issues with vipers

[KaidenOZ]

Ok so i have been having vipers who are set to defend a ship retask themselves into an attack posture are really annyoying times.

example. i have 4 adaments, they all have there single viper groups deployed on defencive, enemy nemisis comes in for a pass and all the vipers auto engage the nemisis allowing the 4 incoming volleys of missiles through.

I could understand if the vipers assigned to the ship that is under attack going offencive but every viper in the area ignoring their orders is bloody annoying. i would shoot starbuck in the face if she pulled this♥♥♥♥♥♥

is there a way to make a defencive postured viper group stay on there job of defending the ship assigned instead of just running off at the first thing that comes in range?

the worst part is it seems they always tend to ignore their orders just as the enemy fleet alphas your fleet with a missile strike.

[ramjbjb]

Hmmmmmmm not sure but...Vipers don't do anything against incoming missiles, right?.

Then what do you expect from a defensive order?. An enemy got close by and began firing on the ship they were defending, they resorted to attack it. Seems like a logical thing to do if you ask me.

If you're looking for antimissile protection, the swarms are the answer. Lay chaff clouds in front of your ships and enemy missiles will blow up nicely against it.

[Muzzleflash]

Vipers shoot down enemy missiles attacking their defend targets. Just had to defend a freighter and I put 3 Viper squadrons to defend it. Enemy launched missiles, and they got taken out. Otherwise the freighter would be gone.

A bit frustrating though that launching Vipers don't put them on defend of their launching vehicle by default. Instead they seem to be defending themselves.

[KaidenOZ]

vipers defending a ship will intercept enemy missiles inbound on the ship they are defending. fives ships without PDS a decent chance to survive.

i have 4 ships with 1 wing each on defencive. 1 ship gets shot, all the vipers lose their mind and go after if even though the other 3 ships have not been engaged.

scenario 2 is enemy fleet volleys missiles on one of my ships. i task all my vipers to defend it, instead they run off to attack ignoring my defend order.

[ramjbjb]

Wow - must've missed that in the manual. Nice to know that Vipers can be used that way too :).

[Shards]

They do defend their carrier by default, but they'll actively engage enemy ships that are a clear and present threat to that ship too.

[:WTF: Grendel]

Originally posted by Shards:

They do defend their carrier by default, but they'll actively engage enemy ships that are a clear and present threat to that ship too.

^^^ and you'll notice once that threat has been eliminated, they go back to their defensive orders.

[h3rbertwest]

Originally posted by Shards:

They do defend their carrier by default, but they'll actively engage enemy ships that are a clear and present threat to that ship too.

In this case, it might benefit to add a conditional mission, like "defend target from:
a, attack squadrons
b, missiles
c, ships
d, any combination of the above"
Perhaps add a stance modifier to squadrons as well, where attack-focused squadrons will actively seek out dangers to their carrier (or assigned defence ship), while defense-focused squadrons hover close to their carrier and shoot at incoming radiers/missiles

[Shards]

Originally posted by h3rbertwest:

Originally posted by Shards:

Perhaps add a stance modifier to squadrons as well, where attack-focused squadrons will actively seek out dangers to their carrier (or assigned defence ship), while defense-focused squadrons hover close to their carrier and shoot at incoming radiers/missiles

Interesting idea!

[KaidenOZ]

i guess i have issues with their threat prioritizatoin then, attack that corvette that has 1 weapon or attack the 30 missiles...they go after the single gun corvette every time

[Jackrabbit_V6/ RSProduxx]

Originally posted by h3rbertwest:

Originally posted by Shards:

They do defend their carrier by default, but they'll actively engage enemy ships that are a clear and present threat to that ship too.

In this case, it might benefit to add a conditional mission, like "defend target from:
a, attack squadrons
b, missiles
c, ships
d, any combination of the above"
Perhaps add a stance modifier to squadrons as well, where attack-focused squadrons will actively seek out dangers to their carrier (or assigned defence ship), while defense-focused squadrons hover close to their carrier and shoot at incoming radiers/missiles

sounds good to me. I mean, you can assign specific target types to the cannons of Deidalos... should be possible for squadrons, too :)

[Omegabigb]

I have noticed that vipers will often switch to an attack order if you don't specifically order them to defend a ship, ie; of you launch vipers it will look like they have a defence order on there carrier but it doesn't seem to actually be a defence order.
Unless you actually give a squad an order after launching it looks like it will just do whatever it thinks best.

[Steven]

Originally posted by Shards:

They do defend their carrier by default, but they'll actively engage enemy ships that are a clear and present threat to that ship too.

Simple fix is to keep the ship your defending at enough distance to any enemy cap ship and they will always defend your ship. They won't shoot down all the torps though, there too fast and numerous.

I think a priority system might be a better choice, if put on defense they go for missiles first. If none are near then it's on to fighters and finally cap ships and if a missile comes into range while shooting a fighter/ship they goes straight for the missile salvo :)

Oh as a side note it would be great if the Cylon AI did fighter defense, atm it's too easy to nuke stuff (one shot, sometimes two).

[Black Lab Games]

We originally had the fighters auto-defend the capital at launch, but the feedback from the beta was the players wanted then to instantly attack instead of waiting to be given orders the next round. So the current behaviour is to launch, search for a target within range (enemy fighters are a higher priority than capitals) and if no target is found, then set to defend. The range for looking for a target is the distance they can cover in 2 rounds.

[KaidenOZ]

Originally posted by Black Lab Games:

We originally had the fighters auto-defend the capital at launch, but the feedback from the beta was the players wanted then to instantly attack instead of waiting to be given orders the next round. So the current behaviour is to launch, search for a target within range (enemy fighters are a higher priority than capitals) and if no target is found, then set to defend. The range for looking for a target is the distance they can cover in 2 rounds.

that idea seems ok, but they may also be doing that every round rather then only on launch?

in the examples i gave earlyer... in all cases the vipers had been deployed at the very start of the bettle and set to defend. so they had been set to defend for multiple turns, it was not a launch and engage situation.

[Simulacra_53]

Originally posted by Black Lab Games:

We originally had the fighters auto-defend the capital at launch, but the feedback from the beta was the players wanted then to instantly attack instead of waiting to be given orders the next round. So the current behaviour is to launch, search for a target within range (enemy fighters are a higher priority than capitals) and if no target is found, then set to defend. The range for looking for a target is the distance they can cover in 2 rounds.

Pretty good vanilla stance.
Fighters should be aggressive and independent - not drones.

If anything I'd like to see more individual dogfights, that can spread out a formation and less of a swarm.