Lack of in-game information extremely annoying

[Gernhart.Reinlunzen]

I have currently played each class at least to level 12. While I really do like the game I found myself getting constantly annoyed by missing or outright wrong information. I went over the talent trees and made up a list of stuff with missing info and things I didn't understand completely forcing me to look for answers in external sources.

There is also no consistency. Sometimes you only get "X is increased", in other cases it's "X is increased by 5%". I really hope this gets better in future patches. Until then here's my personal showcase of "don't understand dongliz". Feel free to comment.

Bardin Goreksson

Ranger Veteran

Base skills

Disengage - Bardin deploys a smoke bomb that conceals him from enemies whilst he stays inside the cloud.

- description doesn't state the duration (I think it's 10 seconds)
- a very important thing is completely missing: you get a damage bonus while inside the cloud but only for your ranged weaponry

Loaded for Battle - Increased ammo capacity

- how much? You have to test manually (it's 50%)

Fast Hands - Increased reload speed

- how much?

Level 10

Curl Up - While grabbed or pounced all damage taken is reduced by 50%

- some similar talents are stating "while disabled". Is that the same thing or is Bardin's talent weaker because only two variants of being disabled are mentioned?

Level 15

Grungni's Cunning - Increases ammunition restored by Bardin's Survivalist ammunition pickups

- how much is the increase?

Level 20 (same for all classes)

Crits/Kills grant temporary health

- how much? Probably 1 HP per crit/kill but wouldn't hurt to know for sure

When bosses die, gain health

- how much health? Percentage or static amount?

Level 25

Catch a Breath - Bardin recovers 20 health when activating Disengage

- it is only temporary health. From my understanding some skills that gave green health were changed to temp health with the full release leaving the descriptions unchanged.


Iron Breaker

Base skills

Dwarf-Forged - Reduced damage taken

- how much?

Doughty - increased stamina

- while the number is missing you can see that you get one more shield than your weapon provides. Regarding Stamina I want to add that I don't understand why a weapon with 3 stamina provides 3 shields but if you get stamina as an equipment attribute it only counts half (2 stamina = 1 shield)

Resilient - Increased stun resistance
- without that talent I wouldn't even know there's something like stun resistance. What is
the base value? What is Bardin's value?

Level 25

Booming Taunt - Impenetrable taunt radius is increased to 15
- If I hold the F-key I can see the taunt circle around me but what's the base value? 10?


Slayer

Base skills

Trophy Hunter - Stacking damage buff on hitting an enemy

- Huh? What does one stack do and how many stack can I have?

Leap - Bardin leaps forward to stun a target, and gains a brief burst of attack speed

- how long is "brief"? How much attack speed do I get?

Path of Carnage - Increased attack speed

- guess

Level 10

Oblivious to Pain - Damage taken from one attack is reduced to 15 damage or half its original value whichever is highest.

- While the text itself is ok the game nowhere states your character's actual hit points. So you don't really know how much is 15 damage? From what I read you can either have 100/125/150 base hp depending on your class.

Stunty Saviour - Increases movement speed by 5% when Bardin is the last hero standing.

- There's nothing wrong with the description. But this so called "talent" really shows how
much love the talent trees need in the future.

Crippling Wounds - Critical hits cause enemies to take increased damage

- how much is the increase? How long do they take more damage? Only from me or the whole team?

Level 15

Unstoppable! - Increases the duration of the buffs gained from Trophy Hunter

- don't know base duration, don't know increase in duration, don't know dongliz

Moving Target - Trophy Hunter also increases defence with every buff stack

- how much?

Adrenaline Surge - On max stacks, Trophy Hunter grants cooldown reduction for Leap

- how much?

Level 25

Crunch! - Increases the stagger effet when landing near enemies with Leap

- how is it increased? The skill text of leap says it stuns a target. Is this the same?

Unstoppable - Attacks are uninterruptible after using Leap

- for how long? Side note: Slayer has two skills called Unstoppable.

No Escape - After Leap Bardin also increases movement speed by 25%

- for how long? "Briefly"?

Markus Kruber

Mercenary

Base skills

Morale boost - Markus grants nearby allies temporary health, and staggers nearby enemies

- how much health?

Hitting the Sweet Spot - Attacks cleave through more enemies

- through how many more?

No More Laughin' Now! - Increased crit chance

- how much?

Level 25

Inspirational - Increases the temporary health gained from Morale Boost

- how much?

Huntsman

Base skills

Hunter's Prowl - Markus disappears from sight for a brief period allowing him to ambush foes.

- As with Bardin's Ranger career skill this also increases your ranged damage. How much?

Poacher's Mark - Double effective range for ranged weapons

- the issue's not with the text but I miss any info regarding the effective range of weapons

Call Out Weakness - Critical strike chance aura

- what range? How much crit chance?

Level 10

Make 'Em Bleed - Critical hits cause enemies to take increased damage

- how much is the increase? How long do they take more damage? Only from me or the whole team?

Level 25

Hunter's Respite - Markus recovers 4 health every second while under the effect of Hunter's Prowl

- again it's only temporary health


Foot Knight

Base skills

Protective Presence - Damage resistance aura

- what's the resistance value?

No Guts, No Glory - Reduced Damage taken

- same as above

Kerillian

Waystalker

Base skills

Amaranthe - Kerillian regenerates health over time when below half health

- how fast is the regeneration?

Arrow-storm - Increased ammo capacity

- how much?

Waywatcher's Bow - Double effective range for ranged weapons

- same as Huntsman Kruber's talent

Level 10

Isha's Embrace - Increases Kerillians health regenaration.

- by what amount?

Level 25

Lifebloom Arrows - Using Trueshot Volley recovers 20 temporary health.

- the wording is different from the level 20 talents ("grants temporary health"). So do I just get 20 temporary health or do I change white health into green health?


Handmaiden

Base skills

Dance of Seasons - Increased dodge distance

- how much?

Dash - Kerillian dashes forward through enemies. Hitting enemies with this ability causes them to bleed.

- the level 25 talent Bladedancer implies that the skill is also stunning enemies.

Renewal - Stamina regeneration aura

- how much faster is the regeneration?


Shade

Base skills

Infiltration - Kerillian becomes undetectable an can pass through enemies. Lasts for 10 seconds, or until she attacks.

- missing: melee damage is also increased when attacking out of stealth

Level 15

Mistress of Sacrifice - Increased angle for triggering backstabs

- what is the base angle to begin with and how much does it increase?

Victor Saltzpyre

Witch Hunter Captain

Base skills

Witch-Hunt - Tagged enemies take additional damage

- how much?

Animosity - Victor pushes back nearby enemies, and boosts nearby allies' critical hit chance for 6 seconds

- how much crit chance do we get?

Level 10

Deathknell - Increases headshot damage bonus

- how much?

Level 15

Justice's Bounty - Witch-Hunt recovers 2 health for the party when taggable enemies die.

- it's only temporary health which makes the talent quite useless


Bounty Hunter

Base skills

Locked and Loaded - VIctor fires a powerful shot that pierces enemies.

- It's not only a single shot (which is important because initially I thought the talent Double-shotted made the career skill twice as powerful). I only noticed it when I looked at the level 25 talents which are modifing the sidearm. The normal behaviour is that Victor fires a piercing shot plus some additional buckshot. The sidearm is a big pistol with two barrels. You can actually see it when holding F.

Unmodified: 1 piercing bullet + some buckshot
Variant 1: 2 piercing bullets
Variant 2: only buckshot

Ammo Pouches - Increased ammo capacity

- how much? You have to test manually (it's 50%)

Fast Hands - Increased reload speed

- how much?


Zealot

Base skills

Faith - Power increases by 5% for every 25 health missing to a maximum bonus of 20%

- how much health does the Zealot have?

Heart of Iron - Resist death on taking lethal damage

- you don't resist death, you resist getting knocked down when out of health. Then a cooldown starts before this can happen again. How long is the cooldown?

Level 25

Pleasure from Pain - Holy Fervour causes Victor to restore 2 health for each successful hit.

- only temporary health

Sienna Fuegonasus

Battle Wizard

Base skills

Tranquility - Avoiding damage and not casting spells for 8 seconds automatically ventilates overcharge.

- what does it really mean? Overcharge doesn't just disappear. It goes down faster but how much?

Reckless Haste - Overcharge increases spell charge speed

- how much?

Pyromantic Surge - Increased ranged damage

- how much?

Level 15

Centered - Increases the effect of Tranquility

- how much?

Level 25

Lava Walker - Fire Walk trail lingers for 10 seconds

- what's the base value?


Pyromancer

Base skills

Critical Mass - Increases critical strike chance based on Overcharge level

- how much? How many overcharge levels exist?

Searing Focus - Increases ranged damage

- how much?

Level 15

All three talents do something per 8 overcharge and up to 5 stacks. How much overcharge can you generate? If you test it you will see that the fifth stack appears the moment you hit the red skull. So the max overcharge seems to be 40. It also means that you can only utilize 4 stacks.


Unchained

Base skills

Slave to Aqshy - No Overcharge Slowdown

- Initially I had no idea what that meant. High (red) overcharge slows down your movement and attack speed. I actually didn't notice it at first while playing with the other Sienna classes.

Unstable Strength - Increased melee power on high Overcharge

- how much?

Blazing Sinews - Reduced block cost on high Overcharge, consumes Overcharge

- how much reduction in block cost? How much overcharge is consumed?

Level 15

Dissipate - Reduces damage taken from venting Overcharge by 25%

- Text is ok but again I didn't know that you can get rid of overcharge by holding your staff and pressing R until I read this skill description.

Level 25

Blazing Crescendo - Increases the explosion damage of Living Bomb

- how much?

[htluvinz]

Publicado originalmente por bpais008:

Publicado originalmente por Cao:

This Thread is going to help improving the game.

- how much?

5%, followed by a swift reduction to 2%, then an unknown value with a vague description of "impoved".

+1

[Sir Duckyweather]

They could've had an April 1st update which changed all numbers on the training dummies, inventory and talents pages to be question marks instead and it would've been the same information provided for the most part. Probably would've angered a lot of people by spending that much effort to mock us, however.

[Moffin Bovin]

Publicado originalmente por Gorwe:

So, during the beta the numbers were visible?

The UI has always been garbage and lacking in information.

Publicado originalmente por Gorwe:

They are withholding information, 110%. Otherwise, why would they bother to change the tooltip, but not include the heal amount(%)? It's clear they are obfuscating it on purpose.

I doubt it's anything sinister. It's more likely that it's just incompetence and a lack of caring. They don't see having a decent UI as important. If they did then they would actually put some effort into it. As it is, the devs have bigger fish to fry when it comes to making game improvements, so it is unlikely that the UI will ever improve.

[pavichokche]

Absolutely agree! This has been bugging me ever since I bought the game, but now I keep learning things and it gets me more and more annoyed. This is no longer weird and straight up unprofessional. Active hero abilities that do way more than they say. What kind of game does that?!?

[Love Gun]

I can only second the sentiment of the OP.
Kudos to you, Tymbuctoo, for all the effort and time you put into this post to adress every(? ; haven't read it all) talent/skill/passive ability, though it certainly would not have been needed to go that in-depth to get the point across.

Publicado originalmente por ̀͠͏̡FennecFox̖̲͕ ✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ:

They used to state the numbers like how many % increase in talents. That was during the beta. But the more knowledge they shared, the more people complained and flamed about it all over the forums, whining about too low or too high etc.
So come release they completely removed all numbers and went dark on as much information as they can. It worked to stop the tide of trolls and forum lurkers.

For real? I can only hope this is not true.
Ah well, be that as it may. We need that info back ASAP.

[Kumori^]

Publicado originalmente por Love Gun:

I can only second the sentiment of the OP.
Kudos to you, Tymbuctoo, for all the effort and time you put into this post to adress every(? ; haven't read it all) talent/skill/passive ability, though it certainly would not have been needed to go that in-depth to get the point across.

Publicado originalmente por ̀͠͏̡FennecFox̖̲͕ ✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ:

They used to state the numbers like how many % increase in talents. That was during the beta. But the more knowledge they shared, the more people complained and flamed about it all over the forums, whining about too low or too high etc.
So come release they completely removed all numbers and went dark on as much information as they can. It worked to stop the tide of trolls and forum lurkers.

For real? I can only hope this is not true.
Ah well, be that as it may. We need that info back ASAP.

It's a damned if you, damned if you don't dilemma for developers. Sad but true.

[Enfild]

They are notorious for hiding important information from us. But what is worse is that information they give is misleading, like those test dummies, or weapon stats in first game.

Forget about it, they will never give us information. Luckyly they are not against people digging information by themselves, and if they do decent mod support for this game, we will get all information we need.
It is really sad that we have to dig ourselves for information, but this is how things are.

[AldrickExGladius™]

Publicado originalmente por ̀͠͏̡FennecFox̖̲͕ ✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ:

They used to state the numbers like how many % increase in talents. That was during the beta. But the more knowledge they shared, the more people complained and flamed about it all over the forums, whining about too low or too high etc.
So come release they completely removed all numbers and went dark on as much information as they can. It worked to stop the tide of trolls and forum lurkers.

and it was a beautiful idea.

[AldrickExGladius™]

Publicado originalmente por Enfild:

They are notorious for hiding important information from us. But what is worse is that information they give is misleading, like those test dummies, or weapon stats in first game.

Forget about it, they will never give us information. Luckyly they are not against people digging information by themselves, and if they do decent mod support for this game, we will get all information we need.
It is really sad that we have to dig ourselves for information, but this is how things are.

im sorry someone cant be around the whole time to hold your hand

[No gf]

I don't think it matters much because half of the skills still wouldn't work if you're not the host.

[Possiblex]

Ranger Bardin's active also gives Bardin armor penetration for his ranged weapon. You can add that one too OP.

[Xavathos]

Science demands numbers! Numbers, I tell you!

[Moffin Bovin]

Publicado originalmente por AldrickExGladius:

Publicado originalmente por Enfild:

They are notorious for hiding important information from us. But what is worse is that information they give is misleading, like those test dummies, or weapon stats in first game.

Forget about it, they will never give us information. Luckyly they are not against people digging information by themselves, and if they do decent mod support for this game, we will get all information we need.
It is really sad that we have to dig ourselves for information, but this is how things are.

im sorry someone cant be around the whole time to hold your hand

Basic information isnt "hand holding" you dumbass.

things like how much hp an Iron Breaker has compared to Ranger, or how much damage a weapon actually does, what your base crit chance is or what "increases the effect of tranquility" actually means (ie. by how much?) are all just "basic information". You shouldn't have to scour the interenet to find out.

People get annoyed when they spend more time using Google than playing the game, because they paid their money to play and enjoy a game, not sit around searching for answers and trying to find the facts amoungst the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

The UI is trash and it's not good enough. If fanboys woudl stop sucking Fatshark's ♥♥♥♥♥ and actually call them out when they do something ♥♥♥♥ then they might actually learn and do better in the future.

[DikiyBraz]

Dont bother, he is just a little troll.

[pavichokche]

Publicado originalmente por Kumori^:

Publicado originalmente por Love Gun:

I can only second the sentiment of the OP.
Kudos to you, Tymbuctoo, for all the effort and time you put into this post to adress every(? ; haven't read it all) talent/skill/passive ability, though it certainly would not have been needed to go that in-depth to get the point across.


For real? I can only hope this is not true.
Ah well, be that as it may. We need that info back ASAP.

It's a damned if you, damned if you don't dilemma for developers. Sad but true.

There's a middleground between listing so much information that people complain, and listing a whole bunch of stats without describing what they are or how they work, and also hiding crucial skill details. Look at Payday 2 for example.