can't be ignored, yes he is one of the best supports and you can't go wrong with taking him, but he loses to many points when it comes to dealing with specials)) while generalists are elevated (like WHC).

Well coordinated team should use specialists, who are, according to this tierlist, worse, but they are just amazing at what they are doing. Example is BH, who is just amazing at dealing with any kind of monsters.


Another problem with such a tierlist is lack of skill lvl information, tierlists made for bad players will be different than tierlists made for great players, perfect example of such thing is WayStakler and Huntsman.
For weak player WS will be S tier, while Huntsman will be F tier, the better you are at scoring ranged headshots the higher will be a value of huntsmanmissions without taking any additional ammo talents/enchant and use his ability during hordes to refresh ammo, making him even A tier, if at least 50% of your shots are headshots (at this value you can safely run , while elf will drop to A tier... and the better you are at avoiding dmg with ranged weapon equipped, the further will elf drop, reaching B tier.

[Calculus]

Originally posted by Malthar:

Originally posted by puzzlefox:

The class being played hardly matters, really. Even the "worst" class in the hands of a good player can carry a team. I'll just go ahead and set the record straight here.

S class
Exceptional player

A class
Competent player

B class
Player who is improving and willing to learn

Sad class
Players who actually care about green circles, trail off on their own, are toxic

I understand where you're coming from. Though I have to point out that in scenarios like this, where we're comparing the classes, you have to exclude player skill and take them at face value.

It's impossible to create fair tierlist without any impact from skill lvl, you have to choose skill lvl we are discussing otherwise you can't evaluate impact. WHC in hands of someone who cant score headshots will be weak, while zealot will be much stronger, you will create some assumptions naturally and you can;t avoid them

[Calculus]

Originally posted by cstkl1:

its like a drunk dude started this thread must be pcgamer fan.

GK doesnt belong in class A.
class A = can handle everything

GK will die to 3 skave shield+armoured skaven +monk which is common

irombreaker same reasoning. and a tier down to C

partyknife has a excellent video on tier.

zealot also C, bounty stronger.

huntsman and bounty clearly class B

He can oneshot such group with his abiliy if you are using cleave and if you are using double strike you can easily kill 2 skavenshields allowing yourself to easily deal with the monk and stormvermin. His actual weakness that makes him drop down to B tier is lack of ranged weapon, making you unable to help teammate from range or sniping special before he can threaten you.

[Yuuki]

You guys are funny. Saying tierlist aint important but make one for yourselves anyways.

[Malthar]

Originally posted by Calculus:

Originally posted by Malthar:

I understand where you're coming from. Though I have to point out that in scenarios like this, where we're comparing the classes, you have to exclude player skill and take them at face value.

It's impossible to create fair tierlist without any impact from skill lvl, you have to choose skill lvl we are discussing otherwise you can't evaluate impact. WHC in hands of someone who cant score headshots will be weak, while zealot will be much stronger, you will create some assumptions naturally and you can;t avoid them

in that case assume the skill in question is that of the highest tier, the point is you need to minimize variables to get objective results

[Madjar]

Pyromancer at sad tier? Sounds like the ratties aren't the only thing in need of burning darlings.
Seem a lot of anti pyro in this thread.
As a pyro main I'll say this.
Pyro is a class for the unhinged. It's a ranged class that's better on the frontline. It can kill ♥♥♥♥ very well with a little know how and some luck

[Calculus]

Originally posted by Malthar:

Originally posted by Calculus:

It's impossible to create fair tierlist without any impact from skill lvl, you have to choose skill lvl we are discussing otherwise you can't evaluate impact. WHC in hands of someone who cant score headshots will be weak, while zealot will be much stronger, you will create some assumptions naturally and you can;t avoid them

in that case assume the skill in question is that of the highest tier, the point is you need to minimize variables to get objective results

Terrible idea, if you assume the highest possible lvl then you would also would have to assume making no mistakes making any part of character's kit that shines in bad situations worthless.
Example? If you assume that all 4 players play perfectly then HM would be terrible because the reason why she is so good is stamina recovery, which is not that important in perfect scenario and quick revives, which is also not important, since no one will go down.
It's not the case, when looking at the top 1% players you still consider that they can go down, they can get themselfes in nasty situations etc.

[These stairs go up!]

Pyros crit melee build is godly. The rest of her is pretty bad.