Favorite disciplines

[Clever Name]

Per the title, share your favorite disciplines, including the 3 you'd choose for your custom clan or bloodline or caitiff.

While social disciplines can potentially create wide-ranging power structures, I favor the physical disciplines for their ability to help you survive from night to night.

With that in mind, I consider Celerity and Fortitude as absolutely necessary for survival. Which then leaves the third discipline selection. Oblivion would be a solid choice, as it, like Celerity, offers defensive as well as offensive capability. I'd also consider Protean for the same reasons.

Ultimately though, I'd choose Obfuscate. Combined with the disciplines already mentioned, it offers layer upon layer of making your character annoyingly difficult to deal with in combat.

[Clever Name]

Originalmente postado por LotRHenchman:

All overseeing Caitiff - just choose what you like - as option ;P

The problem with Caitiff is that it really does limit your development speed. An extra XP point per discipline dot doesn't sound like a lot, but it adds up.

We get 4 free discipline dots to start any character (2 in one discipline, 1 in another, and a final dot from our predator type). The best way to spend this is to put 3 dots in one discipline, 1 in another; you get the most free XP this way.

Assuming we do the above, it costs 190 XP to level up all 3 in-clan disciplines.

Doing the same with a caitiff costs 228 XP. This means you're losing out on 38 total XP, which is the equivalent of 1-2 extra dice in an important pool.

Out-of-clan disciplines are even more prohibitive, at 105 XP to max a discipline from 1-5 dots. Meaning if you wanted to add a 4th discipline, you'd need 295 XP to max them all, and you wouldn't be improving skills or anything else in all that time (likely several years of playing the same character).

[Harukage]

TBH i feel that returning back to V20 mechanics would be just better. V5 is so restrictive and plain.

[Clever Name]

Originalmente postado por Polyedra:

The Potence with Fortitude combo is what I desire the most.. Or Obeah. But Obeah doesn't exist anymore so..

You could do a Hecata, which combines Auspex and Fortitude, i.e, the same disciplines Salubri have to amalgamate their healing abilities.

You could use Obeah (which changed the name to Panacea in V5) and Valeren. Basically one heals willpower, the other heals health.

The only thing you couldn't do, is Unburdening of the Bestial Soul. Which is not something you'd use often anyway, even as a Salubri.

Futhermore, if you went with a Lamia background of Hecata, you could use Auspex, Fortitude, Oblivion, and Potence as in-clan disciplines. The simplest solution for you would be to not level up Oblivion at all, and just level the others.

As I keep reminding everyone: Hecata = best clan.

[Harukage]

Nah Hecata looks for me like a clan that lost individuality, having that many playable bloodlines with different sets of disciplines. Another bad mechanic that makes Caitiff and normal clans with out of clan disciplines look like a bad choice.

[Clever Name]

Originalmente postado por Harukage:

Nah Hecata looks for me like a clan that lost individuality, having that many playable bloodlines with different sets of disciplines. Another bad mechanic that makes Caitiff and normal clans with out of clan disciplines look like a bad choice.

The individuality they had was mostly as nearly extinct or outright extinct minor bloodlines, with exceedingly niche agendas, that wouldn't logically fit into 90% of player chronicles.

I never wanted to play any of the necromancer bloodlines in V20, including Giovanni, exactly for those reasons. By contrast, the new Hecata can specialize in necromancy, spirits, or neither, and instead take a more Lasombra approach to their Oblivion mastery.

Also, you don't get to blindly take whatever 4th discipline you want as a Hecata. You need to pay for a 4 dot merit that allows you to take the discipline that your bloodline used to focus on.

So a Giovanni Hecata gets to use Dominate, a Samedi gets Obfuscate, and a Lamia, Potence.

That's it. Just that little bit of variety is better than nothing, though.

[Clever Name]

Originalmente postado por GrandMajora:

As for the Hecata being niche and difficult to play, the same could be said for any of the Independent clans. They were called 'independent', because they largely avoided siding with any of the three big sects and instead focused on doing their own insular thing.

Unless your coterie was made up almost entirely of members from that clan, you'd have to come up with some exceptional circumstances for why you were palling around with the Camarilla / Anarchs / Sabbat.

I didn't say the Hecata were difficult to play, I said all the V20 redundant necromancer bloodlines were. Hecata are easy to play in V5 because they freelance.

Having all the old bloodlines grouped into one large independent clan/sect like Hecata, means people can pick a variety of bloodline histories (i.e, loresheets in V5), and have them all work together.

By contrast in V20, Lamia weren't even realistically playable in modern nights, since they were supposedly wiped out in the early 1700s. Neither would Cappadocians be playable. Harbinger of Skulls would be Sabbat-only. Only the Samedi were known to be freelancing for any sect, and they were rotting corpses. Yay.

So the variety was mostly illusory, unusable, or undesirable.

As I already explained, Hecata lets us pick and choose what we want and what we don't. We can pick a rotting flaw if we want, regardless of bloodline. We can pick a Samedi bloodline that doesn't rot, if we want.

[Clever Name]

Originalmente postado por GrandMajora:

The Harbingers of Skulls were Cappadocians, though. They were the clan members who got sealed in a cave because of Cappadocious' bull crap, and eventually found a way to take down the barrier.

Point is, we couldn't play 'normal' Cappadocians. We had to play the shrivel-skulled losers who were obsessed with revenge.

Now we can play regular Cappadocians again, at least.

[Clever Name]

Originalmente postado por GrandMajora:

Originalmente postado por Clever Name:

Point is, we couldn't play 'normal' Cappadocians. We had to play the shrivel-skulled losers who were obsessed with revenge.

Now we can play regular Cappadocians again, at least.

Outside of a Dark Ages campaign, though, I don't really have any interest in playing one.

And I have no interest in playing a rotting corpse!

See? Options.

In V20, I wouldn't have them.

In V5, if you don't want to play a Cappadocian, then don't. But if you do, then do.

I liked Cappadocians because they represented the more scholarly pursuit of necromancy, rather than the Giovanni interest, which is your standard greed and power-trip motive.

[Clever Name]

Originalmente postado por GrandMajora:

Not arguing that, but finding a scholarly necromancer in the modern nights seems kind of... difficult, to say the least?

Most people of this time period don't have the morbid, philosophical approach to studying death like they did back in ancient times. Or if they do have such an approach, they are extremely unhinged people, who do not belong in society.

The Hecata blurbs on who they'd likely embrace, mentions this. You're already expected to be morbid, detached, or have an odd sense of humor to begin with.

Think of every cliche you've heard or thought about morticians or people heavily into taxidermy.

[Harukage]

Oh hell, i would rather play as Ministry. A sinfull preacher. Balancing spiritual purity with all maner of vices.

[Clever Name]

Originalmente postado por GrandMajora:

Ministry would be awesome, since their clan compulsion is encouraging people to violate the tenets of Humanity.

Rebelling against morality is so... adolescent.

It's one thing to callously ignore morality, it's another to spitefully do the opposite just because it's an established nicety.

What if a given society degenerated into braindead chaos and was driven by infantile self-worship and instant gratification--you know, like large swathes of modern society is right now--what role does the Ministry play in such a culture?

I think most modern people are plenty capable of 'corrupting' themselves without outside help. A concept like the Ministry only makes sense in societies where more than a small minority of people take religion and 'traditional' morality seriously.

[Clever Name]

Originalmente postado por GrandMajora:

They're not doing it just out of spite. The Ministry believes that morality, laws and taboos are shackles that 'false gods' placed upon society in order to prevent us from achieving our true potential.

Ridding ourselves of those shackles is the first step on the road to transcendence. When we're free to pursue our desires without allowing morality and ethics to get in the way, we can become gods in our own right.

Yeah, that's why I could never stand the Ministry.

'Pursuing desires' is braindead hedonism that leads nowhere.

It's literally macaques sitting around ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ and scratching their asses. Humans are just more advanced versions of macaques. And macaques can't become gods.

[Polyedra]

It resonates with me also. I do believe in morality but I believe that we need find our own ways to free ourselves. I frown on fearing social justice, it's shackling and counterproductive to peace, which would be the ultimate goal.

[Polyedra]

And then, still, I am the jailor sometimes. Hypocritical, we call that.
I suppose there's no easy answer.
Fear's the big enemy in this. Makes us take measures we wouldn't otherwise.
And yet caution is very useful. ... no easy answer.

[Polyedra]

Would be best if we were all gods, then no one could tell another what to do or suppress, and we'd be free to speak our minds and act because no one could get hurt or suffer.