AWS and DSD on by default?

[J van E]

Is it possible (or will we ever get an option) to have AWS and DSD on by default? Isn't that how it is in real life? Maybe this can be done by editing an ini...? An ingame option for this would be nice though.

[DemocraticPrawn]

I already assume that you know that you can enable them all via fuses and switches ....... but in case you didn't know, CTRL-Enter on the keyboard will enable ALL warning systems in one go, which speeds things up.

[J van E]

Originally posted by DemocraticPrawn:

I already assume that you know that you can enable them all via fuses and switches ....... but in case you didn't know, CTRL-Enter on the keyboard will enable ALL warning systems in one go, which speeds things up.

Yes, I know otherwise I wouldn't ask if they can be on by default. ;) Pressing Ctrl-Enter isn't a big deal but if these things are on 'by default' in real life, I'd like them to be on in TSW too.

I was also asking this because when you start a service from the service list you hardly have time to set anything up (lights, AWS, etc.) but I have a seperate topic about that which in the meantime has a tip to solve that problem (although I would still prefer if Dovetail would add at least 30 seconds of time at the start of a service so you don't have to rush to get the train going first).

[-ERROR]

There already was a thread where a person enabled them and asked why train is stopping constantly. Better leave it off and have an option to enable it.

[DPSimulation]

Originally posted by Kuu Lightwing:

There already was a thread where a person enabled them and asked why train is stopping constantly. Better leave it off and have an option to enable it.

Pretty certain it was the same author of this thread. :D

Like I said in the other thread, I don't really think it is a big deal either way and as I tried to explain, after 10 years of threads entitled 'Why Does My Train Stop?' then you can see why they chose this direction.

[J van E]

Originally posted by DPSimulation:

Originally posted by Kuu Lightwing:

There already was a thread where a person enabled them and asked why train is stopping constantly. Better leave it off and have an option to enable it.

Pretty certain it was the same author of this thread. :D

Like I said in the other thread, I don't really think it is a big deal either way and as I tried to explain, after 10 years of threads entitled 'Why Does My Train Stop?' then you can see why they chose this direction.

LOL Yeah, that was me. ;) But now I know how it works I would like to have this all enabled by default. But well, okay, I will have to get used to using control-Enter.

BTW To disable this because new users might not get it is er... stupid. If Dovetail would have added detailed information about these systems in the manual they could have these options on by default (or allow us to set it on by default) and no one would have moaned about it. With this odd logic you might as well disable all yellow lights because a lot of new users don't understand the yellow lights either. In fact, why not disable everything and only keep the passenger mode enabled... ;)

In short: the problem here isn't the new user but the manual. They call this a sim so you'd expect them to add a lot, if not all, realistic systems. Dumbing things down for new users is stupid: teaching new users how things work is wise.

[LeadCatcher]

Originally posted by J van E:

Originally posted by DPSimulation:

Pretty certain it was the same author of this thread. :D

Like I said in the other thread, I don't really think it is a big deal either way and as I tried to explain, after 10 years of threads entitled 'Why Does My Train Stop?' then you can see why they chose this direction.

LOL Yeah, that was me. ;) But now I know how it works I would like to have this all enabled by default. But well, okay, I will have to get used to using control-Enter.

BTW To disable this because new users might not get it is er... stupid. If Dovetail would have added detailed information about these systems in the manual they could have these options on by default (or allow us to set it on by default) and no one would have moaned about it. With this odd logic you might as well disable all yellow lights because a lot of new users don't understand the yellow lights either. In fact, why not disable everything and only keep the passenger mode enabled... ;)

In short: the problem here isn't the new user but the manual. They call this a sim so you'd expect them to add a lot, if not all, realistic systems. Dumbing things down for new users is stupid: teaching new users how things work is wise.

I agree with the premise of your arguement -- but the track record (excuse the pun) is that most will never read the manual and start endless number of threads like "Why does train stop automatically" to the deteriment of the franchise -- just pop over the the TS forums and take a look at all the threads that cover subject matter that is covered in the manuals. Granted for TS some manuals are much better than others -- but even the locomotives with the best documentation will have questions or complaints on how systems work or don't work from those who haven't read them.

I do feel the manuals for TSW can be greatly improved over their current state and hope they are -

[IrLosin]

I think that security systems are off by default in RL. They shut everything down when they end the day and start it up the next day, much like an air plane or even a truck. I actually would like to have a total cold start, I like to set everything up. There is a simple solution for this: Easy mode everything is on by default including the engine but minus the security systems. Simulation mode: the train is cold and dark and YOU have to set it up. Look at a game like Project cars, before you start there are 3 difficulty levels to choose and your choice determines the help or lack of it the game gives you.

[Martin Heidfield]

Originally posted by J van E:

In short: the problem here isn't the new user but the manual. They call this a sim so you'd expect them to add a lot, if not all, realistic systems. Dumbing things down for new users is stupid: teaching new users how things work is wise.

Pretty true. We know it from flight simulation: if I buy new aircraft I start read manual and learn. With PMDG 737 one winter sunday I lay all day in bed and studied manual :-D ...this is not against DTG, I really like TSW but its good to get short explanation about locos and trains systems for beginners like me.

[J van E]

Originally posted by LeadCatcher:

I agree with the premise of your arguement -- but the track record (excuse the pun) is that most will never read the manual

May be true for most gamers but people who are used to simming do know that reading a manual is a wise thing to do. As dene said:

Originally posted by dene:

Pretty true. We know it from flight simulation: if I buy new aircraft I start read manual and learn. With PMDG 737 one winter sunday I lay all day in bed and studied manual :-D ...this is not against DTG, I really like TSW but its good to get short explanation about locos and trains systems for beginners like me.

This! I am a flight simmer and the manual I got with my A2A Comanche, so with only ONE plane, which compared to a PMDG 737 is extremely easy to get to grips with, kicks the TSW manual out of the water. Big time. No comparison. I mean, take a look at this:

https://app.box.com/shared/static/oe1mfcp41784fbjrpxum4bk3at1zqaq2.zip

...and compare that with the TSW manual. But well, I promised not to keep moaning about the manual so I'll leave it at this LOL In the end, thanks to all you guys and gals (and some Wikipedia links) I am in (almost) total control of the sim now.

Originally posted by LUN4T1C:

I think that security systems are off by default in RL. They shut everything down when they end the day and start it up the next day, much like an air plane or even a truck. I actually would like to have a total cold start, I like to set everything up. There is a simple solution for this: Easy mode everything is on by default including the engine but minus the security systems. Simulation mode: the train is cold and dark and YOU have to set it up. Look at a game like Project cars, before you start there are 3 difficulty levels to choose and your choice determines the help or lack of it the game gives you.

Off in RL, ok, if that is so, I could live with it. Two questions regarding what you said:

1. how do I enable AWS in the 3D cab of the 166? I can only enable DSD (in the top let corner) and it also seems to turn on AWS but I was wondering if these two systems are linked in real life too?

2. The manual explains how to start the 166 from cold and dark but at least during services never let us do that, not even when I pick the first morning drive from the depot! Do you ever get to start a train from cold and dark? (Or only in scenarios maybe?)

[Martin Heidfield]

Originally posted by J van E:

1. how do I enable AWS in the 3D cab of the 166? I can only enable DSD (in the top let corner) and it also seems to turn on AWS but I was wondering if these two systems are linked in real life too?

AWS in 166 is in overhead back panel - there are plenty fuse switch, but only one (in the middle of top line) is activ. If you switch it and than move with reverser will start activation sound what cancel with Q or yellow button on the head-on instrument panel.

[J van E]

Originally posted by dene:

Originally posted by J van E:

1. how do I enable AWS in the 3D cab of the 166? I can only enable DSD (in the top let corner) and it also seems to turn on AWS but I was wondering if these two systems are linked in real life too?

AWS in 166 is in overhead back panel - there are plenty fuse switch, but only one (in the middle of top line) is activ. If you switch it and than move with reverser will start activation sound what cancel with Q or yellow button on the head-on instrument panel.

Ah, cool, thanks! I like doing things as much as possible in the 3D cab itself! :)

[nickhawk]

AWS:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1138880646

DSD:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1138880989

;)

[LeadCatcher]

Originally posted by J van E:

Originally posted by LeadCatcher:

I agree with the premise of your arguement -- but the track record (excuse the pun) is that most will never read the manual

May be true for most gamers but people who are used to simming do know that reading a manual is a wise thing to do.

I was speaking of the people that play simulations :-) -- I read the manuals as well but Dene and I are probably in the minority of those who purchase simulations as is evident from the re-occuring questions in most forums. a fun exercise would be to go to any forum and search for the term 'RTFM' and see how many times it occurs.

I would also like to see the simulation come with two modes -- casual for those just starting into the simulation with warning devices off, engine started and the HUDS all switched on - and the expert mode with cold and dark being the start point. This works very well in the flight simulation community.

[CaptHart]

Originally posted by J van E:

[

...

In short: the problem here isn't the new user but the manual. They call this a sim so you'd expect them to add a lot, if not all, realistic systems. Dumbing things down for new users is stupid: teaching new users how things work is wise.

J van E,

I hear you constantly repeating how poor the manual is but the following lines are copied STRAIGHT FROM THE MANUAL under the BR class 166 start up instructions:

6. The train starts with all safety systems disabled, to activate them, locate the
controls at the upper left console from the driving position and on the Micro-
Circuit Breaker panel behind the driving position. The train is fitted with
Automatic Warning System (AWS), Train Protection and Warning System
(TPWS), Driver Vigilance Device (DSD) and Driver Reminder Appliance (DRA)
systems. The relevant controls will therefore become enabled upon activating
the system.
7. On enabling the AWS system, this will also enable the TPWS system as
both systems are interlinked. A self-test will commence and you will need to
acknowledge the alert to proceed. Press the Q key on your keyboard to do so.
8. On enabling the DSD system, you will hear an alert periodically that you will
need to acknowledge using the Q key. If you do not react quickly enough, the
train will commence an emergency brake application.
9. If the DRA is enabled, press the button to deactivate the system. The DRA
system, when activated, will disable the throttle control, you will not be able to
apply power until the system has been deactivated.

What didn't you understand after reading that in the manual?

[J van E]

Originally posted by Cormedan:

What didn't you understand after reading that in the manual?

Fair point. If you read through this as a newbie for the first time you have no clue what this is all about and those unexplained terms throw you off a bit so you simply don't register important remarks like where the controls are. I think the problem here also is that not everything is explained, like AWS or how to acknowledge alerts in the 3D cab. Now I know everything I completely understand the part you quoted but when I read it first I simply didn't. But as I said, you have a fair point because there is more info there than I actually thought there was. I guess I should have reread the manual a few more times, also after actually playing the game some more. My bad.

Still, I do miss things like an explanation of AWS and what some knobs, buttons and switches are for, and even the entire HUD is not explained, but as I posted (elsewhere) I will stop moaning about the manual now.