Moving around

[Novo3d]

Hello Croteam,
So, went nuts and tried the locomotion system, since this is how I want to be able to move around in VR (no teleport stuff, please). I felt there was a few problems that made me nauseus after 20 mins of game, and even if I'm a nobody, I still wanted to add my two cents.

1) The speed. Sam is not running here, he's flying ! In VR, we get a more realistic sense of scale since we are "in", and not in front of a computer. So distances, and their perception, become a great factor of immersion. One of the things that poked my brain not in a good way was the speed Sam was running at. You should really cut the speed down to 50%, that would help. Honestly, I would not mind walking, because my brain could then focus on "where I am in this space" and "next target please !".

2) The trackpad. Just touching it wasn't a good idea IMHO, because either the thumb was at the right place and Sam was moving (but not always at the right direction), either he stopped. I think it could help it we had to actually press the trackpad for the running to start.

3) Binary movement. Either you run, either you stop. That's brutal in VR. Is there a way to smooth things a little please ?

4) Rotating. Having ennemies popping in my back was not really enjoyable because you already have to turn to face the new corridors, then turn again... but what about the Vive's cables ? Getting them around my legs wasn't very comfy, if I may say so. Plus that's a lot of turning left, turning right... I was kinda lost sometimes.

Maybe you should look at the Google Earth VR way of moving and rotating in the virtual environment. Using the left side button to jump, and the right left button to turn ? Or a flick of the "motion controller" to a direction to actually rotate towards this controller ? I would not mind to have a setup like "left controller, weapons" and "right controller, moving and use".

Anyway, those critics are no way hostile, I'm an enthousiastic VR user and I'm happy to see full games coming in. :)

Good luck guys !

[Dolphin]

Originalmente postado por Novo3d:

Hello Croteam,
So, went nuts and tried the locomotion system, since this is how I want to be able to move around in VR (no teleport stuff, please). I felt there was a few problems that made me nauseus after 20 mins of game, and even if I'm a nobody, I still wanted to add my two cents.

1) The speed. Sam is not running here, he's flying ! In VR, we get a more realistic sense of scale since we are "in", and not in front of a computer. So distances, and their perception, become a great factor of immersion. One of the things that poked my brain not in a good way was the speed Sam was running at. You should really cut the speed down to 50%, that would help. Honestly, I would not mind walking, because my brain could then focus on "where I am in this space" and "next target please !".

2) The trackpad. Just touching it wasn't a good idea IMHO, because either the thumb was at the right place and Sam was moving (but not always at the right direction), either he stopped. I think it could help it we had to actually press the trackpad for the running to start.

3) Binary movement. Either you run, either you stop. That's brutal in VR. Is there a way to smooth things a little please ?

4) Rotating. Having ennemies popping in my back was not really enjoyable because you already have to turn to face the new corridors, then turn again... but what about the Vive's cables ? Getting them around my legs wasn't very comfy, if I may say so. Plus that's a lot of turning left, turning right... I was kinda lost sometimes.

Maybe you should look at the Google Earth VR way of moving and rotating in the virtual environment. Using the left side button to jump, and the right left button to turn ? Or a flick of the "motion controller" to a direction to actually rotate towards this controller ? I would not mind to have a setup like "left controller, weapons" and "right controller, moving and use".

Anyway, those critics are no way hostile, I'm an enthousiastic VR user and I'm happy to see full games coming in. :)

Good luck guys !

In Motion Sickness Options, you can choose your own speed variable. I have set it to Medium, it feels much better to me that way and less "floaty"

[Novo3d]

Yep, I did that, but it would push it way further.

[FSP48]

I actually love the speed and have zero motion issues but I would like the right stick to be able to also turn my view as needed so I'm not turning in so many circles twisting my cable into a coiled old school phone cord or playing as much jump rope. So nice to blaze around the environment at will.

[Asbestosis]

i would like the option to be able to turn actual direction by the right toggle instead of actually moving around is this possible?, the motion is great for me (Oculus with Touch)

[Syndroid]

Haven't played the game yet, but what OP said about binary type movement had me worrieda bit.
Can someone confirm if this is also the case with the thumbsticks on Touch controllers?

[AlenL]

Thank's for the feedback. It is appreciated, and we will try to improve all that.

Originalmente postado por Novo3d:

1) The speed. Sam is not running here, he's flying ! In VR, we get a more realistic sense of scale since we are "in", and not in front of a computer. So distances, and their perception, become a great factor of immersion. One of the things that poked my brain not in a good way was the speed Sam was running at. You should really cut the speed down to 50%, that would help. Honestly, I would not mind walking, because my brain could then focus on "where I am in this space" and "next target please !".

There's an option in the Options>Motion Sickness to control player speed. Does that help?

2) The trackpad. Just touching it wasn't a good idea IMHO, because either the thumb was at the right place and Sam was moving (but not always at the right direction), either he stopped. I think it could help it we had to actually press the trackpad for the running to start.

Actually, we have both that. What you suggest is what was the default originally, but during alpha testing some very experienced VR players complained that other games have it on touch, so that's the default now. To change that, paste this into the console (press F1 to invoke it):

vr_bTrackpadClickToMove = 1

3) Binary movement. Either you run, either you stop. That's brutal in VR. Is there a way to smooth things a little please ?

Yes, I know. It was supposed to be analog, but something is bugged. Tried to fix it last minute yesterday, but it's a little bit more involved. Hope to have a fix for it this week.

4) Rotating. Having ennemies popping in my back was not really enjoyable because you already have to turn to face the new corridors, then turn again... but what about the Vive's cables ? Getting them around my legs wasn't very comfy, if I may say so. Plus that's a lot of turning left, turning right... I was kinda lost sometimes.

Yes, that option will also be added, hopefully this week.

Anyway, those critics are no way hostile, I'm an enthousiastic VR user and I'm happy to see full games coming in. :)

It's absolutely ok. That's what EA is for. :)

[smoils]

Originalmente postado por Novo3d:

Getting them around my legs wasn't very comfy, if I may say so. Plus that's a lot of turning left, turning right... I was kinda lost sometimes.

Offtopic, but you should really get steamvr advanced settings tool from github, it has a ton of useful stuff and turn counter is among them.

[Mane Vr]

the speed should be an option i for one love the speed as is my only issue is the lack of being able to use the thumbstick to turn

[TasteTheRambo]

I don't like that the trackpad emulates WASD inputs rather than have 1-to-1(?) movement. Very difficult for me to get around this way.
I sure they will probably change this at some point(soon please :)?).

[Ralith]

Originalmente postado por Killer Kadoogan:

I don't like that the trackpad emulates WASD inputs rather than have 1-to-1(?) movement. Very difficult for me to get around this way.
I sure they will probably change this at some point(soon please :)?).

Is that what's going on? The steering feels a little funny to me too but I haven't worked out why; my guess was that the controller pitch and roll were influencing things weirdly.

[halifax]

Thank you so much Croteam for making a VR game with real movement.

TEMP LIMIT THE FIELD OF VIEW WHEN GAMEPAD/KB MOVING, LIKE GOOGLE EARTH VR DOES???

Or at least add that as a VR move option? :-) That actually I found works fairly well for limiting your VR sickness for out-of-synch VR vs RL movement.

Again, thank you so much Croteam for making a VR game with real movement, I will be buying this now!!!! Teleport and stand-in-place sucks - I've tried hard to get into them - bought several VR titles that use it - it just sucks for action games, man. There's no way around it. At least, compared to actually moving around in the game world, it sucks.

[Bullseye]

Thank you for including so many movement options. I find that I like a mix of smooth moving and teleporting. For long corridors and outside smooth movement works great. While indoors I like to teleport. You can almost do this by using short presses for movement. Maybe something like one hand teleport and the other smooth movement? Or an option to double tap and hold to smooth move and a single tap to teleport? Thanks again for all of your work on this game!

[AlenL]

Originalmente postado por Killer Kadoogan:

I don't like that the trackpad emulates WASD inputs rather than have 1-to-1(?) movement. Very difficult for me to get around this way.
I sure they will probably change this at some point(soon please :)?).

Addressed under #3 above.

[Novo3d]

@ AlenL : Thank you very much for your reply. Yes, I tried to slow down the running speed, but when I meant 50%, I meant "50% of the "slow" speed". Actually, my second and third attempts were a tad better, so I guess a part of the job is left to the player's brain to adapt; But it would be cool to have a "walking" speed and to be able to go up in speed as you get used to it. Don't be afraid to make it slower, this is how we solved it in our serious games, with a very slow walking speed.

As for the trackpad, well, apparently I'm not the only one and you said this will be fixed, so I consider this done. Box ticked ! ;)

Two remaining issues : It's very hard to walk in one direction, and fight the ennemies that pop up behind you - but maybe it's just up to the gamer to solve this, so I'll just leave this here. What are everyone thinking about this ?

And last, the ennemies seems to be standing sometimes ? Like the IA doesn't see me, so the ennemy isn't moving at all, and can be shot before it can make a move. Have you seen this before ?

Thank you Croteam for being reactive, it's much appreciated !

@ Smoils : Thank you for the pointer ! I'll look into that. :)

[AlenL]

When we implement analog movement, walking will be easier and more natural. If that's not enough then, let me know.