Regarding Tome and Grim locations.

[[MLM]hiduys]

To put it straight, most of us playing on champion difficulty know where all the tomes and grims are, so this isn´t about the hiding spots.

Rather i want to complain about some of the jumps that have to be done to reach them. Jumpst such as the one for the 2nd Grim in Righteos stand, The first tome in Festering grounds [Fixed that name] And it´s second Grim as well as the first grim hunger in the dark (being RNG based on barrels)


Most Grims and Tomes are perfectly well hidden without the need of unecesarely difficult jumps whilst others are (At first) well hidden but once the location is known the jump itself becomes the problem.
This shouldn´t be the case since Tomes and Grims themselves ARE supposed to be the chalange so why are some of those jumps so needlessly hard?
To a degree they make getting a grim more of a matter of luck and jumping at the perfect frame rather than the chalange of carrying it throughout a mission.

All this does is putting an artificial difficulty in front of the thing intented to GIVE us the difficulty in the first place. The only reason i personally don´t like Convocation of decay is that first tome and the second grim, yes i got either of them and did a run with 3/2. I even finished Champion maps with 3/2 and that was a reasonable and fun chalange, being forced to try the same jump for 5 minutes since it must be perfect is not fun.


Thus i want to request or rather suggest to the Dev´s that they please would look into that mater and make those jumps easier, we already found the tomes and Grims, hiding them behind jumps that requier that amount of perfection does nothing but make certain maps complettely undesirable over others.
I Preffer doing a 3/2 Run on war camp, despite it being a boss map, because i can get the tomes and grims in a reasonable amount of time without the jumps requiering some perfect frame performance.

TL;DR
Make the jumps to reach tomes and grims easier to perform. Carrying them should be the Major chalange, Not performing some insane frame perfect acrobatics and jumping at just the perfect time to manage a jump or try again or even die as a result.
Carrying them should be the chalange, not their jumps. (I don´t recall any hard jumps back in V1 for that matter)

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List of Tomes and Grimores that are problematic.

-Righteos stand 2nd Grimore jumping puzzle.
-Festering grounds, 1st Book bridge jump, 2nd Grimore jump being lethal if missed.
-Hunger in the dark 1st grim being RNG and Barrel dependant.
-Empire in Flames 2nd Grimore jumping.

[Watermelons]

Originally posted by Streven:

Hugely agree with this. Can't stand many of the jumping puzzles. I would;d rather go bookless than perform the awful platforming elements.

Then go bookless. Or ask teammates if they can do it.

Complaints about jump puzzles are really stupid, because the level designers placed them where they were in clever spots that encourage you to explore creatively when you're first finding them.
git gud and all that

[[MLM]hiduys]

Originally posted by Viele Wassermelonen:

Originally posted by Streven:

Hugely agree with this. Can't stand many of the jumping puzzles. I would;d rather go bookless than perform the awful platforming elements.

Then go bookless. Or ask teammates if they can do it.

Complaints about jump puzzles are really stupid, because the level designers placed them where they were in clever spots that encourage you to explore creatively when you're first finding them.
git gud and all that

Ok, so acording to you it´s a chalange when you first find them, great already done that.

Now just grabbing them every time, as i do already know where they are, why should that be a huge chalange when carrying the books and grims themselves already IS the chalange.

There are no comparable difficult jumps in V1, all jumps where, once discovered, not much of a chalange behoynd needing to be found in the first place.
So why increase the difficulty of obtaining them when carrying them is the supposed chalange?

[Miri]

yall suck. im a god :P

at umping. I got ups

[Bones]

First tome on Convocation is obtainable by literally jumping at the bed, how is that hard to get? The second grim isn't hard to get either but the appearance of the rock you have to jump on matches up poorly with collision which is a bit of an annoyance. Pretty sure the only book in the game that I would change is the first tome on Festering Ground because cheesing it is the only way it's obtained anymore.

Originally posted by MLMhiduys:

There are no comparable difficult jumps in V1, all jumps where, once discovered, not much of a chalange behoynd needing to be found in the first place.

Second grim on Cursed Rune. Not only is it fairly difficult to get 100% of the time, it's extremely punishing when you miss it.

[[MLM]hiduys]

Originally posted by Bones:

First tome on Convocation is obtainable by literally jumping at the bed, how is that hard to get? The second grim isn't hard to get either but the appearance of the rock you have to jump on matches up poorly with collision which is a bit of an annoyance. Pretty sure the only book in the game that I would change is the first tome on Festering Ground because cheesing it is the only way it's obtained anymore.

Originally posted by MLMhiduys:

There are no comparable difficult jumps in V1, all jumps where, once discovered, not much of a chalange behoynd needing to be found in the first place.

Second grim on Cursed Rune. Not only is it fairly difficult to get 100% of the time, it's extremely punishing when you miss it.

I mixed up convocation of decay and the mission where you have to take care of the monolith. As in, i ment the jump across the gap to get the first time before having the drop down to the first grim in the locked chest.

[v0itech]

Originally posted by MLMhiduys:

The first tome in the convocation of decay

Jumping for this Tome is unnecesary. You can just look up and pick it up.

[[MLM]hiduys]

Originally posted by v0itech:

Originally posted by MLMhiduys:

The first tome in the convocation of decay

Jumping for this Tome is unnecesary. You can just look up and pick it up.

I did mention in my last post i mixed the levels up, i shall rectify this momentarely.

[Sharkfin]

Want to add that in Hunger in the Dark, most of the time only host could put the barrel at the "right" spot.

[HypetheKomodo]

Empire in Flames second grim

The nightmare of precision jumping for 10 minutes

[[MLM]hiduys]

Originally posted by Flustered:

Empire in Flames second grim

The nightmare of precision jumping for 10 minutes

I shall make a list in the OP containing all terrible jumps to be honest, lets sort through them and make a fine list, that means ya´ll can actually help if you feel like it.

[Sharkfin]

And for Righteos Stand 2nd grim, once a hunter caught the only guy who managed to reach the grim. As our auto-aim skills are still in CD we failed to save him in time, tried to jump to him but all failed. He finally bleeded out and lost the grim. This is stupid. The ladder should be slided down to the bottom for others to climb up.

[[MLM]hiduys]

If you all have an idea how to fix the Locations feel free to post them, depending on the popularity we could get some changes implemented if we´re Lucky.

Some Suggestions for those i already put in the list.

-Righteos stand, place a lever where the jumping puzzle would lead you (on the side of the building you have to jump) and make it able to be triggered by shot. Lowers a ladder to the grim (since there is a crate of ammo spawning closebye that won´t be a problem)

-Festering grounds, Place a few plans that act as a world object similar to barrels, carry them to the first tome and make a makeshift bridge, planks spawn in the same location.
2nd grim, a rope lader that must be activated from above via a hidden switch and then can be safely climbed.

-Empire in flames 2nd grimore, in the same building on the upper floor, make the corpse a hackable object, if cut loose the window springs open allowing the grimore to be grabed from inside of the building.

-Hunger in the dark, Make it like against the grain and guarantee a Barrel to spawn at a safe location closeby.

[Bones]

Originally posted by Flustered:

Empire in Flames second grim

The nightmare of precision jumping for 10 minutes

I seriously don't see the issue with this one, I typically get it on the second or third try. People usually fail the jump to the light post and getting back to that point takes seconds.

[Blurgel]

Can you just give me everything in the game once I install it. Vermintide community in a nutshell

[Sharkfin]

Originally posted by MLMhiduys:

If you all have an idea how to fix the Locations feel free to post them, depending on the popularity we could get some changes implemented if we´re Lucky.

Yea. I don't mind the jumping part before pulling the lever for Righteos Stand 2nd Grim. But I suggest that the ladder should be dropped to the bottom so other's could reach the grim too. Ideally a squishy character managed to pull the lever, and a tanky character who failed to jump could climb up and take the grim.